If God wants us to 'find' him, why doesn't he make it a little easier?

by JW72 11 Replies latest jw friends

JW72

Hi all, I was just wondering today, which seems to take up a lot of my time these days.
If God wants us to 'find' him, why doesn't he make it a little easier??
It seems to me that there are a lot of very 'good' people who have their own religion or people like myself who TRY to 'find' him but are not willing to blindly have 'faith', and I'm sure there are a lot of you here who are like me in that respect.
What about these people who are brought up in a faith and it is completely impossible for them to contemplate another faith, are they doomed, or do they have to ignore what they have been taught to find the true God or do they have the truth??
Can God not help people like us who are not prepared to accept what they were brought up in??
Is there any religion for people who are RATIONAL and actually THINK??
What about if I decided to try and find the Devil and give him a piece of my mind, would God be happy??
I'm gonna stop waffling now, any comments would be great to help my throbbing brain!
Love,
Chris
Undecided

Hi JW72,
I will be interested in the answers you get as I feel the same as you on this issue. I wonder all the time as I consider nature and the way it seems to show man as just another animal with more intelligence. I would really appreciate God giving us a little more than the bible to explain his purpose, since no religion seems to understand it, except by explaining away most of it.
Regards,
Ken P.
AGuest

Dearest JW72... may you have peace!
Please permit me to respond... thank you.
If God wants us to 'find' him, why doesn't he make it a little easier??
Indeed, it is not GOD... who is 'lost', dear one. It is/was US. WE are 'walking in darkness'; my Father, however, resides in LIGHT... His 'glory'... which Light... is reflected by my Lord (John 1:9; 8:12)
It seems to me that there are a lot of very 'good' people who have their own religion or people like myself who TRY to 'find' him
The thing is, dear one... while we can indeed 'grope' for Him... in this 'darkness'... it is WE who must be 'found'. WE... are the 'lost sheep'. Thus, my Lord is recorded to have said:
"No one can come to me... unless the Father draws him..."
and "You did not choose ME, but I... chose you..." and
"which man among you who has 100 sheep and loses ONE,
will not leave the 99 and GO AFTER the one?"
The PROBLEM is not that we can't 'find' God... it is that we won't LET OURSELVES BE FOUND... by Him, through His Son. How is that? We 'hide' ourselves... in that we hide OUR SINS AND ERRORS... from Him... and others... RATHER THAN OPENLY CONFESS THEM... so that we may ask forgiveness... receive discipline... and GET ON with the 'work' of forgiving and releasing OTHERS. We either condemn ourselves... or hypocritically judge and condemn others... so that we are UNABLE to 'approach'... or BE approached.
John 3:19-21
Genesis 3:8-13
John 1:47
Hebrews 12:4-17
but are not willing to blindly have 'faith', and I'm sure there are a lot of you here who are like me in that respect.
"Faith"... dear JW72... is NOT 'blind'. DARKNESS... is 'blind'. Faith... is the ASSURED expection of the things hoped for... the EVIDENT demonstration of realities... though not BEHELD (by our physical senses). For it is with the SPIRIT AND TRUTH... that one must 'worship' God... and it is by the SPIRIT... and not the flesh... that one must 'walk'. Flesh... with its blood... CANNOT ENTER into the kingdom of the heavens, so such flesh... with its blood... must be transCENDED. That is done... with the aid of holy spirit. That is what holy spirit DOES. It is the 'blood' of God... and can 'override' the PHYSICAL blood, red homoglobin... so that we can 'enter'... 'in the spirit'.
