Posts by bjc2012

5

Alliwannadoislive--HELP!

by LDH in

ps - i'm still upset about the 'new understanding' of the image of the beast falling into and ascending back out of the abyss - roman empire / third reich - cor that was page turning stuff of paperback proportions .... what new understanding!?!?!?!.

lisa

bjc2012

dungbeetle,

When the "scarlet-colored wild beast" attacks the religious harlot, "the disgusting thing" will be standing in a menacing way in Christendom's so-called holy place. So desolation will begin on faithless Christendom, which portrays itself as holy.

Interesting quote! Of course, they do not take into consideration that the verse does not say the 'disgusting thing' would stand in a 'so-called holy place' or a place which 'portrays itself as holy.' It simply says 'a holy place,' a place which God recognizes as holy, which they claim to be. The GB makes a practice of re-wording verses when they want to take the heat off of themselves.

17

Present the truth as taught by the Master!

by Bill Parker in

jw
friends

but when called upon to support their beliefs with scripture they are unable to present a solid scriptural discussion that cannot be refuted.. a case in point is the belief of the trinity doctrine.

still another is the belief in torment in a fiery place called hell.

how did he say that we should worship his father jehovah?

bjc2012

Bill:

BJC: You asked: "How do we know the Bible writers were inspired."

Please check this quote again. I think you have me mixed up with someone else. These are not my words. I am a firm believer in the Divine Inspiration of God's Word. (2 Timothy 3:16, 17)

Peace,

bjc

17

Present the truth as taught by the Master!

by Bill Parker in

jw
friends

but when called upon to support their beliefs with scripture they are unable to present a solid scriptural discussion that cannot be refuted.. a case in point is the belief of the trinity doctrine.

still another is the belief in torment in a fiery place called hell.

how did he say that we should worship his father jehovah?

bjc2012

Hi Bill:

In 2 Peter 1: 19-21 we learn this: “So we have confirmation of what was said in prophecies and you will be right to depend on prophecy and take it as a lamp for lighting a way through the dark until the dawn comes and the morning star rises rises in your minds. At the same time we must be most careful to remember that the interpretation of scriptural prophecy is never a matter for the individual. Why? Because no prophecy ever came from man’s initiative. When men spoke for God it was the Holy Spirit that moved them.”

This is a quote from the "Jerusalem Bible", and it is a very good one.

The "Today's English Version" similarly conveys the same thought of the "Jerusalem Bible's" translation of 2 Peter 1:19-21 by saying,

"So we are even more confident of the message proclaimed by the prophets. You will do well to pay attention to it, because it is like a lamp shining in a dark place, until the Day dawns and the light of the morning star shines in your hearts. Above all else, however, remember this: NO ONE CAN EXPLAIN, BY HIMSELF, a prophecy in the Scriptures. For no prophetic message ever came just from the will of man, but men were carried along by the Holy Spirit as they spoke the message that came from God." (2 Peter 1:19-21 Today's English Version)

This part, "NO ONE [no UNINSPIRED human] can explain, by himself, a prophecy."

No human "by himself", or without Divine Help or inspiration, can "explain" Bible prophecy.

And yet, so many today, as in the past continue to try. They try to explain Bible prophecy, WITHOUT claiming Divine inspiration. But as could be expected, they always fail. Just as the WTS did. They claimed also to be uninspired, but "spirit-directed". Still, uninspired by God. And they failed miserably in their "interpretations" of Bible prophecy.

The Jerusalem Bible renders that critical portion of 2 Peter 1:19-21,

"At the same time we must be most careful to remember that the interpretation of scriptural prophecy is NEVER A MATTER FOR THE INDIVIDUAL. Why?"

Why? This is a good question.

This is because the "Prophetic Word" is itself inspired by God, and thus must be "INTERPRETED" by one who is likewise "inspired" by God.

If attempted by man without Divine Help, mortal man without "INSPIRATION," then would find the task, impossible -- beyond the scope of mortal men.

