Posts by Billyblobber

184

Why are people burning their city to the ground in Baltimore? How doe Looting and Mob Violence Help?

by PokerPlayerPhil in

it's hard enough for businesses to enter these areas the government once had to offer up tax breaks to service them.

in watts, california it took decades for city residents to get a grocery store after the thugs burned their businesses to the ground.

you can see the insanity taking place, when you allow mobs and fools to burn building down nothing good comes from it.

Billyblobber

Yes, race becomes a quick and convenient proxy to judge class and affluence which can easily be confused with racism when it isn't even though the bias appears to be against a race.

But...that is racism. Stereotyping someone because of their race/ethnicity is racism. If a cop sees a black or hispanic person and makes a default gut assumption that they're more dangerous, and/or treats them differently because of race based assumptions, it's racism, because they're stereotyping based on skin color. That's one of the big problems with police in America (regardless of the race of the officer in question).

People often conflate things like racism and sexism with assumptions that it's calling someone a "bad person" by doing so. This is not true at all, in fact, almost everyone probably has aspects of racial or sexual bias somewhere, it's almost unavoidable because of humans evolving to classify things by gut, based on what they see and experienced previously.

The problem, and what people try to fight, is when this happens in a way that widely negatively affects people. When you have an institution like the police , making snap gut decisions based on what someone looks like, it can unfairly screw over people, and results in skewed treatment among large groups of people. That is what needs to be fixed.

This individual case in Baltimore has nothing in it where there can be a clear "they did this because of him being black" issue though. Him being black led to the position in which he was in (given the history of Baltimore and why so many black people are the underclass there), which can segue into the larger narrative, but this is not something that I would place more on a horribly run and managed police department as opposed to racial lines.

184

Why are people burning their city to the ground in Baltimore? How doe Looting and Mob Violence Help?

by PokerPlayerPhil in

it's hard enough for businesses to enter these areas the government once had to offer up tax breaks to service them.

in watts, california it took decades for city residents to get a grocery store after the thugs burned their businesses to the ground.

you can see the insanity taking place, when you allow mobs and fools to burn building down nothing good comes from it.

Billyblobber

Well, it's not just a conflation. Many police departments that deal with those types of inner cities are either taught or learn from peers or experience with peers to view things through a racial lens. If police take the viewpoint that they are "at war" with criminals (which is a huge viewpoint in the inner city among police), and most of the criminals are a certain race, then they will have the same problems as soldiers, in which some just relate the race/ethnicity of the country in which they're fighting as the enemy and gradually dehumanize them (including civilians), or view them as "others" in their own minds, which causes them to treat them differently. You're dealing with natural human things like selection biases and snap judgments, that are dangerous when the people doing so are often armed, and can get away with much more than a normal citizen due to being more protected in various ways (by other police, by prosecutors who depend on police for convictions and don't want to get on their bad sides, etc.).

That's the "racism" that is talked about in that context - a large portion of people that harbor an automatic snap shift in how they view black/latin/whatever people due to working in areas where those people are the underclass, and thus, more likely to be criminals. It doesn't mean a default hatred, it's a difference in how one approaches or treats someone based on race, including assumptions of criminality or danger. Even if it's UNDERSTANDABLE, that does not make it RIGHT for those that are victims of it.

However, since police departments are institutions, something can be done DIRECTLY about this. Better training, forcing at least some education about basic socioeconomic theories to police, better oversight, not letting prosecutors with conflicting interests handle grand juries in those types of cases, not letting people with obvious psychological issues carry guns around as an arm of the state, etc. That's the kind of change that can be forced if enough of the populace turns against it.

184

Why are people burning their city to the ground in Baltimore? How doe Looting and Mob Violence Help?

by PokerPlayerPhil in

it's hard enough for businesses to enter these areas the government once had to offer up tax breaks to service them.

in watts, california it took decades for city residents to get a grocery store after the thugs burned their businesses to the ground.

you can see the insanity taking place, when you allow mobs and fools to burn building down nothing good comes from it.

