slimboyfat

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Posts by slimboyfat

• 
  192

  Question for SBF

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.

  can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?

  - this thread is your if you want it..

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  slimboyfat

  I don't want Watchtower to fail. I'm hoping that an existential crisis will be what prompts JWs to reform and transform into the kind of organisation many hope for. I think it can happen. Oroborius1 used to maintain a website about transformation, but it's not there any more now that I search for it.
• 
  192

  Question for SBF

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.

  can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?

  - this thread is your if you want it..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  I'm getting brighter and brighter. ;-)
• 
  192

  Question for SBF

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.

  can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?

  - this thread is your if you want it..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  The second one, as explained above.
• 
  192

  Question for SBF

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.

  can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?

  - this thread is your if you want it..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  I would like to see them try to tithe.

  My first post on the thread said 10 or 20 years until real crisis, that's not exactly imminent.

  I don't say they have a deficit just because Lett says so, but because the circumstances indicate it, and their actions confirm it.

  Still waiting for some sort of explanation for how Watchtower will make up for their previous income from publishing. So far he suggestions have been that they will charge for access to the website or else they will tithe the membership. I doubt they would try either, or it would work if they did.

  My best guess is the'll cut back to nearly nothing (staff of 200 or something ridiculous) and hope for the best. Get brothers to produce the website from home for free.

  But cutbacks on such a scale may cause a downward spiral of congregations and membership. That's why I don't think a disorderly collapse is out of the question.
• 
  192

  Question for SBF

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.

  can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?

  - this thread is your if you want it..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  Aha so it is. My mistake. Time will tell how robust it is.
• 
  22

  Approximately how many JW have left permanently?

  by longgone in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i did try a search before posting this question and found nothing current.

  pew research -2016 says approximately two thirds of those born into the religion in the united states alone, no longer consider themselves as members.

  (sorry, still don't know how to link, but it's an easy google search.).

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• 

  slimboyfat

  If you count children of JWs who never got baptised then probably there are more former JWs than JWs. But it would be difficult to arrive at an estimate for that number.

  Maybe use the New Zealand census data and extrapolate to worldwide membership.
• 
  192

  Question for SBF

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.

  can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?

  - this thread is your if you want it..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  Are you sure it isn't sewn Athanasius? (My copy says first printing 2013, made in the United States of America, on the reverse title page) If it's not sewn then it's made to look as if it is. The songbook is glued.

  Click on image to see close up of binding on this page.

  http://candhbookbinding.com/Extra-Ribbon-Marker-Insert-for-Grey-Standard-Size-New-World-Translation-Bible-p411.html

  Maybe the rNWT isn't up to the standard of some Bible publishers (although it looks pretty good to me) but against the standard of the cheap paperbacks JWs have been printing in recent decades it's a step up and must have been relatively expensive to produce.

  Contrast it with the cheap paperback NWT you describe coming across on this thread.

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/181035/cost-cutting-new-world-translation-now-soft-cover-paperback-mormon-style

  And they describe taking care to make sure they last here.

  https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/2015-yearbook/highlights/bible-made-to-last/
  
• 
  22

  Approximately how many JW have left permanently?

  by longgone in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i did try a search before posting this question and found nothing current.

  pew research -2016 says approximately two thirds of those born into the religion in the united states alone, no longer consider themselves as members.

  (sorry, still don't know how to link, but it's an easy google search.).

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  I don't think there can be more former JWs than active JWs because, that would need to mean the annual increase, plus 1% of active JWs, would be less than half the number baptised each year. But that is not the case for most years.

  If JWs start to decline overall however, it could change rapidly, the number of former JWs could quickly outnumber active JWs.
• 
  192

  Question for SBF

  by Fisherman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.

  can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?

  - this thread is your if you want it..

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  Incognito thanks for some contrary views. Let me counter them. ;-)

  I mean the new Bible must be a large expense because they are good quality Bibles and the material to produce them must be relatively expensive. At a time when they've stopped publishing most if not all hardbacks due to cost, it really stands out as a quality publication. (They even experimented with cheap paperback Bibles for a short period) Plus simply the fact that it's a new edition means that every JW needs one or two new copies, plus inactive ones, plus anyone else who wants a new one. I think it must have been pretty expensive. And now rolling it out to other languages is another huge expense it seems difficult to avoid.

  You say they made one or two billion dollars from Brooklyn property, but that's not an inexhaustible sum. Especially when you consider they've spend just under quarter of a billion dollars on missionaries, travelling overseers and special pioneers a year. On top of that you've got printing, bethel staff, property maintenance, legal fees, web technology and whatever. Their overall running expenses could easily be more than a billion dollars a year. So if they made one or two billion from property, after you subtract the cost of the new HQ, it doesn't stretch that far if there's a major deficit.

  Stephen Lett said there is an ongoing deficit. He also let slip that income from sale of property was being used to meet running costs. They can only do that for so long before they run out. I don't think they're in the luxurious position of being able to put money aside to live from the investment. The scale and rapidity of cuts in the last two years indicate an organisation that is fighting for survival.

  You didn't mention the cost of looking after retired COs, subsidising poor countries on the basis of declining membership in rich countries, abuse claim payouts, declining donations from disaffected membership.
• 
  22

  Approximately how many JW have left permanently?

  by longgone in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i did try a search before posting this question and found nothing current.

  pew research -2016 says approximately two thirds of those born into the religion in the united states alone, no longer consider themselves as members.

  (sorry, still don't know how to link, but it's an easy google search.).

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  slimboyfat

  In principle it's possible to work out a good rough estimate for this.

  Choose a starting date such as 1945.

  Add the starting number and all baptisms since that date together, minus 1% each year for deaths, and finally subtract the current number of active JWs from that total.

  Has anyone done it?

  Paul Grundy has done most of the work for this calculation but not the final calculation itself as far as I know.

  https://jwfacts.com/watchtower/statistics.php
  

  My guess is the calculation would show there are nearly as many former JWs as there are active JWs.

  And I suspecf that former JWs will outnumber active JWs very soon.