This is why, one who is himself, inspired by God, must then come to mankind and explain it. In other words, "that which is complete" must arrive and explain it to "truth-seekers" upon earth. The personification of the "spirit of truth," must arrive and "guide us into ALL TRUTH," even though we know he will not be "received" favorably at all by the "world". (1 Cor. 13:10; John 14:17; 16:7,8, 13)

This person, will be "inspired" by God to present this message of hope.

So it is not just a matter of this person being "anointed". Just being "anointed" alone, will not be enough by itself. But in addition to his being "anointed", the same as individuals were of the first century congregation, but in addition to this, he would also have to have certain "GIFTS OF THE SPIRIT". He would have the "gift" of interpreting "inspired utterances" or prophecies.

He would have to have this particular ability to correctly intrepret Bible Prophecy for God's servants today. A unique God-given ability that is far beyond and far surpasses any human ability known to mankind today to finally, fully interpret the Holy "Prophets" & Sacred Writings of God, just as Jesus did while on earth. (Luke 24:27) In this way, Jehovah God becomes, uniquely the "God of the inspired expressions of the Holy Prophets" of old. Jehovah becomes The "Revealer" of His great "sacred secret" or "mystery of God," well-hidden within the much overlooked, "good news" or "gospel" of the "prophetic scriptures" of old. (Acts 3:21; Revelation 22:6; Romans 16:25, 26; Revelation 10:7)

Divine Inspiration is absolutely needed, in its complete sense as 2 Peter 1:19-21 shows. That is the point of these verses.

It is also the main point of 1 Corinthians 12:10 which shows, among other things, an itemization of the "gifts of the spirit" given out among first century christians. Included on that sacred list of "gifts" is the God-given unique ability of,

"...Discernment of inspired utterances..." (1 Corinthians 12:10)

That's "Discernment" or Interpretation of Divinely "inspired utterances". Prophetic messages from God.

This is a most unique and special "gift" from God, granted only to those who are already "anointed" by His Spirit. A "gift" to the already "anointed" of God. A special "gift" to "Discern" or "interpret" inspired utterances or prophetic sayings, originally inspired by Himself.

Thus, since "inspiration" is definitely involved in the Divine "interpretation" given to mankind, this being the case, then it can be only said that "God" uniquely, is the only real "interpreter" of His Words or prophetic messages of old. Ordinary man, no matter how sincere, no matter how diligent, no matter how much he studies, how much he prays, how much he meditates, and on and on, still, ordinary man, does not possess the capability to correctly interpret prophetic messages of God. Its just that simple. That is the main point of 2 Peter 1:19-21 itself.

It becomes just as Joseph said long ago,

"Do not interpretations BELONG TO GOD?" (Genesis 40:8)

Humbly, Joseph realized, that although he was used by God to interpret Pharaoh's dreams, nevertheless, it was really Jehovah, that truly made the actual "interpretation" itself. God did this. And Joseph wanted no credit for this at all.

The bible account of Pharaoh and Joseph illustrates this.

"Then Pharaoh said to Joseph I have dreamed a dream, but there is no interpreter of it. Now I myself have heard it said about you that you can hear a dream and interpret it. At this Joseph answered pharaoh, saying: I NEED NOT BE CONSIDERED! God will announce welfare to Pharaoh." [literally "Without me God will Announce!"] (Genesis 41:15, 16)

So, "interpretations" of Prophecy and Holy Scripture "belong to God", only. Therefore when it comes to His Inspired Word and Prophetic Messages, the Almighty must then "interpret", He must "inspire" someone to interpret, so that when it does becomes known to mankind the fulfillments of Holy messages, then it must be also realized that it is only He, that is to be considered, truly the "Revealer of Secrets". And no man can claim such at all. Man has no part in this. (Daniel 2:28, 29, 47)

Therefore, that is why it is absolutely impossible for man, on his own, to correctly interpret the Prophetic Words of the scriptures. God must cause this to happen, miraculously, when the "spirit of truth" arrives, which as John said, must "proceed from the Father". (John 15:26)

That "one" in whom God will use in this "capacity" has been identified for us within the prophetic messages of long ago, as being the one clearly spoken of in Ezekiel 44:1-3.

bjc

Ezekiel's Mystery "Chieftain" Link:

. http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=10030&site=3

20

AidAfrique and the UN

by Kent in

zambia daily mail .

thursday, june 17, 1999-07-08. french ngo officials jet in.

to help congo dr refugees.

bjc2012

Hello Lookin,

...trying to make sense of what is not spiritual but physical, wanting truth and not excuses.

