muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
Dungbeetle -
How many times do I have to ask you to please stop stalking me? I have no interest in your continued desire for a personal flame war. If you are not going to post on the topic of the thread, then there is no reason to post.
Don't be an ass.
negotiators given 5 days.
to talk to jolo abductors.
posted: 12:45 pm (manila time) | aug. 23, 2002. agence france-presse.
You all seem to be missing a very important point. THE WT MAY VERY WELL HAVE NO CHOICE! The Phillipine government is in control of the situation and they have stated that paying a ransom is their last resort. Many governments endorse a "no negotiations" with criminals who have already harmed others and are threatening the lives of more.
I'm not sure what you expect the WT to do? Send a white guy in a suit over with a briefcase of money? I doubt the gov't there would let any private parties get involved with their dealings of these criminals that they have been chasing for months.
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
OUTLAW -
Your arguments are as empty as your head. Since you have a hard time comprehending...in other words, your posts contain no arguments, just shifting insults.
You have yet to defend your insensitive and moronic statements. I guess you would prefer a world full of murdering Islamic Abu Sayyaf's then JWs going door to door. Again, a little too consumed with bitterness. Get over it. See a therapist.
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
dubs lying to authorities so they can get into a country to preach?
Have you not been reading the posts in this thread or the news articles you continue to comment about? The JWs were from the Phillipines. They weren't from another country. But if they were, how on earth do you know they lied to the authorities? If they did lie, what in the world does that have to do with the fact that some religous freak chopped their heads off for being a different religion?!?!
I guess it`s easier to change the subject than to address the topic at hand.
I don't know, maybe you need to take an adult education class on reading and comprehension because every single post I have made on this thread have been about the same topic of JWs that were beheaded in the Phillipines.
Is there anthing else you don`t know about,me that you would like to tell me?
Again, you are lacking a tad bit of comprehension. I prefaced the statement with "I imagine..." which denotes that I was imagining it, therefore it wasn't a stated fact. But for the sake of clarity let me rephrase the sentence. I imagine that if you were ever a witness, you were a jerk witness and now you have simply evolved into a jerk.
Your not that bright are you?..
Obviously not as bright as you, with your stellar spelling and grammar.
P.S. The word would be "You're."
Edited by - amac on 23 August 2002 12:42:59
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
They were not beheaded for "not following beliefs",
The news reports said the following:
"a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: 'Those who do not believe in Allah will suffer the same fate.'"
at http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/2208898.stm
and
"Tolentino said notes were attached to the remains referring to 'infidels' and spoke of a holy war, or 'jihad.'"
According to these, they were beheaded for "not following beliefs."
I understand your point of them basically being where they shouldn't have been, and I agree to a certain extent. However, the crime of beheading these two people far outweighs the JWs bad decision of where to preach (or sell avon, whichever they were doing.)
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
Jst_me -
So, while the acts seem heinous, lets remember that what these preaching groups do is destroy traditional indigenous societies, and those effects are much more devestating than two deaths.
Yes, but those effects aren't brought about by force such as these deaths were. Unless these religous fanatics are forcing people to follow them they do not deserve anything more than being exposed and then ignored. These actions certainly don't match beheading people for not following your belief.
ISP -
Dubs wouldn't use there own initiative in these circumstances. It would be 'untheocratic'. No generalisation.
Unless I am misunderstanding you, I disagree. I know many JWs that have even moved to other countries to serve where the need was greater without official assignment. Many years ago, my wife and I were even set up to go serve on a remote island without official sanction until some unrelated circumstances changed our plans. In fact, I knew more people that served in areas without being "sent" there than people who were official missionaries.
Ella -
But funny when the twin towers fell, the reports from people in Bethel themselves was, they locked the door on the people, not letting anyone in. What kind of people hide behind locked doors in complete safety, but send innocent, unknowing people, with false hopes, out into such violent areas???
I have heard others on this site say that, but then again I have heard reports from JWs saying the exact opposite. I have not seen any news or substantiated reports on this anywhere else. Do you have proof of this or were you a witness of this or are you just repeating unverified stories that you have heard?
And Last and definitely least OUTLAW,
You are an idiot and your font is too large. Your sad attempt to shift the blame for this horrible event to the JWs and the WT is evidence that you are consumed with your hatred for them. You should consider seeing a therapist to get over it and move on with your life. Your shift of blame is akin to blaming the parents and children who get killed by drunk drivers for putting themselves in a situation where they knew that might happen. It's not the drunk driver's fault is it? It's the stinking parents and the stupid kids....they knew when they got in that car and hit the freeway that eventually they would be in the vicinity of a drunk driver! They deserve what they got....crash, crash.
I imagine that when you were a witness, you were one of those jerk witnesses that I never liked, and now you have simply evolved into a jerk apostate. Jerk.
