Posts by OrphanCrow

13

let's show this cartoon to a modern Jehovah's witness

by opusdei1972 in

if they knock my door, i want them to explain me what this cartoon mean......

OrphanCrow

AwakeAtLast: I can see the edge of another cartoon on the right hand side of that cartoon. Maybe if we had both it might make more sense. Also we would not want to do what the WT does and quote something but leave out the next bit which may alter the meaning or explain something. Opusdeirt do you have the next picture?

To get the full flavor of the cartoon, and to put it into context, it would be best if you downloaded the 1937 Golden Age and looked at the entire April 7 magazine.

The pdf can be downloaded here:

http://wtarchive.svhelden.info/english/the-golden-age/

There is more than 'another cartoon' to be seen. There are several cartoons on that page, and many more throughout the magazine, that all deal with the same theme - the Catholic Church is evil. The above cartoon is embedded in an article about the Crusades.

Rutherford's anti-religion crusade, and hatred towards the Catholic Church in particular, was ramping up into full force at the time he armed "Joe's Army" with this hate literature, and sent those early JWs into volatile situations to garner court cases.

If you spend some time reading some Issues of the Golden Age that were published in the 30s, it is not surprising that many of those JWs who distributed Rutherford's vitriolic attacks against the Catholic Church, and any and all else religion, ended up in court on libel charges.

Hayden Covington deliberately targeted strong Catholic communities to send groups of JWs into to spread anti-Catholic hate literature. It did not go over well in places like Quebec, Canada.

62

The Lawsuit Landslide: Irwin Zalkin representing ELEVEN child abuse victims against Watchtower

by cedars in

many of you will be interested to know that irwin zalkin now has 11 lawsuits against watchtower at various stages.. these can be summarized as follows.... j.l.

shocked by the lack of action, the victims mother immediately left the congregation with her son.

by this stage campos was a known predator with complaints having been made to the elders at linda vista spanish, playa pacifica spanish and the watchtower dating back to 1982.elizabeth mcfarland ohio a former ministerial servant named scott silvasy sexually molested elizabeth when she was a child through her early teens.

OrphanCrow

Malachi: Every case itself everywhere is hypocritical. Innocent people get accused of sex abuse they didn't do and then get punished,....

The number of false reports are very low:

Only 2 - 4% of all sexual assaults reported are false reports

And the number reported are also very low:

Of every 100 incidents of sexual assault, only 6 are reported to the police

http://www.sexassault.ca/statistics.htm

Do you have any stats to support your claim that "innocent people...get punished"?

2

Insurance Policies, Churches and Child Sex Abuse Claims

by OrphanCrow in

in 2011, the vienna presbyterian church in vienna, virginia, chose to apologize to the victims of abuse at the hands of a church employee.

the story was spoke about here on a past thread.. the church chose to apologize in spite of that decision affecting whether or not the insurance policy would cover the abuse payout.. the following pdf discusses how that church's decision would have been influenced by the insurance company:.

the cost of being a shepherdhow vienna presbyterian church chose between its sexualabuse victims and a potential loss of insurance coverage:.

OrphanCrow

In 2011, the Vienna Presbyterian Church in Vienna, Virginia, chose to apologize to the victims of abuse at the hands of a church employee. The story was spoke about here on a past thread.

The church chose to apologize in spite of that decision affecting whether or not the insurance policy would cover the abuse payout.

The following pdf discusses how that church's decision would have been influenced by the insurance company:

The Cost of Being a ShepherdHow Vienna Presbyterian Church chose between its sexualabuse victims and a potential loss of insurance coverage:

Most churches have a Commercial General Liability insurance policy (CGL) that provides coverage for injuries that occur in or related to church programming. Virtually every CGL policy requires that the church give notice to the insurer as soon as the church has information about an event that may trigger a claim. Because church leaders often misunderstand, minimize and ignore warning signs and victim outcries, they also fail to notify the insurance carrier, which can easily lead to denial of coverage. In addition to the CGL reporting requirement, there is also a cooperation clause that requires an insured church to participate in the defense of a potential claim and to do nothing that would be detrimental to an insurance company’s attempt to defend a claim.
When church leaders provide ‘notice of a potential claim’ relating to child sexual abuse, insurance companies take them very seriously. Insurance companies understand that child sexual abuse claims are very dangerous: there are often multiple victims, they are expensive to defend, they are emotionally charged and the jury awards/settlement amounts can be unpredictably high. Insurance companies understand that HOW a church handles the matter can seriously impact exposure, costs and awards (i.e. perception of a cover-up or an admission of responsibility). When an insurer receives a notice of a potential claim, the insurer will usually engage legal counsel for the insured church. The lawyer engaged by the insurance company for the church is in the uncomfortable position of owing a fiduciary duty to the insured church, while being paid by the insurance company to defend the claim.
The stage is now set for the church to make a very difficult decision – a decision that will have serious potential consequences no matter what direction is chosen. This is further complicated when the church has ignored or mishandled earlier outcries. The victims and the congregation want to know that church leaders will be transparent and pastoral – they want to know if leadership has mishandled a matter and, if so, to apologize and seek forgiveness. After all, they are shepherds who are supposed to model ownership of failures.
To make such an admission, however, would create serious risks in a civil lawsuit and insurance coverage related to the claims in the suit. Admitting responsibility for failing to sufficiently screen an employee or mishandling a prior outcry forms the basis of a negligence claim. This is exactly the type of admission a plaintiff’s lawyer would rely upon to make his/her case; and the insurance company knows that. Insurance companies will therefore clearly communicate to church leaders that the CGL policy strictly prohibits such admissions for poor screening/supervision or failed handling of an outcry, as doing so can jeopardize insurance coverage.