I understand. Please try this link out to what I think is some revealing information and see if it all comes together and makes sense after reading.

My e-mail is listed if you want to converse further on the topic.

>>> http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=11937&site=3

Hope this helps.

bjc

5

Pearl of Great Value

by LateRain in

jehovah is the creator and deliverer of his people.. this is recognized and stated in his forth commandment.. ex20:8-11;de5:15. the sabbath was observed before the.

ten commandments ex16:23. the principle was introduced .

in the garden of eden ge 2:2,3. apparently the knowledge.

bjc2012

Hi Late Rain:

I enjoyed your comments above. One thought in particular stood out to me that bears repeating.

For seventy years now the organization has worn God's personal
name like a school flag. Every personal disgrace and now every
organizational scandal drags that name right down in the mud
with it. Israel didn't even do that. And it has been too haughty
to give him his Sabbath. The child molestation expose and the UN
harlotry revelation are the beginning of woes. The kingdom has
overtaken WT but is still among you. This new wine must have a
new wineskin. It is prepared. -- Christian Freedom Movement

I agree fully and have made numerous postings on this discussion board like yours above. I think we have something very important in common.

Please check out the following info posted a few weeks ago by a friend.

------post by MDS-----

70 YEARS OF "DECLARING" THE SACRED NAME COMPLETED -- OCTOBER 1931-2001

After the resolution was adopted to be called & named "Jehovah's Witnesses" as a spiritual nation in July of 1931, it took some time for all of JWs worldwide to get the same information, and resolutely "adopt" it as written, since they were scattered in many different parts of the earth.

Here is a quote from a publication printed by the WTS that tells exactly how the "historic" adoption was carried out to an earthwide family of JWs scattered thru-out the earth.

"Needless to say, this resolution was joyously acclaimed by all present [original convention w/Rutherford], and, in the WEEKS THAT FOLLOWED, AT FIFTY EXTENSION CONVENTIONS IN ALL PARTS OF THE EARTH Jehovah's people met to add their joyful voices in the embracing of this remarkable NEW NAME." -- See "Jehovah's Witnesses In The Divine Purpose" page 126, par. #1.

So reasonably, it took some time for all of this to be accomplished thru-out the earth, on a global scale.

In accepting the above "resolution", we must remember it is the singular act of "declaring God Name" to others that brings on the real responsibility before God Almighty. After adopting this new name and designation for themselves, JWs must now continually be found "Living Up to the Name," as one of the older "Kingdom Songs" sung by all JWs worldwide says.

Jehovah's Witness began doing this, "boasting in the Name" of God, and "declaring the Name" of God, by way of the publication called, "The Kingdom The Hope of the World," which was released in October 1931. Also, in this publication, contained the original "resolution" about the New Name Jehovah's Witnesses had adopted worldwide. They had now began, to "preach the Name" of God to others. -- Psalms 105:1-3; 2 Tim. 2:19

Here is what the WTS had to say about the actual beginning of their exercising this rare privilege of "Declaring the Name" of God as a united spiritual nation of people, using this new release called "The Kingdom The Hope of the World" thru out the earth. -- Genesis 12:8; Exodus 33:19; 34:5

"In order that the leaders of the world might be duly notified of this proper designation for Jehovah's people this resolution and the text of Brother Rutherford's convention address were published in the booklet "The Kingdom The Hope of the World." Included was another resolution adopted at the convention, again indicting Christendom for her apostasy and for treating Jehovah's counsel with contempt, and proclaiming: "The hope of the world is God's kingdom, and there is no other hope." During October of that year a campaign was conducted by the congregations to visit every clergyman, politician and big businessman in their territories with this booklet. In just the United States and Canada 132,066 booklets were put out in this way. Within the next few months this booklet reached the homes of FIVE MILLION others in all parts of the earth." -- See "Jehovah's Witnesses In The Divine Purpose," page 126 par. #2.

