Posts by XJW4EVR

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

XJW4EVR
Do you think it's possible that your whole belief structure may be wrong? This is not meant to be condescending in any way but a serious question. Maybe this needs to be on another thread, as I have been meaning to ask believers this for a long time.

Yes, it is possible that what I have come to believe could be wrong. In fact, Christianity is the only religion that gives you a manner in which to disprove it. It says that if Jesus was not resurrected from the dead, then we might as well eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow we die. So the manner in which to disprove Christianity is simple. produce a body that can be conclusively proven as being that of Jesus son of Joseph from Nazareth in Gallilee. Once that body is shown me, then I will know that evrything I have lived for was false, and I'll join the atheists.

Until then, do you really think I and those that believe like me want to be ridiculed by likes of you and the rest of you psuedo-intellectuals here? Do you think we like having the name of our God used as a swear word? Having to constantly fight to keep some semblance of sanity in our families, as you and the rest of try to undermine the values that we want to instill in our families? Do you think we like being told how narrow-minded and bigoted we are, when you and the likes of you do the exact same thing that you accuse us of, namely being a bunch of intolerant bigots that shove your belief systems down our throats? Do you think that people would choose this type of life unless they have become convinced that Jesus still changes lives?

So, it's simple, prove to me that Jesus' body is in a tomb somewhere, and I'll join you in your disdain for religion. Now don't tell me that Jesus never existed, because there is more proof that Jesus of Nazareth existed than there is for the existence of Alexander the Great, or Julius Ceasar.

There you have it, startingover, in a nutshell the manner to disprove Christianity. Show me the bones of Jesus!

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

XJW4EVR
Do you know what "facts" are?

What a typically condescending question! That being said, yes I know what a fact is, especially in a historical context. Do you?

And others beleived it so it must be a fact? I don't think that's makes anything a fact as you know is proven by 6 million JW's

That is not what I said. Nice try, though.

And I am not proselytizing, I have nothing to offer you.

I knew that from the get go, I am glad that you have just realized that.

I am subtly trying to point out that is exactly what you are doing.

What exactly am I doing? Other than pointing out the fallacies in your arguements.

I just wish you and others would stop making me feel like I am missing out on something.

Sure, no problem with that. Of course you and others like you would have quit making me and others like me feel like we are less then intellectual for believing in Jesus.

The problem, is that whatever you wish to call yourself, free-thinker or open-minded or moral relativist, the fact is that the verything you point to Christians for being, intolerant, narrow-minded, etc. the same arguement can be made for you and people that think like you.

The fact is that it is human nature to show people a way that works for them, eg. every self-help book ever published. The real issue is that Christianity says that the problem is us, and that the solution is outside of us. This is something that people don't like, and won't accept.

Now if this is something that makes you feel bad, then there's a very simple solution. Don't involve yourself. I restrain myself on a daily basis from various threads. Either way the choice is really yours.

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

I read your post through a couple of times, and I was left with that question. Hence, why I asked it. Your susequent post clarified it better. I did not see a reason for this statement:

Thinking soundly before writing posts helps me not to overreact!

But hey, that's OK!

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

How about this? I have checked out the facts, and in my opinion they are there. In fact they are overwhelmingly there. This is not only a fact held by me, but by men and women over the history of time that many people would call intelligent and intellectual.

But that's OK, obviously you feel a need to proselytize your beliefs, and you are certainly entitled to that, as we are entitled to share ours.

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

As I read the posts on this thread it irritates me how Jesus is spoken of as fact. To me it's a subtle way of telling everyone else they are wrong.

I read your post, and it irritated me that you imply that Jesus is not a fact. To me it's a subtle way of telling me that I am wrong, as are those that believe. Why are you so narrow-minded?

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

So freetosee, just to be clear, and so that I won't be accused of being too harsh, or not nice enough, are you saying that those of us who have become Christians after leaving the Jay-Dubs have merely exchanged one cult for another?

Think before you answer.

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

OFG, it was funny once, now it's just old.

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

First, Juni, if what I wrote came across to you as harsh, then I am sorry. I was being direct. In the same manner that I percieved booker to be direct. That being said, I find it funny that whenever people like us respond in any manner other than milquetoast we are deemed as "harsh" or "defensive." But that is for another time.

Booker, I think your view of Hebrews 10 is a little skewed. The purpose of corporate worship is to remind us that we are not islands unto ourselves. It is in the corporate setting that some can meet the needs of those that are hurting for whatever reason. I chose to attend church because helping other people gives me a sense of happiness (contrary to Juni's opinion, yes, I have found happiness). It is in this setting that I can share those things that God has revealed to me through the study of His word. Who is not having their needs met because you have chosen not to share what God has shown you?

As far as your example of John, I think you are grasping at straws in order to justify yourself, but I could be wrong. I have some very good friends that are unable to attend church due to ill-health or distance (one is serving in Iraq) or work they certainly don't feel guilt for missing church. What they do miss being with friends.

82

When will people "stop" relying on "churches and religions" for happiness?

by booker-t in

jw
friends

it just breaks my heart when i read some of the posts on this websites and hear all of the horror stories about people and families suffering because of what the church or religion did to them.

not just jw's or mormons, but catholics, born-agains are also included in this group.

i bet you could find just as many disgruntle ex-catholics and ex-born-agains out in the world who have been severly hurt by their church.

XJW4EVR

When will people like you quit telling people like me that we don't need church?

Do you get "happiness" be denigrating those of us that attend church?

Why do you feel the need to shove your values down my throat?

For every one person that is still "unhappy" due to their church situation I can produce at least 10 times as many that are. What have you proved? Nothing.

I am moving along now.

9

Venting about the World Cup 2006

by fullofdoubtnow in

jw
friends

is anyone else as fed up with all the hype as i am?

i know dedpoet isn't - he can't wait for it to start, and if he could have got tickets, he would be flying out to germany to watch it.

instead of that, he is planning to watch every england match in his local pub.

XJW4EVR

I wonder how the world will react should the U.S. make a run?

The World Cup has popularity in the U.S. for one reason: Americans want to see the best. THis is the main reason why the MLS is iffy in the minds of most Americans. The MLS is doing what it's was designed for. A league to nurture talent for the World Cup.