A Gospel Puzzle

by thinker 18 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  thinker

  Anyone who has read the gospel accounts of Jesus's resurrection has probably noticed a number of differences in those accounts. In March 1991 the WT tried to combine all four accounts into a coherent story. I've studied that story and found it is pure BS:

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  w91 3/15

  WHEN the women find Jesus’ tomb empty,

  (Because of the term "women" this must be Mark 16:5. The women in this version were Mary M., the other Mary and Salome)

  Mary Magdalene runs off to tell Peter and John.

  (John 20:2 but this version talks of Mary M. being alone)

  However, the other women evidently remain at the tomb.

  (This is WT BS! Whenever you see the word "evidently" look for BS)

  Soon, an angel appears and invites them inside.

  (WT BS version of Matt 28:2 which has Mary M. and the other Mary only. They just said Mary M. has "run off", so who is "them" refering to? There is no mention of an invitation from the angel they see in Matt; in fact they never enter the tomb in this version.)

  Here the women see yet another angel, and one of the angels says to them: "Do not you be fearful, for I know you are looking for Jesus who was impaled. He is not here, for he was raised up, as he said. Come, see the place where he was lying. And go quickly and tell his disciples that he was raised up from the dead."

  So with fear and great joy, these women also run off.

  (Matt 28:8 also Mary M. and other Mary. Who are "these women" who run off? Mary M. has already gone according to the WT!)

  By this time, Mary has found Peter and John, and she reports to them: "They have taken away the Lord out of the memorial tomb, and we do not know where they have laid him." Immediately the two apostles take off running. John is fleeter of foot-evidently being younger-and he reaches the tomb first. By this time the women have left, so no one is around. Stooping down, John peers into the tomb and sees the bandages, but he remains outside.

  When Peter arrives, he does not hesitate but goes right on in. He sees the bandages lying there and also the cloth used to wrap Jesus’ head. It is rolled up in one place. John now also enters the tomb, and he believes Mary’s report. But neither Peter nor John grasps that Jesus has been raised up, even though He had often told them that He would be. Puzzled, the two return home

  (John 20:2-6) , but Mary, who has come back to the tomb, remains (John 20:11) .

  In the meantime, the other women are hurrying to tell the disciples that Jesus has been resurrected, as the angels commanded them to do.

  (Matt 28:9-10 talks of Mary M. and other Mary. So who is the other women?)

  While they are running along as fast as they can, Jesus meets them and says: "Good day!" Falling at his feet, they do obeisance to him. Then Jesus says: "Have no fear! Go, report to my brothers, that they may go off into Galilee; and there they will see me."...

  ...Mary Magdalene, who remains behind at the tomb, is overcome by grief. Where could Jesus be? Stooping forward to look into the tomb, she sees the two angels in white, who have reappeared! One is sitting at the head and the other at the foot of where Jesus’ body had been lying. "Woman, why are you weeping?" they ask.

  "They have taken my Lord away," Mary answers, "and I do not know where they have laid him." Then she turns around and sees someone who repeats the question: "Woman, why are you weeping?" And this one also asks: "Whom are you looking for?"

  Imagining this person to be the caretaker of the garden in which the tomb is situated, she says to him: "Sir, if you have carried him off, tell me where you have laid him, and I will take him away."

  "Mary!" the person says. And immediately she knows, by the familiar way he speaks to her, it is Jesus. "Rab·bo'ni!" (meaning "Teacher!") she exclaims. And with unbounded joy, she grabs hold of him. But Jesus says: "Stop clinging to me. For I have not yet ascended to the Father. But be on your way to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’"

  (John 20:11-18)

  Mary now runs to where the apostles and fellow disciples have gathered. She adds her account to the report that the other women have already given about seeing the resurrected Jesus. Yet, these men, who did not believe the first women, apparently do not believe Mary either. Matthew 28:3-15; Mark 16:5-8; Luke 24:4-12; John 20:2-18.

  (This WT fairy tale of a combined resurrection story has THREE Mary Magdalenes in three different places at once!)