Unfortunately, these are usually the exact types of expressions that victims need to hear so they can heal and forgive.

And unfortunately, in the sex abuse cases now facing the WTS...when it comes to the WTS making any decisions to apologize instead of pretending they are not accountable...money is first and foremost. If the WTS admitted culpability, their insurance policies would probably not cover the payouts.

1

A Denomination Confronts Child Sex Abuse: a positive step forward

by OrphanCrow in

there are some churches that are acknowledging the rampant problem of child abuse within their congregations.. from the article a denomination confronts child sex abuse: a positive step forward:.

there are some days when i am thrilled to report positive developments within the protestant world about the slow but steady shift taking place on issues relating to child sexual abuse.

just a few years ago, there was very little private or public discourse within most protestant circles about abuse within the church.

OrphanCrow

There are some churches that are acknowledging the rampant problem of child abuse within their congregations.

From the article A Denomination Confronts Child Sex Abuse: a positive step forward:

There are some days when I am thrilled to report positive developments within the Protestant world about the slow but steady shift taking place on issues relating to child sexual abuse. Just a few years ago, there was very little private or public discourse within most Protestant circles about abuse within the Church. Besides the ignored cries of survivors and a few advocates, public acknowledgment and dialogue on this subject was off limits. As a result, children continued to be at risk in our churches and survivors continued to be silenced through blame and false pity.
In the past year, I have encountered more and more folks who are beginning to realize that the Church has been largely silent — and this silence has had excruciatingly dark and grave consequences for countless individuals and for the very soul of the Church. Through some amazing (and many very painful) set of circumstances, I believe a growing number within the Protestant community are finally beginning to realize that there is an epidemic of child sexual abuse within the Church and that silence and inaction are unacceptable.

In June 2014, "...the entire General Assembly (annual meeting of pastors) of the theologically conservative Presbyterian Church of America (PCA) unanimously and publicly adopted Overture 6 – perhaps the most robust statement on child protection adopted by any Christian denomination."

OVERTURE 6 – “Child Protection in the PCA”
Whereas our Lord Jesus demonstrated his righteous anger at his own disciples, rebuking those who would do anything to prevent children from coming unto him, saying “to such belongs the Kingdom of God,” (Mark 10:14) and condemning those who would harm children, saying “it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened around his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea” (Matthew 18:6); and
Whereas an epidemic of child sexual abuse exists in our culture, with the vast majority of such children being harmed by someone they know and trust, wounding children physically,
emotionally, psychologically, and spiritually with lifelong ripple effects; and
Whereas the silence of the church – when we fail to appropriately address “rape, incest,
sodomy and all unnatural lusts” (WLC 139) by not reporting disclosures of child sexual abuse, or not caring for those who disclose child sexual abuse, or not proactively taking steps to prevent child sexual abuse – is a fundamental failure of servant leadership, rendering the church complicit and culpable before the Lord, driving people away from the safety, healing and hope of Jesus Christ; and
Whereas Scripture warns leaders against the “careless exposing, or leaving [those in their care] to wrong, temptation, and danger” (WLC 130), and every jurisdiction acknowledges that child sexual abuse is a serious felony and has its own mandated reporting laws;
Therefore, be it resolved that we exhort all church leaders to become informed and to take an active stance toward preventing child sexual abuse in the church by screening staff and
volunteers, training them in child protection, and actively maintaining child protection policies pertaining to our obligations to love our children and protect their rightful interests as God’s image-bearers from the devastating actions of abusers (Matthew 18:5-6; WLC 129-130); and
Be it further resolved that we remind all churches that the heinous crime of child sexual abuse must be reported to duly appointed proper representatives of the God-ordained civil
authorities, in accordance with local laws, and that we must cooperate with those authorities as they “bear the sword” to punish those who do evil “in such an effectual manner as that no person be suffered . . . to offer any indignity, violence, abuse, or injury to any other person whatsoever” (Romans 13:1-7; 1 Peter 2:13-14; WCF 23.3); and
Be it further resolved that we urge all church leaders to use their influence for the protection of children, by any and all godly means, including preaching and teaching against the heinous sin of child sexual abuse, warning anyone with knowledge of these sins to “take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them” (Ephesians 5:11), and by supporting victims who often suffer in silence and shame without the vocal and compassionate support of the church; and
Be it further resolved that we direct the Permanent Committees and Agencies of the General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church in America to review their policies, procedures and practices in the area of child protection, including their response to child sexual abuse disclosures, their faithfulness in reporting child sexual abuse to duly appointed proper representatives of the God-ordained civil authorities, in accordance with local laws, their care for survivors of child sexual abuse, and their future plans to help educate the PCA on child sexual abuse, and all other areas of response consistent with Scripture and the Constitution of the PCA, and report to the 43rd General Assembly through the Administrative Committee, after it has referred the matter to and received a report from the Cooperative Ministries Committee; and
Be it finally resolved that the 42nd General Assembly urge all members of the PCA to renew our allegiance to our Lord Jesus by loving our children as he loves our children, “for to such belongs the Kingdom of God” (Mark 10:14)

