Posts by slimboyfat

42

Predictions for the next decade?

by jehovaxx in

as it’s nearly the new year my prediction over the next decade or so will see the sense of urgency dwindle.

then some huge huge changes.

for example by 2034 in a decades time, they will have address the 1914 issue and will come out and say we can’t be dogmatic.

slimboyfat

Yes, that’s correct. Some of the reduction in number of congregations is a reduction in foreign language congregations that were deemed not viable. Some of it was also a consolidation in KHs in response to the financial troubles Watchtower experienced around 2015.

All numbers are subject to redefinition over time. This is a feature of statistics in general not just Watchtower statistics. A publisher today isn’t the same as 20 years ago and the same goes for other measures. Even an attender at the memorial isn’t the same today because Zoom attenders are now counted.

Nevertheless it remains the case that JW numbers, taken as a whole, compare very favourably with most other churches in western countries. There are 9 million JWs today compared with 6 million 25 years ago. There are 240,000 members of the Church of Scotland compared with 600,000 25 years ago. Whatever way you look at it that indicates significant growth of JWs and significant decline of the Church of Scotland. In the west most churches are declining like the Church of Scotland and few match the growth of JWs.

Scenic View you ask what I think of the generation teaching? I think it’s nonsense, obviously. That doesn’t change the fact that JWs are still growing contrary to your comments. Just because you or I might wish JWs to decline doesn’t make it so. There’s no point pretending that JWs are “losing badly” when the facts are the opposite. What’s the point of denying reality? Or impugning the motives of others who don’t go along with denying reality?

42

Predictions for the next decade?

by jehovaxx in

as it’s nearly the new year my prediction over the next decade or so will see the sense of urgency dwindle.

then some huge huge changes.

for example by 2034 in a decades time, they will have address the 1914 issue and will come out and say we can’t be dogmatic.

slimboyfat

Do you think the religion census is also lying when it reports finding 3 million JWs in the United States? And the censuses in Brazil, Mexico, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and elsewhere that find far higher numbers of JWs than the official Watchtower count?

25 years is the time comparison you chose on the previous page when claiming JWs are losing badly

There are 700 more congregations worldwide compared with 10 years ago, that’s not much growth but it is growth

42

Predictions for the next decade?

by jehovaxx in

as it’s nearly the new year my prediction over the next decade or so will see the sense of urgency dwindle.

then some huge huge changes.

for example by 2034 in a decades time, they will have address the 1914 issue and will come out and say we can’t be dogmatic.

slimboyfat

9 million is a very conservative estimate of the number of JWs because most other methods of counting find far higher numbers of JWs. For example Watchtower claims only 1.2 million JW publishers in the United States whereas the US religion census cited above found 3 million JW adherents in the United States. The same pattern holds in other countries where censuses regularly produce far higher numbers of JWs than the official publisher count.

The congregation that I attended for over 30 years is gone now, dissolved, and no, a new congregation was not started as some Witnesses would have you believe. Attendance got so low at that congregation, and at a second English congregation using the same hall, that they had to be combined. This is happening all over the world.

The number of congregations has also increased significantly since 25 years ago. There were 90,000 congregations in 2000 and 118,000 in 2024. So while some congregations may not have increased and multiplied this is the overall trend worldwide.

42

Predictions for the next decade?

by jehovaxx in

as it’s nearly the new year my prediction over the next decade or so will see the sense of urgency dwindle.

then some huge huge changes.

for example by 2034 in a decades time, they will have address the 1914 issue and will come out and say we can’t be dogmatic.

slimboyfat

Thanks dropoffyourkeylee

I think I spotted a mistake on that report. It gives the number of JW congregations in the US in 2010 as 5000. That’s not correct. It also results in an inaccurate figure for the increase in JW congregations between 2010 and 2020. The reason for the mistake seems to be that the 2010 relies on a different source for the number of congregations than the 2020 report. The 2020 report gives the official JW number of congregations. I do not know where the 2010 figure was derived. Perhaps it’s the number of Kingdom Halls?