Revelation 4:2 (Please see the original Greek for this and do not be 'misled' by the WTBTS' inclusion of the false and erroneous words 'the power of the'...)
What about these people who are brought up in a faith..
One cannot be 'brought up in a faith'. One can be raised with certain BELIEFS... but 'belief' is not 'faith'. For indeed, the DEMONS 'believe'... yes? FAITH... is a POSSESSION... a 'gift'... and a 'fruit' of my Father's spirit. If faith and belief were the same thing, then the DEMONS have faith. Now, it is by FAITH... and 'public declaration' BASED on that faith... that WE can be saved, yes? Can, then, the demons be saved? Why, then, do they 'shudder'?
and it is completely impossible for them to contemplate another faith, are they doomed, or do they have to ignore what they have been taught to find the true God or do they have the truth?
Tell me, did the Jews have to contemplate another 'faith' and ignore what they had been taught? Or should they have adhered to the Law Covenant... and its 'features'... as well as compelled others to adhere to it as well? There is a REASON it is called a 'conversion'. One WAS walking in one direction, and must TURN AROUND... and 'walk' in another. Thus, my Lord, the Way... SAID:
"THIS is the Way... I am the Way... walk in it [ME], you people."
For NO ONE can get to the Father, UNLESS they 'go through'... the Son.
Can God not help people like us who are not prepared to accept what they were brought up in??
All one needs to do is WISH, THIRST, ASK, SEEK, KNOCK... and HEAR, dear JW72. The 'invitation'... is granted to all. But not all will want it, seek it, ask for it, thirst for it, knock... or hear.
Luke 11:13
John 7:37, 38
Matthew 11:28
John 4:13, 14
Is there any religion for people who are RATIONAL and actually THINK??
No. There is NO 'religion'. There is, however, one 'church', one 'congregation', one 'temple', one 'covenant', one 'faith', one 'hope', one 'baptism', one 'Lord', one 'God'... one 'body'... and one SPIRIT...
... and one can be a part of, a 'member' of... 'in union with'... uner the 'law' of... a 'living stone' and 'pillar' in... baptized with... and ENJOINED...
by means of that spirit... LIVING WATER... holy spirit.
What about if I decided to try and find the Devil and give him a piece of my mind, would God be happy??
What really could YOU say to the Adversary? You think your 'woes' any more significant than those who came before you? Satan would laugh in your face. There IS One, however, who CAN 'rebuke' him. Leave it to that One, then... and seek your OWN 'proper place' of dwelling in the 'temple' of God.
I'm gonna stop waffling now, any comments would be great to help my throbbing brain!
And I am going to extend to YOU... as it has been granted me to do... (John 20:22, 23) the invitation that is extended from my Father, the Holy One of Israel, JAH OF ARMIES, to ALL... by means of my Lord, His Christ, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH... through His holy spirit... to have your sins forgiven and:
COME! Take 'life's water'... HOLY SPIRIT... free!
... if indeed, you ARE wishing, thirsting... and hearing what the Spirit... and the Bride... say TO the 'congregation'.
Thus, may the undeserved kindness and mercy of my God and Father, JAH OF ARMIES, and the peace of His Christ, my Lord, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH, come to be upon the person of you... you and your entire household... if indeed... and in TRUTH... you are so 'wishing' it.
I offer you MY love... and peace... and I am,
YOUR servant, as I am servant to ALL those of the Household of God, Israel, and a slave of Christ,
SJ
AGuest

