Does anyone who Left Jehovahs Organization, still...... (page 7)

Honesty

It's so good to see you posting again, defd!!!

Does anyone who Left Jehovahs Organization, still...... read the bible daily? Honestly do you? Or is it collecting dust on a table or shelf somewhere?

Jehovah never had an organisation. He has always communicated His wishes through individuals (Abel, Noah, Job, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, the prophets, Paul, etc.). See Joel 2:28 Now, back to your question.... Absolutely!! I research the original Greek and Hebrew which I transliterate into English. On many occasions I do use several modern bible translations such as the NIV, ASB and the HCSB for comparison. I have the NWT but only use it to compare with the Greek and Hebrew texts and then wonder why did the translators (M. Henschel, G. Gangas, A.D. Schroeder, N. Knorr and F. Franz) render it with so many errors. As a matter of fact I have been pondering a question that has been on my heart and mind a lot in recent months.... Do I miss God's purpose? Careful research of Psalms 8:1-9; Psalms 148:13; Genesis 1:27; Hebrews 2:8-15; Matthew 21:15-16 and Ephesians 1:4-6 has led me to the conclusion that God has a purpose for mankind. God glorifies Himself towards His creatures by appearing to their understanding (again, see Joel 2:28) and in communicating Himself to their hearts; in their rejoicing, delighting in and enjoying the manifestations which He makes of Himself. He is glorified not only by His glory's being seen, but by its being rejoiced in. Therefore, we must see God with true understanding and savor Him with due affections. In Psalms 8:1 and verse 9 the phrase "LORD, our Lord, how magnificent is Your name throughout the earth! You have covered the heavens with Your majesty." bears witness to His greatness. LORD is the English translation of the Hebrew name for God, Yahweh. This special name was first revealed to Moses at Exodus 6:2-3. Yahweh is the transliteration of a Hebrew word meaning "I Am" and is considered to be God's covenant name. See Exodus 3:13-15 Lord is a title meaning "sovereign one'. The combination of these terms exalts God as the sovereign, covenant-making God. The Lord's name represents Him and all He is. We worship God as we acknowledge His magnificence revealed by His amazing works as the Creator. The bible reveals the entrance of sin into the world. When Adam and Eve chose to rebel against God, they became separated from God and His purpose. Hebrews 2 states the obvious - humans haven't succeeded in fulfilling the role God gave them. But Jesus is the ultimate fulfillment of man's purpose. By sharing in the human experience of suffering and death and by destroying the power of death, Jesus has made it possible for humanity also to share once more in God's purporses for them In bringing many sons to glory (Hebrews 2:10). but only through a right relationship with Jesus can people fully experience God's purpose in their lives. And that, my dear friend defd is the reason that I no longer associate with the WatchTower Bible and Tract Society.

ButtLight

I have mine sitting here next to the computer, for reference perposes for the jwd! Thats the only time I read it.

Defd, ya better start praying now child, your in serious danger! Glad to see your still posting

95stormfront

read the bible daily? Honestly do you? Or is it collecting dust on a table or shelf somewhere?

Nope and have no interest in reading it daily either.

In fact, when I tried setting the NWT on fire........it wouldn't burn. Oh, I tried dousing it with kerosene, lighter fluid, wrapping it with paper, and soaking it with gas, but upon trying to light it, only the edges would get singed, it would smoke for awhile, then the fire would go out.

Concurrently, while I was trying to burn it the best way I could, I was attacked by deminz who constantly threw me into fits of rage, convulsions, and fatal thoughts of suicide. Little did I know that me trying to burn the NWT would upset the deminz so.

At one point, when I was dry heaving to the point that I'd thought I'd turned my stomache inside out, I called upon the name of jehovah to please, save me from these wicked spirits and deliver me into the comforts of his saving grace. I thought my performance at answering in meetings and having a "full share" in his service and organization would be enough to sustain and give me strength. To my surprise, out of the corner of my eye, an old dirty sock-puppet with the happy face of a clown appeared out of nowhere, identifying itself as the omniscient jehovah himself, and promptly ran and threw himself upon that smouldering NWT. That most powerful sock puppet, as heroic as his efforts had been to save me, burst into flames as he made contact with that NWT, while I continued with my dry heaving.