The same article links to this pdf:

Broken Silence: a Call for Churches to Speak Out - Protestant Pastors Survey on Sexual and Domestic Violence, June 2014

42

Convention Cartoon

by freemindfade in

so last night they played the convention cartoon.

there were a few laughs from the audience, overall though people seemed a little taken aback and tight lipped.

like no one gushed about it afterwards, no applause, just like it was nothing new at all.

OrphanCrow

The WTBTS leadership treats its members like children that need to be told how to behave in public.

Anytime that "rules of behavior" are put in place, a person knows that those 'rules' have already been broken.

It is why the 'rules' are being reinforced - because complaints have been made. Every rule that the WTS is emphasizing in their cartoon is the result of complaints received.

And yes, like other posters have mentioned, the cartoon has a '50s feel and look to them. Which goes right along with the resurrection of old marketing techniques that were successful back in the 30s and 40s and 50s. Today's ipads are yesterday's phonographs and today's jw..org broadcasts are yesterday's JW radio broadcasts. Today's Caleb and Sophie are yesterday's "Children of the King."

Wash, rinse, and repeat.

55

why did man go from living 900 years to 90?

by sowhatnow in

i cant recall the scripture, where it says than only a few men will he live to be 80 years or so, can anyone recall that?.

so then im wondering, if it is a fact that men lived long years 900 in some cases, for what reason would god limit our lifespan if our time is so short compared to his?.

how on earth does man go from living 8 and 9 hundred years down to 80 to 100 ?.

OrphanCrow

Yes, vidiot, that is why the Native culture has a handful of people who are dedicated to trying to preserve their stories. It is of great interest to many within academic circles.

55

why did man go from living 900 years to 90?

by sowhatnow in

i cant recall the scripture, where it says than only a few men will he live to be 80 years or so, can anyone recall that?.

so then im wondering, if it is a fact that men lived long years 900 in some cases, for what reason would god limit our lifespan if our time is so short compared to his?.

how on earth does man go from living 8 and 9 hundred years down to 80 to 100 ?.

OrphanCrow

somewhatnow: how on earth does man go from living 8 and 9 hundred years down to 80 to 100 ?

The genealogical stories contained within the Old Testament existed long before they were transcribed into a written form. Prior to these texts coming into existence, the genealogical record was passed down through centuries of “oral tradition”. I think that the exaggerated ages of the ‘ancient ones’ were either a reflection of how these ancestors were perceived to have magnitude of ‘glory’, or, possibly, it could reflect ages of a family’s reign, throughout each family’s generational existence.

The way that oral tradition operates can be seen in today’s Aboriginal culture. Within the North American Native traditional way of passing on knowledge, the oral tradition is still alive and practiced.

A few years ago (2006/7), I had the opportunity to speak to a Native Elder about their oral tradition. This elder also holds a doctorate degree – I can’t remember what in, but he is well-educated. He explained many things about the Native oral tradition and their “Creation Story” to me.

Firstly, he said that there exists only a handful left of “Storykeepers” who have been trained in the passing along of the Creation Story. The Storykeepers that he knew of were elderly – one woman who lived in remote Northern Canada was 84 years old at the time of our conversation.