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
You don't think they let hundreds, if not thousands, of children go on being molested because admitting to the scope of the problem might cause a fracture in their little religion?
That's just a tad bit different than saying "They want the kids to get molested so that blah blah blah"
The rest of this argument is silly as it is only speculation as to what drives the men in the GB and what their motives are. For either of us to come to a conclusion without acknowledging that we very well may be wrong is ridiculous. But to me, this is all besides the point. This thread was about the poor people who died in the Phillipines. I was arguing the fact that some decided to shift the argument to try and place blame on the WT for these deaths. That is ridiculous. These people were killed by some demented religous fanatics that make the WT look like angels. I don't care if the JWs were yelling heresy in the streets, they certainly did not deserve the death they were given.
Some apostates are so consumed with bitterness and hatred that they cannot see things without their thoughts being tainted by these emotions.
ISP -
I don't buy the WTS line that they were there making a living. 6 of them went out to a remote area with 2 muslim guides....Note MUSLIM guides.
How do you explain the fact that they were with Muslim guides as supportive evidence that they weren't earning money selling avon? If anything I would say the complete opposite of your suggestion since I can't imagine 2 Muslim guides taking a group out into the field ministry to show them around the Abu Sayyaf's neighborhood.
I don't doubt they did have WT and Awakes, many witnesses carry them wherever they go hoping to informal witness. I think the point of the official statement was that they were not their on official WT business or sent specifically to that area by the WT.
Dubs don't use their own initiative.Just a little bit of a generalization there.
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
Xander -
First of all, would you please put a shirt on?
Second of all, you state:
Do you really believe the GB does not WANT persecution of a few members in some distant 3rd world country?
Yes, I believe that. I don't think any of them are so evil to WANT bad things to happen to the JWs just to hold their religion together. I believe that, although they may be wrong, the GB really believe all the things they say, so they expect persecution. And when it does happen they, no doubt, capitalize on it and use it as proof for their beliefs. But I don't think any of them WANT it to happen, expecially to the degree of putting JWs in bad situations just to create a little persecution.
and that's why they sent them there
According to the news article, all those people were from the Phillipines. They may or may not have been "sent" there in particular because many JWs work territories unassigned.
Do you honestly think the WTS doesn't have the funds to buy the terrorists out and rescue their people?
Possibly, but that is a whole other topic that I have no information or knowledge of. And I see that as having no relevance to my argument that anyone who does not think these beheadings are just absolutely terrible is a sick %#$@!
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
OUTLAW said:
Now you gotta pay..Chop-chop
You are completely disgusting and insensitive!
You jerk. Read the article if you are going to comment on it! It says:..Had I gone into a country where I knew JW`s were not allowed to preach,lied about my intentions about being there,blah, blah,blah
"The group came mainly from the city of Zamboanga, on the main southern Philippine island of Mindanao."
These were average JWs trying to talk to others about what they believe. They were killed by rebels who are now being hunted by their own government. Not exactly a case of getting what they deserved.
but the fact is,you knew what would happen if you broke the law and got caught.Even if these JWs knew they might get beheaded, it does not make the action alright. These men are still sick, disgusting slime that should be punished for what they have done. I can't believe you are actually trying to shift the blame to the victims!!! What a jerk!
Edited by - amac on 22 August 2002 20:12:40
muslim rebels in the southern philippines have beheaded two christian hostages, part of a group of jehovah's witnesses seized on tuesday.
the two severed heads were found by the philippines military on the remote southern island of jolo.
the army chief on jolo, brigadier general romeo tolentino, said that a note was attached to one of the heads, saying: "those who do not believe in allah will suffer the same fate.
Only a real jerk would think that a person that preaches their interpretation of the bible is deserving of a beheading.
I've read some extremely ridiculous remarks in this thread.
Some have inferred that they push their agenda down your throat. Last I checked, a firm "I'm not interested, get the hell away from me" stopped them. They no more push their agenda down your throat than a telemarketer does. I certainly wouldn't be happy about 2 telemarketers getting beheaded, no matter how much I hate them.
Others say the JWs were there to threaten the lives of anyone who doesn't join their religion and to preach death and destruction. Hmmm, I don't seem to recall any TMS parts talking about those kind of presentations. All I remember was them teaching how to hook people on what they thought was the key to eternal life and avoiding destruction.
Some even said that the WT WANT things like this to happen because it proves they are in the time of the end. Do you really believe that ANY JW WANTS this to happen? Maybe one of the GB is in his room right now thinking, I hope they behead the rest of them! Give me a break!
The only JWs that would want something like this to happen are the real jerk JWs, and a good portion of those became real jerk apostates and then say things like "they got what they deserved."