It was at that point where I realized that I'd been had by the WT organization.

defd

Honesty

What a great explanation. I do not see where we as Witness believe otherwise.

defd

Defd, ya better start praying now child, your in serious danger

Buttlight i am not afraid

lonelysheep

95stormfront.....Thank you for making me laugh today!

The Chuckler

Reading the Bible daily won't save your sinfull ass. So I fail to see what what your getting so worked up about dfed. Anyway reading the Bible, on it's own and in it's entirety will NOT lead you to become a JW - quite the opposite.
To be a JW you have to read JW publications daily and follow their latest demands.

Honesty

Honesty What a great explanation. I do not see where we as Witness believe otherwise. defd

Thankyou, defd. I believe that you personally believe it. I am somewhat confused at the official JW position concerning Jesus' role in fulfilling God's purpose, though. In this respect, I am referring to where a JW's faith is directed to be focused on by the WTBTS as evidenced by the following WT Study article which, as far as I am aware has not been replaced with new light: w79 3/1 12-18 Faith in Jehovah's Victorious Organization Faith in Jehovah’s Victorious Organization “Only fear Jehovah, and you must serve him in truth with all your heart; for see what great things he has done for you.”—1 Sam. 12:24. GOD’S visible, earthly organization came to view with the establishing of the 12 tribes of the Hebrew people as a nation with a theocratic government over them in the year 1513 before our Common Era. There was no democratic voting for this government. The Liberator of that people from death-dealing slavery in ancient Egypt was the One who decided upon the government. He also set it up. This One was God and in that government he held the supreme power. For this reason, it is called theocratic and its ruler is called a Theocrat! All his subjects are commanded and are rightly commanded to worship him, their governmental Ruler, as their God. This was according to the first two of the Ten Commandments that were declared to the Israelite nation at Mount Sinai in Arabia.
2 Forty years later, when their Theocratic Ruler brought them into the Promised Land, the theocratic government over them continued. The high priest always represented God, while judges were raised up at critical times to serve as governmental representatives of the invisible Theocrat. This nation thus made up a visible theocratic organization. Nothing else like it existed on earth!
3 That typical theocracy continued on victoriously in spite of repeated efforts of idolatrous governments round about to destroy it. It continued on even after visible human kings were installed over the nation of Israel in the year 1117 B.C.E. How was that? Because the human king merely acted as the visible representative of the real Ruler, the heavenly Theocrat. He did not relinquish His rightful rulership just because of democratic action on the part of the people. No democratic election was held, but God acted within his right and appointed the visible king over the nation that he had once redeemed as his own inheritance. Testifying to this effect is what Samuel, then the judge in Israel, said:
4 “Jehovah will not desert his people for the sake of his great name, because Jehovah has taken it upon himself to make you his people. . . . Only fear Jehovah, and you must serve him in truth with all your heart; for see what great things he has done for you. But if you flagrantly do what is bad, you will be swept away, both you and your [human] king.”—1 Sam. 12:22-25.
5 What an encouraging thought that is for all those whom “Jehovah has taken it upon himself to make his people” in our day! If we continue to serve him in truth with all our heart, he will never desert us. We have a warning example against failing to do this. Where? In the case of ten tribes of Israel under kings of their own choice who flagrantly did bad things. Jehovah did desert them and their visible king. This meant disaster nationally for them. Into exile in the land of the world power of Assyria they were carried off, and never again was their ten-tribe kingdom established. Similar disaster befell the kingdom of the two other tribes of Israel. Its capital was at Jerusalem, where their king of David’s royal family sat on what was called “Jehovah’s throne.” (1 Chron. 29:23) In 607 B.C.E., after Jerusalem was destroyed by the Babylonian World Power, they were deported to Babylonia. For 70 years their God-given homeland, the land of Judah, lay desolate according to the decree of the Great Theocrat, Jehovah. The visible theocratic organization seemed to be out of existence. But there was a faithful remnant that longed for such a theocratic organization to emerge again. The psalmist expressed their feelings:
6 “As for you, O Jehovah, to time indefinite you will dwell, and your memorial will be for generation after generation. You yourself will arise, you will have mercy on Zion, for it is the season to be favorable to her, for the appointed time has come. For your servants have found pleasure in her stones, and to her dust they direct their favor. And the nations will fear the name of Jehovah, and all the kings of the earth your glory. For Jehovah will certainly build up Zion; he must appear in his glory. He will certainly turn to the prayer of those stripped of everything, and not despise their prayer.”—Ps. 102:12-17.
7 It certainly denotes appreciation of Jehovah’s organization when a repentant person finds pleasure in its very “stones” and favors its very “dust,” so to speak. Appreciation of that kind on the part of the repentant exiles in Babylon Jehovah did not despise. He rewarded it with liberation at the end of the 70 years of desolation of Zion, Jerusalem. He restored them to their homeland, there once again to practice theocratic worship in its purity. He continued to be their Theocratic King, although having no visible representative of himself at rebuilt Jerusalem. But his chosen anointed priesthood resumed theocratic service at the reconstructed temple of worship. This was so, in spite of the domination of Gentile world powers over them according to Jehovah’s decree. For the time being that arrangement was how Jehovah’s theocratic government over his chosen people expressed itself. He had not deserted them.
8 Lovers of theocratic organization looked for it to manifest itself in a magnificent way at the coming of the promised “seed of David,” namely, the foretold Messiah. (Rom. 1:3) From the Theocratic Ruler, Jehovah, this Messiah came in the person of Jesus Christ. Nobody in all the universe loved theocratic organization more than he did. That is why he courageously preached the “kingdom of the heavens,” “the kingdom of God,” up and down the land of restored Israel. (Matt. 4:17; Mark 1:14, 15) For his unswerving devotion to theocratic organization he was put to a martyr’s death on Passover day of 33 C.E. At his death, the voice that had faithfully preached the Gospel or good news of God’s kingdom was stilled. For parts of three days it appeared as though theocratic organization had suffered an everlasting defeat. For, look! The chief exponent of it lay cold and still in death.
EVERLASTING VICTORY FOR THEOCRACY
9 The great Organizer of theocratic government, however, could never be defeated. His invisible theocratic organization in heaven remained loyal to him, awaiting Jehovah’s own move for his own vindication. He made this move on the third day of his Son’s sacrificial death at Jerusalem. It brought victory to his theocratic organization, for he performed his greatest miracle in raising from the dead the chief champion of theocratic organization, his loyal Son Jesus Christ. The holy courts of heaven rejoiced with Jehovah. That same day the lovers of theocratic organization on earth were also made to rejoice in the victory of the Great Theocrat when his own Son manifested himself to them as one risen from the dead.
10 One of the greatest upsets in the religious field was now due. Under self-seeking religious leaders the nation of Israel had rejected theocratic organization. Quite deservedly, then, Jehovah rejected that misguided nation as his visible theocratic organization, and put an end to the Jewish dispensation or administration. But he did not desert the small remnant of individual Israelites who had placed their full faith in Jesus and had followed him as the Messiah, “the seed of David.” He transferred them into a new visible theocratic organization. This occurred on the day of Pentecost, the 50th day from Christ’s victory over death. He used this resurrected Son in pouring out holy spirit upon waiting disciples at Jerusalem. This gift of the spirit that was promised in Joel 2:28, 29 was imparted, not to the Pentecost-observing nation of Israel, but to Jesus’ waiting disciples. This bore witness to the tremendous religious upset. It identified the new visible theocratic organization.
11 Thirty-seven years later the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans and the discharging of the Jewish priesthood forever from Jehovah’s sacred service put an official seal on the religious upset. It verified that Jehovah had rejected the Jewish theocratic organization of his on earth, and had begun a new Christian dispensation or administration toward his people. (Eph. 1:10, Authorized Version; NW) But his new theocratic organization continued on victoriously despite the malicious efforts of the Roman Empire to stamp it out of existence by persecution!
12 With respect to this change from the Jewish to the Christian organization during those days of Jesus Christ and his apostles, the Watch Tower, under date of December 1, 1894, had this to say, on page 384, in paragraph 2, with respect to the harvesting of Jewish believers in the days of the apostles: “But as that work of organizing the church of the new Gospel dispensation was no part of the harvest work of the old Jewish dispensation, so the present harvest work or reaping of the Gospel dispensation is also separate and distinct from the work of the new Millennial dispensation now drawing on.”