Hello, dearest Ken P., and may you have peace!
You said:
I would really appreciate God giving us a little more than the bible to explain his purpose, since no religion seems to understand it, except by explaining away most of it.
The word of my Lord to you, Ken P., is read, hear and GET THE SENSE of his words, as recorded at John 5:39, 40:
"You are searching the scriptures, because you THINK
that by means of them you will have everlasting life.
And these are the very ones that bear witness about
ME... and yet... YOU DO NOT WANT TO COME TO ME...
that you might have life."
Indeed, it was my Lord who said:
"Come to ME... all you who are toiling and loaded
down... and I will refresh you."
Matthew 11:28
How so? He 'refreshes' us by means of the 'water of life'... living water... HOLY SPIRIT... which he pours out upon ALL those wishing and THIRSTING for it. And so, he said:
"If anyone is THIRSTING... LET HIM COME TO ME...
AND DRINK! He that puts faith IN ME... let him come
to ME, just as the scriptures say... "Out from
HIS inmost parts (and NOT 'out from the Bible or
scriptures')... streams of LIVING WATER... will flow."
John 7:37, 38
And, indeed, many WILL 'hear', Ken P. In fact, ALL will hear. But... take a look at Luke 8:11-15, 'note' what HAPPENS to these, that they ALL 'heard'... and GET THE SENSE OF IT:
"Now the illustration means this: The
seed is the Word of God. Those alongside
the road are the ones that have HEARD...
John 10:3, 4
... then the Devil comes and takes the
Word away from their hearts...
2 Peter 1:19
Revelation 2:28
Romans 8:9
Ephesians 4:25-30
... in order that they might NOT believe
and be saved. Those upon the rock-mass...
Matthew 16:18
Ephesians 2:20
Romans 9:33
1 Corinthians 10:4
... are the one who, when they HEAR it,
RECEIVE the Word with joy, but these HAVE
NO ROOT...
John 15:1, 4-7
Isaiah 11:10
Zechariah 3:8
... they believe... for a SEASON... but
in a season of TESTING... they fall away.
Luke 4:1-13
Job 1:11, 12
Job 2:4-7, 9, 10
Job 31:5, 6 (please disregard the erroneous WT words 'men of')
As for that which fell among the thorns,
these are the ones that have HEARD, but by
being carried away by the anxieties and
riches and pleasures of THIS life..
Matthew 6:25-34
1 John 2:16
Matthew 13:22
... they are completely choked and
bring NOTHING... to 'perfection'.
Matthew 5:43-48
Matthew 19:21-24
1 John 4:18
As for that on the fine soil, these
are the ones that, after HEARING the Word...
John 10:5, 27
... with a fine and good HEART...
Proverbs 21:1
Jeremiah 17:10
Matthew 5:8
James 4:8
Matthew 15:8
Psalm 14:1
Psalm 24:3-6
... RETAIN it... and bear 'fruit'...
with endurance."
Galatians 5:22, 23
Luke 21:19
Romans 5:3, 4
Romans 15:4
Hebrews 12:1, 11
James 5:11
And so, my dear one, we all HEAR. ALL of us are the 'seed' of the 'woman' which sown here in the earth... in 'earthen vessels'... hidden from our adversaries in the celestial places. ALL of us have instilled in us the ABILITY to 'hear'. But while we all 'hear'... we do not all LISTEN... to the One appointed to speak to us.
Matthew 17:3
Hebrews 12:25
Instead, we follow our OWN hearts, and follow our OWN desires... and then we are misled... and FERTILIZED... by the 'spirit' of Darkness... rather than the God of Light. We become 'Death's' children, offspring, rather than 'sons of God' and 'sons of Light'. But... the CHOICE... is entirely ours. The Holy One of Israel, JAH OF ARMIES, made us with 'free will', and thus He will NOT... choose FOR us. He has set 'before' us... a blessing... and a malediction. BOTH... have a 'voice'. To whose, then... will YOU 'listen'?
As for me and MY household... WE will listen to the One appointed to lead us... the One who says with his own voice:
"I AM THE WAY... WALK IN [ME] YOU PEOPLE... FOR NO ONE COMES TO THE FATHER, EXCEPT... THROUGH... ME."
I hope this helps you Ken P., and I pray that you have 'ears' to 'hear' what the Spirit says. You can always ask for such 'ears'; indeed, through my Lord, my Father will 'prepare a body' for you, too, one with ears 'opened' and 'excavated'.
Psalm 40:4
I bid you peace, and I am,
YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,
SJ
Francois

