EF - I am a truth seeker (not Troof though - LOL!) I like that expression, and Talesin's doG. Please email it to [email protected]. I am constantly reading/researching - AMA's releases too. Unlike some, I am not satisfied with half an answer - which is why I could not stand the JWs and their mindset, nor anything that requires I abdicate my rational mind, including religion.
FYI - not on topic. I was a frequent caller on Erv Homer and Bob Grant's shows in Philadelphia and NY between in 1985 and 1988, (Stephen from Blackwood) talking about the Constitution, South Africa, Gun Control and the like. I had on several occassions asked what was known in the media about The New World Order and was ridiculed for asking the question. When Bush Sr. followed the Soviet envoy in 1989 saying before the UN that Iraq was threatening "the emerging New world Order" I wanted to know why no one in the media, including Bob Grant inquired into what they meant. I was boycotted and censored after that. It has now become a household word.
As I said somewhere else, I am a member of the ACLU, have been nominated an honorary member of NOW and the Socialist Democrats of America, have been subscriber to the John Birch Society, a member of the NRA, the Cato Institute (Libertarian), the Heritage Foundation (Republican Conservative) and the Foundation for Individual Rights. I search everywhere!
Having served a year of a 15 month solitary confinement sentence under the South African government, I am acutely aware of the averices of government and what a totalitarian government looks like and smells like. Remember Tuskeegee? Love Canal?
Marburg and Ebola viruses? Man made?
by Stephen John Gault 38 Replies latest watchtower medical
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Stephen John Gault
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Abaddon
SJG
You mention two seperate problems, one concerning syphylis, the other industrial waste. These were county level with some State/National involvement.
With respect, to use these as examples, when you are alleging possible conspiracy regarding HIV or filoviruses, is really not providing comparable examples.
For the problems some people feel there are with the HIV/AIDS connection to be true, for example, would require a 'ring of silence' several orders of magnitude larger than either example you give. It is like suggesting that a massive conspiracy of silence concerning aliens actually captured by the US is possible.
You also don't explain how you exclude natural generation of new viruses as one predicts under evolutionary theory and observes in real life.
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Stephen John Gault
Abbadon - are you familiar with the Tuskeegee experiment? Call that evolution?
How do you think governments test the efficacy of their biochemical warfare agents? On rats and mice only?
Tuesday July 1, 1969 - US DOD secures funding from Congress to perform studies on immune-system-destroying agents for germ warfare. Source - DOD Appropriations for 1970:Hearings before a Subcommittee. 91st Congress, First Session HB 15090, Part 5.
"Dr. MacArthur (Deputy Director DOD): Within the next 5 to 10 years,it would probably be possible to make a new infective microorganism which could differ in certain important aspects from any known disease-causing organism. Most important of these is that it might be refractory to the immunological and the therapeutic process upon which we depend to maintain our relative freedom from infectious disease....without the sure scientifc knowledge that such a weapon is possible, and the ways it could be done, there is little that can be done to devise defensive measures." -
Stephen John Gault
"Circle of silence" - Do you know how many scientists were involved in the Manhatten Project, all silent or silenced? Nothing unusual. The DOD has hundred of top secret projects involving tens of thousands of people - effectively silenced. EG. Area 51.
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IronGland
Anyone have inside info?
This is a board of former JW's. Are you actually expecting to find microbiologists here?
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Stephen John Gault
IronGland - yes. I have found other ex-JW's who have became very introspective, prepared to question everything, and those are the ones I seek to draw out. Others who continue to bury their heads in the sand, who choose to continue "believing" yet another idealogy, religion, the State, not, but they show themselves anyway.
AS JW;s you were taught not to question the State, unless they supposedly violated doG's law. Other than that you had to "pay unto Ceasar". Well, some of us question even that. -
IronGland
IronGland - yes. I have found other ex-JW's who have became very introspective, prepared to question everything, and those are the ones I seek to draw out.
Sounds like a brilliant way to deal with deadly viral infections.
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Abaddon
SJG
Abbadon - are you familiar with the Tuskeegee experiment? Call that evolution?
I am familiar with the Tuskeegee experiment; did you think I used a spirit medium to determine it was about syphilis, as I said in my last post? Please read what I type.
As for your mention of evolution and Tuskeegee, I assume that was a mistake on your part as in no way did I link Tuskeegee to evolution; I linked that to 'conspiracies of silence'. One would almost think you were attempting to make a straw man argument, as that's the second error you make in reading a very short post.
How do you think governments test the efficacy of their biochemical warfare agents? On rats and mice only?
Nope. As an example of what I know the US Navy used San Francisco to test bioagent dispersal using Serratia marcescens. They also exposed servicemen to a wide variety of agents.
THAT is a fact.
Funny SJG how you seem to avoid answering questions; is that from a lack of answers?
And I should have spiked your guns when I mentioned the circle of silence as the Mark 1 response for conspiracy theorists over secercy is 'The Manhattan Project'.
Yes, of course the fact this was in WARTIME for a LIMITED number of years and then all secercy about the presence of such a program was LIFTED after the use of the first nuclear devices means it is another invalid comparison.
Still waiting for you to tell me how you excluded ebola et.al arrising naturally, as predicted and observed under evolutionary theory. Without exlcuding this most likely explanation you're just clutching at straw and jumpoing at echos, no matter how big a self-biog you can type for us; an appeal to the authority of oneself is scaresely impressive...
I wonder what logical fallacy will be next?
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Stephen John Gault
Annadon - no problem - will address Ebola specifically. trouble with answering each and every question thrown in a series of questions, is that my reply will be two pages and crash the thread like EvilForce's did in the other two threads on HIV.
The Tropical Disease Bulletin, Oct 77. Pg 900, reported that the Marburg, Ebola Zaire and Ebola Sudan were "morphologically indistinguishable" though antibody studies showed differences between outbreaks on Germany and Yogoslavia in 1967 and those of the Ebola river valley in 1976. Sudan and Zaire were so named to distinguish them from the original Marburg virus.
Have to run....to be continued. -
Abaddon
SJG
You do realise that "morphologically indistinguishable" means they LOOK the same, which they would do, as all three Ebolas and Marburg are filoviruses; the ONLY filoviruses. Why do you think that fact is so significant?
Of course, the fact they are the only viruses of the type mean, if you're suggesting human development of the viruses, you are postulating that scientists developed a totally new type of virus. Is this likely when there are so many that would respond dreadfully well to inspired 'tweaking'? Can you give other examples of humans developing a totally new form of virus?
Also, how do you account for examples of 'in wild' contamination. Did the scientists send some lab monkeys back to Africa on their holidays? Two seperate Marburg cases are known to have visited the same cave near Lake Victoria, and that is the area the infected Green Monkeys come from. As filoviruses can live and spread in bats, although we're yet to find bats with the disease in the wild, the 'cave + bat shit + bats + filovirus' hypothesis is better than anything you've given us.
And look at Leo's thread on 'Women in 1st century church'. That is 12 pages of A4 long. I think EvilForce was unlucky with his posting problems, and that you are possibly being paranoid... and I haven't the patience to wait for your stunning evidence in drips and drabs to be honest.
Write your entire case for Marburg/Ebola being man made, with references, post it, and I'll reply.