13 The “organizing” of the “church” or congregation as a spirit-anointed people moved forward from Pentecost, which marked the beginning of the Christian dispensation or administration. As a spiritual Israel it was brought into a new covenant with God. The theocratic attitude of that congregation of Christ’s disciples was displayed in their replies to the religious court of Jerusalem when that Court, guilty of the blood of Jesus, demanded that they stop their witnessing about the resurrected Son of God. Boldly the apostles said: “Whether it is righteous in the sight of God to listen to you rather than to God, judge for yourselves. But as for us, we cannot stop speaking about the things we have seen and heard.” “We must obey God as ruler rather than men. The God of our forefathers raised up Jesus, whom you slew, hanging him upon a stake. God exalted this one as Chief Agent and Savior to his right hand, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins. And we are witnesses of these matters, and so is the holy spirit, which God has given to those obeying him as ruler.”—Acts 4:19, 20; 5:29-32.
14 Those first-century Christians were distinguished by the faith that conquers the world. They were not ashamed to suffer under the name of Christian or Messianist, for the spirit of glory, even the spirit of God, was resting upon them. (1 Pet. 4:14; Acts 11:26) As a result of their faithful witness work and their baptizing new disciples, congregations sprang up both inside and outside the far-flung Roman Empire. Nevertheless, they all constituted one visible organization under Jesus Christ, worshiping the Great Theocrat, Jehovah. Later, in spite of the warning given by Jesus Christ and his inspired Bible-writing disciples, apostasy—religious rebellion—set in. The true theocratic organization seemed to have disappeared. How so? Because the foretold “man of lawlessness,” “the son of destruction,” set himself up in the apostate religious organization as if he were a god. He recognized no other god, not even Jehovah the true Theocrat. (2 Thess. 2:3-12; Matt. 13:24-43) For more than 15 centuries this apostasy prevailed, in spite of efforts by sincere reformers to break free from the domination of this self-deifying “man of lawlessness.” Had theocratic organization now at last been killed forever? According to God’s Word, never could that be the case!
MODERN-DAY THEOCRATIC ORGANIZATION
15 By the middle of the 19th century the “man of lawlessness” class had established many religious organizations in Christendom. These sects called themselves by various names of identification. The religious confusion of Christendom became dizzying. In an effort to gain Christian balance and soundness of understanding, a small congregation of sincere Bible students divorced themselves from all of Christendom’s religious organizations. They turned their backs on its sectarian creeds and followed the example of the first-century Beroeans who searched the Scriptures daily to arrive at the apostolic faith. (Acts 17:10, 11) This fully dedicated congregation exerted itself vigorously in defense of the ransom sacrifice of Jesus Christ and of his promised official “presence” in God’s kingdom. In July of 1879 a magazine that declared itself to be trusting in Jehovah for his backing began to be published.
16 The aforesaid congregation earnestly sought to prove worthy of being Jehovah’s visible organization and his instrument. So it kept free from any alliance with the sectarian organizations of Christendom, as well as from the political organizations of this world. Voicing itself in this regard, that Christian congregation said, in the issue of February 1884 of its official magazine Watch Tower:
“New readers in all parts of the country are constantly inquiring: By what names do you call yourselves? Are you ‘Primitive Baptists’? Are you ‘Missionary Baptists’? Are you ‘Universalists’? Are you ‘Adventists’? Are you ‘Primitive Methodists’? etc., etc. We have several times tried to make clear our position, and now endeavor in a few words again to do so.
“We belong to NO earthly organization; hence, if you should name the entire list of sects, we should answer, No, to each and to all. We adhere only to that heavenly organization—‘whose names are written in heaven.’ (Heb. 12:23; Luke 10:20.) All the saints now living, or that have lived during this age, belonged to OUR CHURCH ORGANIZATION: such are all ONE Church, and there is NO OTHER recognized by the Lord. Hence any earthly organization which in the least interferes with this union of saints is contrary to the teachings of Scripture and opposed to the Lord’s will—‘that they may be ONE.’ (Jno. ÞJoh Ü17:11.)”17 The approach of the end of the Gentile Times in 1914 made it all the more urgent for this dedicated congregation of Christ’s followers to keep free from involvement with worldly organizations as well as with Christendom. ‘Get out of Babylon the Great!’ was the urgent call. (Rev. 18:4) On time, as expected, the end of the Gentile Times came, and was marked by World War I. (Luke 21:24) Babylon the Great saw its opportunity. Using Christendom and its “man of lawlessness” class as her instruments, she succeeded in bringing the unworldly organization of God’s true servants into captivity and bondage. The preaching of the good news of the established kingdom of God by Christ was subdued almost to a whisper. The end of the Kingdom-preaching organization seemed to have been brought about. But had it? Had Babylon the Great gained a lasting victory? Was all hope for the reestablishment of true theocratic organization stifled forever? More than two million theocratically minded Christians in all parts of the world today will answer with a No! in more than 190 languages. And well they might do so, for they would not be in their present relationship with Jehovah God if the visible theocratic organization had not been revived and infused with more strength and vigor than ever before.