Jehovah's Witnesses began their historic "Preaching" and "Declaring" of God's Sacred Name in October 1931...Exactly 70 Years ago...70 Years of Discipline & Training...70 Years of holding a "sacred trust", being "called by God's Name" and possessing the "framework of the knowledge of the truth." The sacred trust that serves to "sanctify" them, as a consecrated nation to do God's Will. -- See Numbers 6:27; Romans 2:20; John 17:17.

Jehovah's Witnesses, in October 1931, became...the spiritual nation of "Israel" of Bible Prophecy. A people who would have to endure severe discipline for open rebellion & disobedience to God...being chased off their land, their spiritual "inheritance." A people who would have to be changed spiritually, from a "land of Decoration" which falls off into "apostasy," to finally, a "Mountain of Decoration," a spiritually elavated plateau. A people who, after severe discipline from God, would be granted the privilege of "dwelling in the center [navel] of the earth." -- Daniel 8:13; 11:32, 41, 45; Isaiah 30:26; Jeremiah 23:19, 20; Micah 4:6,7; Ezekiel 37:23; 38:8-12

-------end of info----

As time permits, please contact me by e-mail as soon as possible.

Thanks.

bjc

14

Biblical Test for a Prophet

by Treborr Jones in

jw
friends

the test for a prophet is found in deuteronomy 18:20-22. .

this scripture teaches that a prophet must be tested by checking his prophecies.

jesus said, "beware of false prophets which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

bjc2012

Proplog2,

You've taken these verses out of context. The part of verse 9 that you did not quote is important in understanding why Jehovah would fool a prophet. It says: "...and I will stretch out my hand against him and annihilate him from the midst of my people Israel." Why would Jehovah fool the prophet then destroy him? Does it not have something to do with this prophet's, as well as the people's, relationship with Jehovah? Verse 3 reads: "Son of man these men have brought up their dungy idols upon their heart, and the stumbling block causing their error they have put in front of their faces. Shall I be inquired of at all by them?" Here we have a prophet inquiring of Jehovah on behalf of a people who have left him, or as this verses says 'they have brought up their dungy idols' (you might want to look up the word 'dungy' to see what it means), and this prophet is not aware that this condition exists? He's just asking to be fooled by Jehovah.

Verse 7 is more explicit. It reads: "For any man at all from the house of Israel or from the alien residents that reside as aliens in Israel, that withdraws himself from following me and that brings up his dungy idols upon his heart and that sets the very stumbling block causing his error in front of his face and that actually comes to the prophet to make inquiry for himself by me, I, Jehovah, I am letting myself be brought to answer him by myself."

No, Jehovah does not fool his true prophets, those who are sticking close to his word.

bjc

56

On STUMBLING BLOCKS

by You Know in

jw
friends

just a few loose ends and random thoughts for a select group of readers who have not been completely defrauded of your faith.. on the topic of stumbling: stumbling typically involves the mistakes of others whether real or perceived.

the reason jehovah does not consider any stumbling block as a valid reason for abandoning ones faith is because a persons faith should be in jehovah and christ in the first place.

and since god most assuredly did not let his worshipper down, what a fellow believer does or does not do should have no bearing upon our personal relationship with our heavenly father.

bjc2012

You Know:

From my standpoint, this is one of the most significant events as far as the fulfillment of Bible prophecy is concerned. I seriously doubt if the brothers involved even have any idea of the trap that they have stepped in. That’s the nature of traps and stumbling blocks. On the other hand, it may well be the work of plants, who, by their smooth words, have deliberately sabotaged the Society without anyone being quite aware of the extent. At any rate, there is more reason now than ever before for Jehovah's loyal ones to anticipate a total house cleaning. That, of course, is exactly what Christ promises to do when he arrives for his final inspection. / You Know

Here is the Bible Prophecy that Christ is concerned about, the one you refuse to see.