  I'm reading a book right now that does put together a reasonable story from all four gospels. Anyone care to guess how it goes?

  thinker
• 

  AK - Jeff

  An actual reading of the gospels in parallel and discussing it would have been interesting. I often wondered why we didn't have that kind of Bible study at the KH. Instead of the Life... of Jesus book they could have printed a nice parallel of the gospels with lots of marginal area for notes and cross-references.

  Of course now I know why - they were afraid of legitimate questions, provoking discussions, and conclusions reached by thought. I sometimes come across that sort of thing on Christian radio and have found that I really enjoy it when the Bible is actually read and considered. Another reason is that witnesses would have passed out if actually expected to read and think and comment without the Watchtower holding their hands.

  Jeff
• 

  thinker

  
  

  
  Hi Jeff,

  "An actual reading of the gospels in parallel and discussing it would have been interesting. I often wondered why we didn't have that kind of Bible study at the KH....Of course now I know why - they were afraid of legitimate questions, provoking discussions, and conclusions reached by thought."

  You're absolutely right. Here's the study questions. You'll notice that none of the questions I've raised are included.

  ÷ After finding the tomb empty, what does Mary Magdalene do, and what experience do the other women have?

  ÷ How do Peter and John react at finding the tomb empty?

  ÷ What do the other women encounter on their way to report Jesus’ resurrection to the disciples?

  ÷ What happens to the soldier guard, and what is the response to their report to the priests?

  ÷ What happens when Mary Magdalene is alone at the tomb, and what is the response of the disciples to the reports of the women?

  Here's something really interesting. These sciptures were referenced in a group at the end of the article. No references in the article itself.

  Matthew 28:3-15; Mark 16:5-8; Luke 24:4-12; John 20:2-18.

  Notice anything strange about the references? Each starts a couple lines into each chapter. I've found that what's missing from a WT article is often what's most important. In this case all four Gospels have a time-stamp on them in the lines just prior to those referenced. Matt 28:1, Mark 16:2, Luke 24:1, John 20:1. Seems like they'd like to ignore those signs of what happened first, second, third, then fourth. thinker
• 

  JCanon

  The actual problem is with Biblical scholarship being inadequately familiar with the cultural influences and practices back then. Miriam, that is "Mary" was used in that culture the same way "Maria" and "Jesus" is used in Latin American cultures. It is quite proliferative. Look at all the different Mary's associated with Jesus? His own mother was named "Mary".

  This brings us to Mary Magdalene. Back then, sometimes a persons station, place of birth or other affiliation was used to distinguish them from others. There was no true "surname" practice going on. Thus "Mary Magdalene" is often misconstrued as a a surname or a second name instead of a reference to an occupation ior position, such as a housekeeper companion. This is likely the case since Mary Magdalene is consistently associated with other households. The Mary Magdalene who first saw Jesus in the garden seems to be connected with the household of Peter and John who might have been living together at the time. The Mary Magdalane who saw Jesus on the road with the "Other Mary" was, obviously with the "Other Mary" and perhaps her maid/companion. And the Mary Magdalene who arrived after the sun came up with Jesus' mother Mary and other relatives to put spices on the grave was likely a servant in her household.

  Magdalene is considered to be related to "Madeline" or "Magda" which in German is a reference to a 'maid'. Thus a "Magdalene" might have been a formal title given to a professional housekeeper and companion or that position.

  So, lets say, because of the extremely popular use of the name Mary, the Marys that were oftentimes houseservants were called Mary Magdalenes, or "Maid Mary". Problem is, three of the households closely connected with Jesus had Maid Marys in their households. Now everyone back then knew all there of the Mary Magdalenes. The problem came when writing the gospels was distinguishing when each of them visited the tomb of Jesus. You could not very well simply give one account since others who knew when the other Mary Magdalenes arrived would presume a conflict. So how the gospels handled it was to give the details of each with some "identification" recognizable to those back there of which was which. This seems to be the association with the household she was attached to, that is the household of Peter and John, the Other Mary and Mary the Mother of Jesus, respectively, for the three different times they arrived.

  Also the specific times and some differing circumstances when arrival at the tomb were included to distinguish the three visits, not that giving the specific times should have been enough. The first Mary Magdalene who was maid to Peter and John arrived at night, shortly after 3:00 a.m. It was still dark. She encountered Jesus near the tomb and presumed he was a gardener.