18 In 1919 when postwar Christendom came out in favor of the League of Nations as the political expression of the kingdom of God on earth, the reorganized remnant of spiritual Israelites refused to accept that man-made substitute. They came out in favor of the real thing, the newborn heavenly kingdom of God by Christ. More and more there was impressed upon their consciousness that the only purpose in their being set free from Babylon the Great was for them to be witnesses, not just witnesses for the newly enthroned Jesus Christ, but witnesses in the sense set out in Isaiah 43:10, 12. In 1931, the book Vindication was published. It commented on Ezekiel’s prophecy wherein God says more than 60 times that people and nations and even his own servants will “know that I am Jehovah.” In conjunction with that new publication, they embraced an organizational name that was most appropriate. Isaiah 43:10 provided the name for them, Jehovah’s Witnesses!
19 Should we believe that the true God appreciated that loyal course of theirs and would bless it? How could Jehovah do otherwise, especially when they were living up to that name by really being His witnesses! Theocracy, that is to say, God-rule, was what they wanted in their organization for carrying out the witness work. They openly declared in favor of it, in two articles on the subject “Organization,” published in the Watchtower issues of June 1 and 15, 1938. They followed this up by arranging for the theocratic structure of things in their Christian congregations. Then in the midst of World War II, the announcement was made, at the largest convention of Jehovah’s Witnesses up to that year, that the vindication of Jehovah’s universal domination was the main issue before all heaven and earth.20 The desire to share with Jesus Christ in the vindication of Jehovah’s universal sovereignty became a most powerful motivating force in the lives of Jehovah’s Witnesses. It strengthened them to endure the worst persecution that ever befell Jehovah’s Witnesses—during World War II. So Jehovah’s visible organization came off victorious once again to his vindication. For dedicated, baptized persons to share in that victory, what did it take? Faith in Jehovah’s theocratic organization. Did the remnant of spiritual Israelites and their theocratic companions, the “great crowd” of Christ’s “other sheep,” have such victorious faith? Yes!21 Since the end of that second total war, which threatened the very existence of Jehovah’s visible organization, about 34 trialsome years have passed. But, steadfastly, devoted Witnesses have kept their faith in Jehovah’s organization. They know which one of all organizations on earth the Almighty God has used to give the greatest witness to his name and kingdom in all Christian history.—Matt. 24:14.
22 Today we Witnesses face a future that is due to bring the greatest religious upset in all human history. Yes, an upset more startling than that of the year 33 C.E. in apostolic days. Down will come the Devil’s agency of religious persecution, Christendom, as utterly rejected by Jehovah God and Jesus Christ. No, more than that, down will come Christendom’s religious mother, Babylon the Great, the entire world empire of false religion. Up will come Jehovah’s persecuted witnesses in an overwhelming display of his choice and approval of them before all heaven and earth. The former political pamperers of Babylon the Great will fight against these vindicated witnesses of Jehovah in vain. They will lose the war against Theocracy!
23 What, then, should be our position today? Is there any cause for us to lose faith in Jehovah’s visible organization because of mounting difficulties in this world? Those who believe that Jehovah will never desert his faithful witnesses answer, “Absolutely not!” In demonstration of such faith, we will keep on sticking to it and working with it without slacking the hand. Our unwavering faith will be rewarded with victory and the crown of life!

jgnat

I've got Pocket e-Sword, offered freely by the author because God's Word should be free. Wonderful little gadget.

http://www.e-sword.net/pocketpc/

Now, I've never been a JW. Always read my bible. Been through cover-to-cover several times, twice as many for Psalms and Proverbs. Nowadays when I dig in, I prefer to delve deeply.

Does anyone who Left Jehovahs Organization, still......

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