"In that day you [Israel] will not be ashamed because of all your dealings with which you transgressed against me, for then I shall REMOVE FROM THE MIDST OF YOU YOUR HAUGHTILY EXULTANT ONES ; and you will never again be haughty in my Holy Mountain." (Zephaniah 3:11)

What you do not want to see is that God "removes" all the "haughtily exultant ones" from the congregation. The real culprits. Bible prophecy indicates he identifies the real villians. You refuse to see this.

Jesus, extracts them from the congregation's whole or body. Bible prophecy indicates it is the leaders who by their wicked "dealings" cause Israel to "transgress against" God. They cause Israel (JWs) to sin. It is the Governing Body that commits the "transgression that causes desolation." (Daniel 8:12, 13)

Something you cannot admit.

What you refuse to see, is the "haughtily exultant ones" are the Governing Body of JWs, the "Man of Lawlessness," acting as a "god", "publicly showing himself to be a [rival] god," in God's Temple. (2 Thess. 2:3-12)

You refuse to see the Governing Body are the real presumptuous, haughty ones "in the holy mountain" of God; they are the "haughtily exultant" among JWs.

"And I shall certainly let remain in the midst of you a people humble and lowly, and they will actually take refuge in the name of Jehovah As regards the remaining ones of Israel, they will do no unrighteousness, nor speak a lie, nor will there be found in their mouths a tricky tongue; for they themselves will feed and actually lie stretched out, and there will be no one making them tremble." (Zephaniah 3:12, 13)

It can proven, Jehovah's Witnesses, are following a group of very wicked individuals at Bethel, who categorically teach them to out-and-out "LIE." Its printed in their publications as proof, under the definition of a "lie". They are taught to "lie" in the Name of God, shamelessly, brazenly. They are taught "unrighteousness" Like how to "speak a lie," and misrepresent themselves and the truth, as so-called "Theocratic Strategy", to the "Superior Authorities." For instance, the United Nations Organization, governmental figures and others outside the congregation. Those who have "Relative Authority" over christians, given them by God. Christians are plainly told not to "oppose" nor "take a stand against" these "authorities" lest we become enemies with God. (Romans 13:1,2)

The Governing Body of JWs, lied, openly to those governmental "authorities," the United Nations Organization. And when found out, they "lied" to the congregation and the press, while secretly removing their status as NGOs for the United Nations Organization.

The Governing Body are low-life liars, in God's Name. And, likewise Jehovah's Witnesses are taught to speak with the "mouth of a tricky tongue." They are truly a "tricky tongue" people. Taught that way by the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses.

We can only imagine what God has in store for these miserable, wretched souls who would sully His Great Name. (Jer. 23:19, 20; 30:23, 24)

Only, the "humble" will survive what God has in store for them, for their unrepentant and repeated "lying", speaking untruth, deliberate untruth in His Name.

This is what you, You Know, refuse to see from Bible prophecy.

bjc

99

YK on WT UN NGO STATUS

by You Know in

several posters have asked what i thought of the.

revelations about the wt being associated with the un.

as an ngo so i thought i might make a brief comment on.

bjc2012

Ezekiel's Mystery "Chieftain"/Leader, A Sinner???

We read at Ezekiel 44:1-3 the following mysterious information about a FUTURE Temple of God's making and blessing,

"And he proceeded to bring me back by way of the gate of the Sanctuary, the outer one facing east, and it was shut. Then Jehovah said to me: "As regards this gate, shut is how it will continue. It will not be opened, and no mere man will come in by it; for Jehovah himself, the God of Israel, has come in by it, and it must continue shut. However, the chieftain -- as chieftain he himself will sit in it [the east gate], in order to eat bread before Jehovah. By way of the porch of the gate he will come in, and by way of it he will go out." -- Ezekiel 44:1-3

"And on that day, in his own behalf and in behalf of all the people of the land, the chieftain must provide a young bull as a sin offering." -- Ezekiel 45:22

Who is this mystery "Chieftain." Is it Jesus Christ? Or is it someone else? In the above quoted scripture, he is said to have made a "sin" offering for himself as well as for the people of the nation?