  The second Mary Magdalane and her employer, "The Other Mary" arrived shortly before sunrise. Jesus had left the area by then but they encountered him on the road.

  The last Mary Magdalene to arrive, a servant in the houshold of Jesus' Mother Mary who came with spices, didn't come until after the sun had risen and it was already light. When they got to the tomb Jesus was long gone and they didn't see him.

  So that's why the accounts are all so different. It's because there were three different Mary Magdalenes in these three different households coming to the tomb at three different tiems and they sort of had to include each visit so as not to confuse. But because the gospels handled the visits separately, in later times, especially with a title like "Mary Magdalene" which seems like a distinctive name for one individual, some have become confused and thought that the gospels were in conflict, and others have tried to explain why there was no conflict and haromize them, when in fact, its' just a matter of observing these were three different women coming to the tomb at three different times and different circumstances.

  Sorry but the gospel writers, Jews, were not dummies who couldn't manage to coordinate their stories of what happened during the visit of a single woman to the tomb of Jesus as some presume.

  So as noted, sometimes the lack of perception among scholars creates problems that are not really there. The case of not recognizing there were three different Mary Magadelenes and that "Magadelene" was a title (similar in our culture for say a nurse, i.e. Nurse Ratchet) is one example. Some of it is bias as well. That is, looking for "errors" they can exploit to condemn the gospels, there is no real effort to analyze the situation fully to find some resolution to a seeming conflict. Instead the error is taken superficially and then exploited in error. So the dumber the scholars are the greater the number of errors, the smarter the scholars are, the less the perceived contradictions.

  Obviosly, this one was not that difficult to resolve.

  JC
• 

  Narkissos

  Strangely enough, the WT published an interlinear translation but it never published a Gospel synopsis. This is a very simple and helpful tool to approach this kind of "puzzle". One thing it makes very clear is the literary relationship between the texts: as far as the Passion / Empty Tomb / Apparition narratives are concerned, all extant canonical Gospels appear to be basically dependent on an early version of Mark -- which they have modified, cutting off or adding their own traditions or creations. This in turn makes attempts at harmonisation (either in the form of the stories complementing each other or actually relating different parallel events) pretty pointless imo.
• 

  JCanon

  What seems to be one thing might due to lack of expertise with koine Greek and understanding adequately idiomatic expressions. When these are taken into complete consideration there is complete harmony between the gospels.

  Passover was held on Nisan 14 from y to Midnight, followed by Jesus' arrest on Nisan 15th when the date changed at Midnight (i.e. one of the details of Jewish dating not appreciated). That was a Saturday and a sabbath in 33 CE. He did not go in front of the Sanhedrine until sunrise and was there close to five hours before being presented before Pilate just before Noon. He was interrogated for a while but Pilate sent him to Herod later that afternoon. Jesus was in the custody of Herod for the following 4 days where he conducted trials before having to return Jesus with a verdict in time for the customary release of one prisoner. Jesus trial was on Wednesday, Nisan 19th at Noon, before "preparation for passover" sabbath day of Nisan 21st. He was impaled at 9:00 p.m. later that day of preparation which began at sundown and remained on the torture stake until the following day at Noon, Nisan 20th, when it became dark for three hours, at which point he expired around 3:00 p.m. Nisan 20th. This was just a few hours before sabbath would begin of Nisan 21st. He was put into the tomb before sabbath began and remained there the rest of that day and two days and three nights, rising on Nisan 23rd before 3:00 a.m. He remained on the planet for 40 days and ascended to heaven 3 days before Pentecost when Holy Spirit was sent.

  That is what the coordinated gospels confirm. There is no conflict. Just lack of understanding of Jewish customs and terms and language syntax.

  But, if you don't know these details of language and custom, it is possible to get confused as many have.

