A Moral Dillema... and ideas?

Abaddon

Okay, background info;

My ex-wife is threatening to cut contact between me and my daughters (12 and almost 15).

She has done a great job of being the parent with the lions share of rasing them (especialy as she's become inactive) and has always resisted 'excessive' involvement as well as always being resentful and obstructive of contact with them, down to them not feeling comfortable to call me due to her reaction. Last year my x cut off contact for three month as she was 'under stress'... or more accurately, I'd asked to have them for a week in the summer holidays and she can't stand to see me have anything that makes me happy even if it spoils things for her daughters...

This year, in addition to repeating the request for holidays, I spoke to her about a few problems I'd found out about regarding my daughters. Normally I stay well clear of such issues as she resents me 'disrupting the quiet family home' that she wants. Medical stuff, school stuff, I all find out about from my girls after the case. She even tells them not to tell me things, like about her boyfriend.

However, it became obvious the younger one was running rings around her with playing ill to get off school, and the older one is growing increasingly confrontational with her mother even over reasonable requests to do chores and homework. I offered to help, making clear my admiration for the work she'd done, how the kids loved her, and how I hoped I could help out a little so things weren;t so hard. She grudgingly accepted. I'd already spoken to my younger daughter about her school attendence (and she's not missed a day since may I add).

1 week after I did this I get a rambling five page letter in purple felt-tip (with interlinear pen scribbles inbetween lines added the day after writing). She basially doesn't want me involved in any way and threatens unless I back off she'll stop me seeing the kids.

This would make them despise her, but one of the reasons I left her is she's a mean-spirited irrational neurotic bitch, so why should I expect anything reasonable?

At the moment UK law is SHIT at getting decent access for fathers if the mother decides otherwise. New legislation is going through, but not for a while yet.

Now, there is one thing I would love to do, but I can't see a way to do it and have any self-respect myself.

To put it simply, she's inactive, she has a boyfriend, her mother would shun her if she was df'd, and I think the threat of being grassed to the local BoE would stop her making these threats.

But I can't do this. I know that. It would be vile. I'm not asking for anyone to really pursuade me otherwise... but oh, man... the look on her face would be sweet... unfortunately a hit man would be more morally justifiable...

... any ideas short of winning the lottery and having the finances to destroy her legally if she pisses around?

MidwichCuckoo

At the moment UK law is SHIT at getting decent access for fathers if the mother decides otherwise

Have I missed something? Are you living in different countries? Your girls are old enough to make their own decisions as whether to see you or not - (the Law would be on your side). How CAN she stop them if your daughters want to?

As you don't feel able to 'grass' your ex - are you considering using it as a lever to gain easier access? OR are you suggesting someone else turn her in? lol - post the details, I'm sure someone will oblige.

LittleToe

I think that in such situations you have to do what you have to do.
Maybe a warning shot across her bows would do the trick.

The thing with bluffing is that you need to be prepared to have your bluff called, though.
Would you really grass her up, if she continued down this track?
How might things pan out if she double-bluffed you and threatened to try and get YOU officially DF'ed?
It's a hard call, indeed.

Meanwhile, your girls are getting older. You probably wouldn't need to keep the bluff going for long, but if it bought you a couple of years...

IronGland

At the moment UK law is SHIT at getting decent access for fathers if the mother decides otherwise

It's not just the UK. It's amazing to see the cavalier attitude many women have towards divorce knowing they will get custody of the kids and child support and/or alimony. It's a no lose situation for them.

NeonMadman

I know what you mean - my ex was in sort of the same situation (although at least our daughter was grown up and married by the time we divorced, thank God). But she really raped me financially in the divorce (even though she complains to this day that she didn't get enough). And if the elders knew everything she had done and said, she would surely have been df'ed. I suppose that I could have used that threat for leverage, but I never did - partly because I would almost certainly have been df'ed for apostasy myself.

It does occur to me, however, that while you might not actually rat her out, a few well-placed veiled threats might be adequate to get her to reconsider her antagonistic attitude. She doesn't have to know that you really wouldn't do it - the object is to get her to realize that she is as vulnerable as you, but in different ways.

SixofNine

I don't see why the threat would be immoral. The actual action (of telling) wouldn't be immoral either, except for that it might be counterproductive. She's making a choice to fuck you and her own children, she shouldn't be immune to a catching some random STK (socially transmitted karma). Let the silly cult accomplish something good for once.

LittleToe

Oooh, Six, you naughty, naughty boy!

You used the K word!!!

Gadget

I think its a lot more morally justifiable for you to threaten to report her to the elders than for her to threaten to cut you off from your children. If the children decided on their own for you not to have any influence in their lifes fair enough, but for their mother to make that decision for them when their old enough to decide for themselves is wrong. I would be very careful of how they would react to you reporting(or threatening to) her to the elders though.

I would keep a comprehensive diary of everything that happens. If you can show a pattern of instability you may have more rights than you think.

tetrapod.sapien

If you can show a pattern of instability you may have more rights than you think.

that's a good point.

Abaddon,

it sounds to me like your daughters might very well get to an age in the near future where they really appreciate the calm, rational and kind parent (you seem that way to me, so that's why i assume you are such a parent). they may just decide one day to move in with you. can the UK authorities stop that from happening if it is the express desire of the teenagers?

regarding the elders: i wouldn't personally turn her in. not because i think it is immoral. but only because it may cause a loss of respect for you, in your daughters. what are your daughters personalities like? are they turning ouot to be like their mom? or do you think they might be less like her? if you think that she is really, truly suceeding in turning you into a bad guy in their eyes, then perhaps the elder route is right after all, if you have nothing to lose.

sweet tee

You have every right to parent your children. Do what you think will be the most effective in getting you time with your famiy and no matter what the outcome, let them know somehow that you're there for them. It can make a world of difference when they (hopefully) walk away from the borg.

I grew up without my father (his choice), mom grew up without her father (his choice) and my children are growing up without their dubdumdummy father (again, his choice). Even though I totally disagree with the JW faith, and I know that what teeny-tiny time he spends talking with them he slips it in - I don't care. It's HIS right to influence his children - if only he understood that it is also his obligation before God. But we know the dubs don't think like that. It's the Borg first - everyone else NEVER! Family? "We're you're family' (barf).

A Moral Dillema... and ideas?

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