1) Why would Jesus Christ, a perfect, sinless person while on earth, need to do such a thing?

2) Also, is Jesus Christ today, in the form of a "man" who makes earthly sacrifices "for himself," to cover some sin that he may have committed?

3) Jesus dwells in heaven, the bible says, in powerful spirit form. He is not a man, anymore. But the Mystery "Chieftain" is a man. How could this person prove to be Jesus Christ, in human form, offering sacrifices for "sins" he has committed?

Bible scholars answer no. They say it is a man.

The Expositors Bible Commentary Volume 6 (released in 1986) page 974 makes this straightforward comment on the "chieftain's" identity. It says,

"Only the prince was permitted to enter this gate. He must enter and leave by way of the portico from the outer court only. His only function within that gate was to eat bread in the presence of the LORD, but exactly which meal or for what purpose is not stated.

"The identity of this prince has been a puzzle to many. The meaning of the Hebrew word nasi has in itself contributed to the problem. The English word prince connotes royalty. However, the word nasi would best be translated "leader" (cf. E.A. Speiser, "Background and Function of the Biblical Nasi," CBQ 25 [1963]: 111-17). This leader was not the Messiah, because the leader is made a sin offering for himself (cf. 45:22). If the leader" were Jesus Christ, then he, the Messiah, would need cleansing from sin. Such was not possible (cf. Heb 4:15). In addition, this leader had natural children (46:16), another impossibility for the Messiah. The leader was a man."

"The identity of the leader is unknown. He functions as the people's leader in their millennial worship, almost like a high priest, but not having the same role and function." -- Expositors Bible Commentary Volume 6, page 974

The Mystery "Chieftain" is not Jesus Christ. It is some one else. A man.

bjc

99

YK on WT UN NGO STATUS

by You Know in

several posters have asked what i thought of the.

revelations about the wt being associated with the un.

as an ngo so i thought i might make a brief comment on.

bjc2012

Hi Escargot:

And is Christ also the Mystery "Chieftain" of Ezekiel 44:1-3?

bjc

99

YK on WT UN NGO STATUS

by You Know in

several posters have asked what i thought of the.

revelations about the wt being associated with the un.

as an ngo so i thought i might make a brief comment on.

bjc2012

Hi Escargot:

After all things considered, it is my current viewpoint that you have very eloquently put this NGO situation in perspective for those of us who do look toward God and Christ to come and “correct many things.”

Well, instead maybe God or Christ "sends" someone, maybe "Elijah".

"Look! I am sending to you people Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and fear in-inspiring day of Jehovah...in order that I may not come and actually strike the earth with a devoting of it to destruction." -- Malachi 4:5,6

"...Why, then to the scribes say that Elijah must come first? In reply he said: Elijah indeed, is coming and will restore all things." -- Matt. 17:10, 11

Elijah comes first, "restores all things" before Jesus comes.

First spiritual "apostasy" occurs. (Dan. 11:32) Then, Jesus and the apostles by necessity become "judges" in heaven over "Israel", while "Elijah" carries out his "restoration" work toward Israel.

"...In the re-creation ["palingenesis"; spiritual "regeneration", spiritual "rebirth"] when the Son of Man sits down upon his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also yourselves sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel."-- Matt. 19:28

"and that He [God] may send forth the Christ appointed for you, Jesus, whom heaven indeed, must hold within itself until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old time." -- Acts 3:20, 21

Elijah is the mystery "Chieftain" of Ezekiel 44:1-3 that is allowed to "eat bread in the presence" of God.

Here is the link to the Mystery "Chieftain" thread:

>> http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=10030&site=3

Hope this helps.

bjc