  JC
• 

  thinker

  Hi JC,

  You said "

  This is likely the case since Mary Magdalene is consistently associated with other households. The Mary Magdalene who first saw Jesus in the garden seems to be connected with the household of Peter and John who might have been living together at the time. The Mary Magdalane who saw Jesus on the road with the "Other Mary" was, obviously with the "Other Mary" and perhaps her maid/companion. And the Mary Magdalene who arrived after the sun came up with Jesus' mother Mary and other relatives to put spices on the grave was likely a servant in her household. Magdalene is considered to be related to "Madeline" or "Magda" which in German is a reference to a 'maid'. Thus a "Magdalene" might have been a formal title given to a professional housekeeper and companion or that position."

  So your theory is that John and Peter had a maid named Mary, the other Mary had a maid named Mary and Mary the mother of Jesus had a maid named Mary? Luke 8:2 seems to indicate that Magdalene was the title for only one Mary. She seems to have been very wealthy for a maid.

  BTW, the german word for maid is "madchen" not magda.

  thinker
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  Leolaia

  Magdalene is considered to be related to "Madeline" or "Magda" which in German is a reference to a 'maid'. Thus a "Magdalene" might have been a formal title given to a professional housekeeper and companion or that position.

  1) The Germanic word for "maiden, girl" (Old English maegeð, Old Frisian maged, Old High German magad, and Gothic magaðs) is derived from the Proto-Indo-European word *maghu "young person of either sex" (cf. Albanian makth, Avestan magava- "unmarried", Old Irish mug "boy, servant, Gaelic Mac- "son of", Old English magu "child, son"). It has absolutely nothing to do with the NT name Magdaléné, which itself derives from Aramaic mgdl'- "of Magdala" (cf. Erubin 5a, Ta'anith 48), or Hebrew mgdl "tower". There is no such word in Aramaic or Hebrew with the form m-g-d-l- with the meaning of "servant" or "maid". 2) The name "Madeline" is simply a French version of "Magdalene" (cf. Middle French Magdeleine), and has nothing to do with the Germanic word.
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  Carmel

  Please don't take offense at my comments. I mean no disrespect. This type of sorting and picking reminds me of trying to identify the color of sand by examining each grain and extrapolating there from. Sand is grey, mauve, greenish, on and on. We may need to step back and look at the composite from a different perspective rather than assuming that any of the accounts are truely accurate or complete. Ultimately, I can't reconcile the meaning of ressurrection with a body floating up into the sky. Contrary to science and logic and in context, hagiographical rendering needed to compete with the Mythric traditions surrounding the middle east at the timel

  carmel
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  JCanon

  Hi Carmel

  So your theory is that John and Peter had a maid named Mary, the other Mary had a maid named Mary and Mary the mother of Jesus had a maid named Mary? Luke 8:2 seems to indicate that Magdalene was the title for only one Mary. She seems to have been very wealthy for a maid.

  Perhaps. But put yourself in the position again of the culture. Look at how many Marys there are other than the Mary Magdalene. Even when not so many have a common name sometimes there are coincidences. If there was a coincidence, say the unusual circumstance of three housemaid Magdalenes named Mary and they all were part of households that followed Jesus, how would you handle given an account of them? If these were well known to all who knew Jesus then you would want to include all three accounts.

  The only thing that our Western culture requires is a statement or five that says, "And there were many women named Miriam and three Mary Magdalenes who were attendant upon our Savior."

  THEN....the three gospels accounts would make all the sense in the world and I'm sure many preachers would have a sermon of gospel style. But because that single statement is missing, most people can't get past that these are three different women with the same name/occupation. But Jewish tradition is not to overstate anything. In fact, it tends to make two statements and leave the deduction up to you.

  But no problem. You have some choices here.

  1. You can either believe the gospel writers wanted to include all three legendary stories about a single Mary Magdalene that had circulated by this time and let you choose which one is correct.

  2. They made up the story of a Mary Magdalene and didn't coordinate their stories well and now the discrepancies are showing up.

  3. There were three Mary Magdalenes known to Jesus' followers back then and it was important to include all their stories though obviously the first encounter as the primary story. Those who know there were three of them would easily understand which was which.

  4. Or maybe they are playing a little game. They used the three Mary Magdalenes to create semi-parallel verses to hide detail in scripture without mentioning there are tree of them to see who could figure it out. And that, in turn was a clue to other hidden messages in the gospels.

  There's your pick. Is this evidence of some incompetent historians or just an extremely common name during that time! ???

  JC