Races - where do they come from?

googlemagoogle

this one goes out to all the evolution maniacs out there, king james bible bumpers are also welcome to present their view.

even when i still believed in the bible as god's word, i never understood how (at least) three races came from 2 persons. i sometimes thought, maybe adam was black and eve white, but where does the mongol race come from then?

well now as a convinced atheist i still would like to have an answer to that. did races develop independently by some sambian monkeys becoming huge black homeboys, some viking monkeys becoming blond white nerds and some asian monkeys starting to cook chinese food or do all races have the same origin and developed from there? what is current knowledge on this topic?

i thought about it, because neandertals are thought to have been independent from homo-sapiens as well as the homo-florensis.

doofdaddy

Er, maybe you should look closer to home for a neanderthal

willy_think

There is only the human race, color of skin, hear, shapes of features are all only family resemblance. We have created arbitrary distinctions based on skin color. Races are only man made classifications that do not exist outside of our need to group “like” things together.

Leolaia

did races develop independently by some sambian monkeys becoming huge black homeboys, some viking monkeys becoming blond white nerds and some asian monkeys starting to cook chinese food or do all races have the same origin and developed from there?

I think it's a little unfortunate that you mentioned "black homeboys" first; it gives a very different impression of your thinking than what I think you are saying.

The evolution answer would be (1) races don't exist are discrete categories genetically and (2) the variation in characteristics across the species is due to local adaptations and diffusion through population movement. All agree that the species as a whole arose within the Homo genus relatively recently (e.g. no separate evolution from "monkeys"), there is however a multiregional versus single-origin debate as to whether H. sapiens arose from H. erectus or H. ergaster at only one place (e.g. Africa) or it occurred in various different places since H. erectus had migrated already to Asia and Europe. The genetic evidence mainly supports the single-origin hypothesis. All the relatively minor physical differences between regions (skin pigmentation, hair color and texture, eyelid, size of nose, relative length of limbs, etc.) is due to usual adaptation. This is not speciation which is what most laypeople think of as evolution, but it does involve evolutionary processes. Short limb length conserves heat in cold places, darker pigmentation blocks ultraviolet rays in tropical latitudes (which destroy folic acid and raises the risk of skin cancer), lighter pigmentation increases one's exposure to sunlight at higher latitudes to increase production of Vitamin D, sickle-cell anemia in tropical regions is a natural defense against malaria in those areas, etc.

googlemagoogle

well, this is not about racism or ethics, it's about evolution. maybe another question would be: do we all originate from the same animal that lived a few hundret thousand years ago, or did evolution towards humankind take place several times and got all mixed along the way?

googlemagoogle

ok, sorry if i touched some nerve there, as i used a stereotype for all races. thought this would be clear...

Leolaia

See my above post on multi-regionalism and the Out-of-Africa or single-origin hypothesis. The genetic evidence is pretty easy to find on the web. Just Google "multi-regionalism" "Out-of-Africa" in your search field.

googlemagoogle

ah, that's interesting leolaia. human races don't exist, never thought of that but makes a lot of sense. i'm very interested in the multi-origin theorie, because of the neandertal and homo-florensis. do you have any links?

[edited to add:] didn't see your last post. i'll go googling. thanks.

doofdaddy

Good on yer lad, apology accepted.

I'll let others do the debating. It's been a long day at work...

Abaddon

There are two competitve theories for the development of races.

One, multiregionalism, is not as popular as it once was as the competitive model, 'Out-of Africa' has far more (but not conclusive) support.

As genetic variation of H. sap as a species is less than that found within a troupe of chimps, we know one thing; at a certain point there were less than 10,000 of 'us', and it is since then that 'race' has developed. Many put this event to c.100,000 years ago but sure you'll forgive me if I just do this from memory!

MR says that the local races of H. sapiens are descended from local populations of H. erectus. OoA says that local race developed after dispersal. In all honesty if it weren't for some continuation of regional differences in H. erectus and H. sap poulations at a given site, MR would be a dead duck as there is no genetic basis for it.

The fact there is a continuation of regional differences is the big clue; it is the region which give the difference. The factors causing the development of race are the same as those causing the development of species, but not to the point where interfertility is lost. A more correct term is 'clines.' Negros and Asians are from different clines. Black-headed gulls from different parts of the world with different markings are from different clines too.

Original populations coming out of Africa would have had dark skins. Light skins evolved in northern populations as there was postive selection pressure on the lightest skinned members of the local population as they were able to synthesize vitamin D better from sunlight.

Body shape is influenced by climate, thus the differences between an Inuit 'cline' and a Amazonian Indian 'cline', and indeed Caucasian and African clines. Earliest H. sap populations in Europe have African morphology (body size and proportion) and later develop 'caucasian' morphology.as those with a body shape better suited to European climate had postive selection pressure.

Add in 'founder effects', where a certain trait (not neccesarily a good one) is over-represented in the founding population of a cline, and that's about it.

Races - where do they come from?

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