Billyblobber

Also, the reason so many related charges are being brought up is that in other, similar cases, many police officers get off on technicalities because the exact charge cannot be proven. It means that the prosecutor feels that the officers could be proven at fault of one or some of these charges, and it's the best way to get something to stick.

The racial makeup of Baltimore is too tied to class to make a straight racial distinction in this particular case. It gets drawn into the larger narrative, of course, because race and economics are so aligned in America, but the crux of the protests in this particular issue is that Baltimore's police is horribly managed and corrupt, from all reports.

As was pointed out before, many of the industrial cities like Baltimore/Detroit/etc. in the U.S., that were building a middle class based on industry specifically barred black people from buying property in up and coming suburban neighborhoods until the end of the 20th century, forcing them to basically rent in the inner city and creating large inner city ghettos when the industry and money base left the cities (and inner city education, public services, etc. dropped along with this as well). Thus, while most of the negative incidents in Baltimore focus on black people, it's also because the entire inner city is basically poor and black - and aligns directly with socioeconomic issues.

The officers being black has absolutely nothing to do with anything, no matter what the case is, anyway. When people say that police unfairly target and punish black people, they are talking about the institution of the police in America, and are not making a distinction between the race of the officers in question.

184

Why are people burning their city to the ground in Baltimore? How doe Looting and Mob Violence Help?

by PokerPlayerPhil in

it's hard enough for businesses to enter these areas the government once had to offer up tax breaks to service them.

in watts, california it took decades for city residents to get a grocery store after the thugs burned their businesses to the ground.

you can see the insanity taking place, when you allow mobs and fools to burn building down nothing good comes from it.

Billyblobber

Also, the Baltimore police department has paid something like 6 million in the last 4 years for police brutality lawsuits. They have a horribly run police department, which has actually become at least a little more known in public since The Wire's popularity (David Simon created the show based on his experiences as a police reporter - it became one of the highest reviewed shows of all time), and known a bit more among the mainstream thanks to these recent events.

Note that this is the PAID amount, not things that were alleged but not proven, or things completely swept under the rug, or accepted as par for the course. People are seriously wondering why people would be protesting about that?! What in the world?

184

Why are people burning their city to the ground in Baltimore? How doe Looting and Mob Violence Help?

by PokerPlayerPhil in

it's hard enough for businesses to enter these areas the government once had to offer up tax breaks to service them.

in watts, california it took decades for city residents to get a grocery store after the thugs burned their businesses to the ground.

you can see the insanity taking place, when you allow mobs and fools to burn building down nothing good comes from it.

Billyblobber

That should answer the question in the original post.

Peaceful protests go unnoticed.

The Civil Rights movement in the 60s wasn't much different either. People marched peacefully, it was barely covered by the media, and, instead, things like the Black Panthers/Malcom X were overplayed as fearmongering, or every time a riot erupted (normally, at that time, spurred on by the police), THAT was pushed in media, and just gave more flames to the fire for people that viewed them as animals in the first place.

The biggest/best turning point in public opinion wasn't "peaceful marches," - it was that some law enforcement was dumb enough to attack the peaceful marches on camera and turn public sentiment on the side of those marching. That's probably not going to happen in this climate, so we're basically stuck with "peaceful marches = nothing happens, riots break out, people view them as animals...er...thugs."

184

Why are people burning their city to the ground in Baltimore? How doe Looting and Mob Violence Help?

by PokerPlayerPhil in

it's hard enough for businesses to enter these areas the government once had to offer up tax breaks to service them.

in watts, california it took decades for city residents to get a grocery store after the thugs burned their businesses to the ground.

you can see the insanity taking place, when you allow mobs and fools to burn building down nothing good comes from it.

Billyblobber

That "he broke his own spine while in the van flinging himself around in there" story was one of the most ridiculous things I've heard from this whole thing, and it's amazing that so many people (not isolating here, around the Internet in general) tried to cling to that as some sort of "actual reality."