42

Predictions for the next decade?

by jehovaxx in

as it’s nearly the new year my prediction over the next decade or so will see the sense of urgency dwindle.

then some huge huge changes.

for example by 2034 in a decades time, they will have address the 1914 issue and will come out and say we can’t be dogmatic.

slimboyfat

For the last 25 years or so the Watchtower Organization has been fighting an enemy it never saw coming ... the internet ... and it is losing badly.

Number of JWs 25 years ago - 6 million

Number of JWs now - 9 million

If that’s losing then it’s a kind of losing most churches would give their right arm for.

Number of members of the Church of Scotland 25 years ago - 600,000

Number of members of the Church of Scotland now - 240,000

35

1/2 of the Jehovah’s witnesses have gone

by hoser in

jw
friends

there are 1/2 of the jehovah’s witnesses that there were 30 years ago in my area.

some have left but i think that many have died and none of their kids stayed being jehovah’s witnesses.

7 congregations have been dissolved over the years.

slimboyfat

In my area it’s pretty similar

Congregation had about 55 about attendance 30 years ago and about the same 55 now

District convention had about 9000 now about 8000 or 9000, not much difference

There are the same number of congregation around 115

A lot of the original people died and a lot more are immigrants now compared with 30 years ago but in terms of numbers pretty similar

40

Zechariah 12:10 Corruption in the NWT

by Sea Breeze in

here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.

why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.

zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .

slimboyfat

Personally I believe that everybody will be saved in the end. I think Russell was closer to this position than modern JWs although he certainly denied being a universalist. Why do I think everyone will be saved? Because Jehovah is good and wants it to be so and has the power to make it so. When anyone disobeys God it is always based on a misunderstanding of what is right and how one should behave. As these barriers are removed everyone will be reconciled with God. This is taught many places such as 1 Cor 15, Romans, 2 Peter.

40

Zechariah 12:10 Corruption in the NWT

by Sea Breeze in

here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.

why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.

zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .

slimboyfat

Hi no-zombie that’s interesting. I remember for a while Ray Franz was selling a book called Paul’s Idea of Community: The Early Christian House Churches by Robert Banks, which made an argument along the lines you indicate. Some who leave JWs go down that root, which is not only closer to early Christianity, but closer to the early Bible Students too. In some ways the Christadelphians are similar to the early Bible Students in structure. What Christadelphians gain in congregational autonomy they lose in unity and effectiveness. Consider that in the early 1940s there were around 100,000 of both JWs and Christadelphains, and after more than 80 years of tighter control among JWs and maintained autonomy among Christadelphian ecclesias, there are now only around 50,000 Christadelphians worldwide whereas there are nearly 10 million JWs.

On archaeology and early Christianity I recently got the book Studying the New Testament Through Inscriptions: An Introduction by Clint Burnett. Among other things, he argues that 1st century inscriptions indicate that the title “Lord” for Jesus was connected to his claim to the Davidic throne and not the later Trinitarian idea of divinity.

There’s no doubt that the GB make many mistakes but does that disqualify them from being used by God? When you consider the kinds of mistakes that Moses, David, Paul and Peter made, and the problems in the early churches in Corinth and the churches in Revelation, are the problems of modern JWs in many ways not similar to those?

40

Zechariah 12:10 Corruption in the NWT

by Sea Breeze in

here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.

why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.

zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .

slimboyfat

I notice Robert Alter agrees with the NWT on Zechariah 12.10.

No-Zombie I’ve got some of the same books you mention. I wonder if you’re aware of the new book about palaeography by Brent Nongbri “Working With Manuscripts” that was released this year. The paperback version is due out in a few days. His earlier book “God’s Library” is good too.

40

Zechariah 12:10 Corruption in the NWT

by Sea Breeze in

here's a question for those who still support watchtower on this forum.

why did watchtower leave out the word "me" in zech.

zechariah 12:10 reads like this: .

slimboyfat

The verse is totally understandable from a biblical monotheism perspective either way. Clearly God himself was pierced by the death of his only Son. Or it could be referring directly to the death of God’s Son making the Son the one who was pierced. Either one makes perfect sense. What is total nonsense is to say that the verse contains some esoteric reference to the 4th century doctrine of the trinity implying that God and his Son are consubstantial and all that.