The Storykeepers embark on their training early in life. They are chosen, and engage in the mnemonic job of memorizing those ancient stories, that have been told over and over again, for as long as they can remember, training under the ones who hold the story. They engage in this exercise as a lifetime pursuit, until the trained ones are able to recite, from memory, the entire Creation Story. There are parts of this Creation Story that traces the Native people back to ‘the original man’ – in much the same way as the Old Testament record does.

The Native Elder said that the process of getting the privilege, of hearing the story of the ancestors and the Native Creation Story, was a lengthy one, and if chosen to hear the story, a person had to be prepared to commit at least a month and a half of their time to the listening of it. To hear the full story would require sitting and listening for 14 hours a day, for a period of six weeks straight.

Not only that, but the story is told in the ‘old tongue’ – a language that few can still understand or use.

So, based upon what we know of “oral tradition”, it is reasonable to assume that what is read now in the Old Testament about lineage and longevity, contains meanings that have been obscured through time.

A ‘literal’ reading of the Biblical lineage is not reasonable – it originates in oral tradition that is centuries older than the text itself.

57

"Normal family affections and dealings" continue - If only?!?

by LHS123 in

i am new to this forum - it is only a couple of weeks since i have allowed myself to acknowledge and research my doubts.

i am trying to be fair by reading both sides of the story and considering jw official explanation of confusing matters.

one of the issues i have been looking at is shunning - and i was shocked to see the misleading information about shunning on the jw.org website: .

OrphanCrow

Giordano: Keep in mind that the Jw's and the WTBTS are in bed with a threesome of studipity on this matter of shunning......The Mormon's, Scientology, and the Amish.

Add one more: the Baha'i faith practices shunning. The Baha'i's, like the JWs, have evolved from a charismatic leader to another hierarchical organization run by a 'governing body'.

18

Why are there so many pedophiles predators in the Watchtower Corporation?

by Brokeback Watchtower in

one reason is because the governing body's policies allow them to run loose in the congregation with their secrecy/kangaroo courts.

.

to keep jehovah's name untarnished(organization sock puppet) they have put the little rank and file member at risk.. one member of the gb was a child molester.. sexual repression also seems to aggravate the situation and make matters worse.. the governing body main concern is not children but how to keep the scam going and so if they can get the victim to shut up and not go to the police as it offers a temporary fix.. etc.....

OrphanCrow

This question comes from ignorance. Any conglomerate of humans will contain all types of behavior. Any group.
In actuality, for the millions of JWs on record, a few hundreds of pedos is nothing more than a drop in a bucket.

From ignorance? Well, then, let's get rid of some of your ignorance.

http://www.sexassault.ca/statistics.htm

Of every 100 incidents of sexual assault, only 6 are reported to the police

Reduce that number of "six out of hundred" substantially within the JWs - those stats above reflect the population at large - the number reported will be far lower inside the JWs. The JW religion has more than "a few hundred pedos".

Some more stats from the same site:

1 - 2% of "date rape" sexual assaults are reported to the police
1 in 4 North American women will be sexually assaulted during their lifetime
11% of women have physical injury resulting for sexual assault
Only 2 - 4% of all sexual assaults reported are false reports
60% of sexual abuse/assault victims are under the age of 17
over 80% of sex crime victims are women
80% of sexual assault incidents occur in the home
17% of girls under 16 have experienced some form of incest
83% of disabled women will be sexual assaulted during their lifetime
15% of sexual assault victims are boys under 16
half of all sexual offenders are married or in long term relationships
57% of aboriginal women have been sexually abused
1/5th of all sexual assaults involve a weapon of some sort
80% of assailants are friends and family of the victim
The above noted statistics have been taken from various studies across Canada. While the numbers can never been 100% accurate, a few key generalizations can made:
sexual assault is far more common than most would suspect
relatively few incidents of sexual assault are reported to the police
young and otherwise vulnerable women are most likely to be sexually abused
most sexual assaults are committed by someone close to the victim, not a stranger

57

"Normal family affections and dealings" continue - If only?!?

by LHS123 in

i am new to this forum - it is only a couple of weeks since i have allowed myself to acknowledge and research my doubts.

i am trying to be fair by reading both sides of the story and considering jw official explanation of confusing matters.

one of the issues i have been looking at is shunning - and i was shocked to see the misleading information about shunning on the jw.org website: .

OrphanCrow

The marriage relationship and normal family affections and dealings continue.

There is nothing 'normal' about the Watchtower's teachings on 'family affections' or family structure to begin with.

The idea of a man being 'head of the household' and the woman being submissive is a perversion of family relationships and is doomed to fail long before the WTS sticks their nose into it and ruins it even further.

The 'family' has been perverted from the start. Disfellowshipping is only throwing more rotten apples on top of the heap of rotten apples that have already been created by the WTS.