It's also rather crazy that 10,000 people were peacefully protesting there for a week because of a tipping point of the many, many documented cases of police brutality there over the years, and 2 city blocks erupt into chaos for an afternoon, and THAT'S what some people and a lot the media decide to focus on instead. The peaceful protests were barely covered that whole time - instead, the two blocks were shown over and over again on the news and on front pages the second it started.

On top of that, the chaos started when the police cut off access to public/school transportation in the middle of protests, as kids/teens were being let out of school, leaving them all on the streets and forced to find their own way home, basically, starting a chaotic situation in that area. Which was relatively contained, with residents and even some of the rioters helping to clean up after the next day.

Finally:

The death of Freddie Gray was a homicide, and six Baltimore police officers now face criminal charges that include second-degree murder and involuntary manslaughter, Baltimore chief prosecutor Marilyn J. Mosby says.

Mosby announced the charges Friday morning, citing her office's "thorough and independent" investigation and the medical examiner's report on Gray's death. She said warrants were issued Friday for the officers' arrest.

The city's recently elected state's attorney, Mosby detailed a range of charges against the officers, with offenses ranging from one count of second-degree murder and four counts of involuntary manslaughter to assault and misconduct in office.

The most severe charges are leveled against Officer Caesar R. Goodson Jr., identified as the driver of the van that transported Gray to a police station. The charges against Goodson include second-degree depraved heart murder, which carries a maximum penalty of 30 years in prison.

The investigation by the prosecutor's office found there had been no reason to detain Gray — and that his arrest was in itself illegal, Mosby said. She said the knife that police officers found on Gray turned out to be legal.

After announcing the charges, Mosby noted her own ties to the police community — including her mother, father and grandfather, who were police officers. She thanked officers who are committed to serving the community.

We'll have more details from the announcement and any documents released by the prosecutor's office.

32

Favorite Episode of Star Trek

by Coded Logic in

calling all tos, tng, ds9, voyager, or enterprise fans, what's your favorite serries and why?

and what's your favorite episode and why?.

(too many choices on netflix for me to decide which to watch right now).

Billyblobber

I always like the DS9 episodes that were morally ambiguous. The one where Sisko lied to the Romulans to get them to join against the Dominion was great, for instance.

128

900 Top Scientists Sign Statement Skeptical of Macro-Evolution

by Perry in

we are skeptical of claims for the ability of random mutation and natural .

selection to account for the complexity of life.

careful examination of the .

Billyblobber

Why is this "Perry" guy dodging every single question thrown his way?

35

Prince on Saturday Night Live

by designs in

did you catch it.. http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/watch-princes-electric-prformance-from-tonights-saturd-1653735759.

.

Billyblobber

Prince is technically fantastic, from any musical standpoint.

His new album is really, really good, as well. His "dual" album with Third Eye Girl - not so much. The SNL Performance was around half and half and not the best showcase of either, although a great showcase of instrumentation.

He became a witness because he was distraught over a death, and Larry Graham showed up at exactly the right time with the right message. His songs went super-witness for a while, now he's normalizing back into his old style again with the latest albums, with only a couple of songs referencing Witness type stuff in the lyrics.

He was always eccentric, but most geniuses are, especially when they can get away with it (which he can).

40

JW attitudes to women

by Frazzled UBM in

i would be very interested to hear from you ladies on this one.

i know that the society keeps women in subjugation through the headship cr@p but didn't ahve any sense about hoew prehistoric the attitudes are until the other day when we were driving out of the supermarket car park and my wife spotted a woman dressed in tight shorts (it has been very hot here) and she commented 'they say that women who dress like that dserve to be raped'.

i did a wtf and overreacted 'how can you blame the victim like that - such attitudes give men a lciense to commit rape and make women feel they are to balme if they get raped which in turn means that rape doesn't get reported and it gopes on with impunity.

Billyblobber

i haven't seen FrazzledUBM condemn Christianity for how Jehovah's Witness women are treated, so why are you guys saying he's hypocritical? And why is every thread about this now?