JESUS CHRIST, AGuest, the Master made his points with "a word" and you carry on with diarrhea of the mouth (or fingers, as the case may be). You have no economy of expression at all.
JW72 - Matters not, my friend. The fact that you have begun to search for God is proof positive that He has already found you, first, and has begun to speak to you in the small, still voice. All you need to do now to obtain full and final and satisfactory personal evidence of His presence within your mind is to "be still and know."
Congratulations,
Francios
NOTE TO GOVERNING BODY: You've been challenged to a debate, boys. Dont you have ANY balls?
AGuest

JESUS CHRIST, AGuest, the Master made his points with "a word" and you carry on with diarrhea of the mouth (or fingers, as the case may be). You have no economy of expression at all.

That's why, Frank, thankfully for you and ALL mankind... I am not him. Indeed, he made his point with few words; however, our HARD-HEADEDNESS, HARD-HEARTEDNESS and STIFF-NECKS... sometimes makes it 'hard' for us to 'hear'. Perhaps, then, I am just 'chipping away' at the STONE between some 'ears', ya think? Blockhead?
I'm sorry, Frank, but I'm quite tired now. Sometimes when the Master tells me something or shows me something, and then I do my 'part' with it... it takes a little out of me, physically. So, I apologize for calling you a 'blockhead' if it offends; if it doesn't, then I will consider it appropriate. You let me know, okay? Okay.
Oh, and of COURSE... peace to you!
I am,
YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,
SJ (who apparently is the only 'long-winded' poster on the board...)
Silverleaf

Hi Chris,
You wrote:
If God wants us to 'find' him, why doesn't he make it a little easier??
I've often asked that question myself and while I read the replies, what I got out of them was the same thing I've heard time and time again. Apparently we can't find God or be found by Him because WE'RE NOT TRYING HARD ENOUGH. I've found that's what a lot of religious arguments boil down to. You can show someone all kinds of reasoning, show them errors, inconsistencies, etc, and tell them in all honesty that you've tried, you've prayed, you've confessed, you've cried, and you've done everything else they say you should do and it still doesn't make sense and what do they say? "You didn't try hard enough. You don't want to know God because if you really, REALLY wanted to, you would. He would make himself clear to you if only YOU were in the right frame of mind." And yet they wonder why some people give up.
I've always had trouble understanding the idea that in order to FIND God we're supposed to confess our sins, prostrate ourselves and declare our unworthiness and ask for His help. Why can't we stand up and say, "Here I am, I'm doing the best I can. I may have made mistakes but I've tried to be a good person and I think I am a good person. Can you please just love me the way I am?" Why isn't that good enough?
By the way, I think there are religions for thinknig people. I believe any religion can appeal to a thinking person if you approach it the right way. I think religion is a means not an end. We're here to live life, this life, not waste away pining for a better life that may or may not be around the corner, and that we can lose in the blink of an eye with one bad thought or nonconforming deed. Our creator, by whatever name we chose to call he/she or it, gave us a planet, a lifespan, a mind, creativity, ambition, love, passion and a million other things and they are for our use and enjoyment here and now. We should not have to beg forgiveness for something our ancestors did, or declare ourselves sinners unworthy of God's love in order to get it.
And, while I really don't mean to be catty, I have yet to figure out how endlessly quoting the Bible is going to convince anyone of anything. Are we expected to go, "Oh wait, I've read the Bible 157 times and I NEVER SAW THAT SCRIPTURE - gee, it all makes sense now?"
Just my ramblings,
Silverleaf
JW72

Thanks Undecided, Francoise and Silverleaf for your replies.
Aguest, I don't really want to say anything to you because you don't sound nice or even 'human', you sound very patronising and insincere.
I don't really believe that God ever 'finds' anyone, people may say that he does, but I don't believe them, the power of the mind is very convincing!!
I think people just 'make-do' with either what they were brought up in or they find whatever suits them best, culturally or otherwise.
I will continue to believe (for the time being) that God is merely the good side of us and Satan is the bad side of us, it makes sense to me and I feel that is what the bible was meant to be, it just got side-tracked.
If God does exist and he doesn't respect that, then I'm sorry.
Love,
Chris
Francois

AGuest, a blockhead couldn't express in just a few sentences what it took you pages and pages to express, could he?
And a truly spirit-led person wouldn't abandon his leading just because he was "tired" would he? It ain't as easy as it looks, is it?
Francois
NOTE TO GOVERNING BODY: You've been challenged to a debate, boys. Dont you have ANY balls?
kes152

Hello Chris (JW72),
I noticed the comments and was 'moved' to ask you...
you said:
"I will continue to believe (for the time being) that God is merely the good side of us and Satan is the bad side of us, it makes sense to me and I feel that is what the bible was meant to be, it just got side-tracked. "
I have the 'freedom' to say God has and is letting you believe that, for he knew you have believed that and that you plan on believing that.
But what confused me was when you asked:
"If God wants us to 'find' him, why doesn't he make it a little easier?? "
The reason I am confused is this:
You say that the belief of God being the "good part" of us and Satan being the "bad part" of us makes most sense.
If you TRULY believe that to be true... then why did you ask why God doesn't make it easier to 'find him?'
What made you ask that question? Did something inside you not feel right about your 'belief,' and thus, you asked for an easier way to find God?
I'm not patronizing, or at least not intending to, just asking.
May the peace of my Lord and his God be upon you,
Aaron

If God wants us to 'find' him, why doesn't he make it a little easier?

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