What happened to Babylon the Great? Why is it still here?

by truthseeker 35 Replies latest jw friends

  • mustang

    "The WTS always covers its a** by having 2 contradictory teachings."

    You bet!!!! This is DUAL OPPOSING DOCTRINES, WTS @ it?s best. This is their "secret to success"; well, that and the CYA thing (Cover Your A$$).

    A prime example of the CYA scheme is the 1925 vs. 1975 fiasco's (yes, that's fiasco plural). They greatly learned from 1925. Da Judge let it all hang out: the WT actually said 1925 was a solid biblical date. By 1975, they had learned how to keep their foot in both boats, just hint, pass things along by word-of-mouth, then weasel out of it (plausible deniability) and for the grand finale: BLAME IT ON THE OVERZEALOUS BRETHREN!!!

    Oh, and a quiet, low key, stealth, invisible half-hearted apology 10? years later makes it all straight (right?)!!!

    Poster uncle_onion wrote a LENGTHY dissertation on this, as a letter to his relatives:


    Bring lunch or dinner when you read uncle_onion's post. But he has the Watchtower quotes that nailed Da Judge in black and white!! It's worth the price of admission.


  • sf

  • Leolaia

    • The Fall of Babylon of Great occurred in the past:

    *** w65 11/1 p. 663 It Makes a Difference What God You Worship ***

    In 1919 Babylon the Great fell and her hold on those who wish to be released is now broken. Many have left her false religious systems since that date.

    *** w80 5/15 p. 19 "Get Out of Her, My People" ***

    Despite committing religious fornication with all the politicians of the nations, Babylon the Great suffered a shocking fall in 1919, as far as influence and power are concerned. It shocked her when the Greater Cyrus, the Lamb Jesus Christ, secured the liberation of the remnant of spiritual Israelites and set them to work on spiritual reconstruction.

    *** re chap. 36 p. 260 The Great City Devastated ***

    So by 1919 Babylon the Great had fallen, opening the way for God's people to be released and restored, in one day as it were, to their land of spiritual prosperity. (Isaiah 66:8) By that year, Jehovah God and Jesus Christ, the Greater Darius and the Greater Cyrus, had maneuvered matters so that false religion could no longer keep a hold on Jehovah's people.

    *** ip-2 chap. 6 p. 78 Jehovah--"A Righteous God and a Savior" ***

    Jehovah's worshipers know that the event foreshadowed by the fall of Babylon in 539 B.C.E.--the fall of "Babylon the Great" --already occurred back in 1919. Still, they look forward to the destruction of that modern-day religious organization as well as the promised removal of the political system under Satan's control, the abyssing of Satan, and the coming of new heavens and a new earth

    • The Fall of Babylon the Great is still future:

    *** w51 1/1 p. 31 Questions from Readers ***

    The October 1, 1949, Watchtower dealt with the "day of Jehovah" upon antitypical Babylon, which is described in Isaiah 13. That day in type arrived back there when ancient Babylon fell. It arrives in our time when Great Babylon, the Devil's organization, falls. So that "day" for Jehovah's strange act, his battle of Armageddon, is still future. We pray for it.

    *** w66 10/15 p. 631 Rejoicing over "God's Sons of Liberty" Spiritual Feast ***

    Does it mean that Armageddon is going to be finished, with Satan bound, by 1975? It could! It could! All things are possible with God. Does it mean that Babylon the Great is going to go down by 1975? It could.

    *** w80 7/1 p. 17 The Watchman Said: "She Has Fallen!" ***

    Till now Babylon the Great has ridden upon the League's successor, the United Nations. But, shortly now, the political backers of the United Nations will tire of being dominated by the world empire of false religion and will dump her off and destroy her. Then, after the "watchman" calls out, "Babylon the Great has fallen," they will turn, full force, against the surviving Christian witnesses of Jehovah....

    In view of the impending fall of Babylon the Great, now more than ever before it is the time for the "watchman" class and the "great crowd" to sound out the divine command: "Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues." (Rev. 18:4) Yes, "get out of her," not to join her political paramours or the faithless anti-God forces of this world (Gotta love the irony!), but to become part of "my people," Jehovah's dedicated people.

    *** w80 10/15 p. 23 Execution of the "Great Harlot" Nears ***

    As with ancient Babylon, modern Babylon's speedy overthrow will prove to be a great shock to the world. (Rev. 18:9-19)

    So which is it?

  • New Worldly Translation
    New Worldly Translation

    The whole politics turning on religion thing never made any sense. It was inconceivable that every political entity on earth would turn against every religious organization for some unknown reason. It was interesting reading Leolaia's post cos according to the org. BTG has fallen and got up more times than a drunk on a cobbled street.

    Like has been said it's totally ludicrous the way the org. try to shoehorn some trippy halucinations by a geriatric old duffer 2000 years ago into modern day parallels. They'll probably change the identities of the beasts and harlot in revelation soon cos it will give them an excuse to print another book for the dubs to flog.

  • greendawn

    But aren't the watchtower people themselves part of Babylon the great by the way they enslave and exploit and ill treat their followers spiritually and emotionally? IMO they are one of the more cunning and obnoxious parts of babylon, they lie, deceive, and manipulate ruthlessly as most people on this board will readily testify.

    So do they really want to see babylon fall? I don't think so as they are part and parcel of it it's another one of their many lies.

    Remember how GB member Sydlik treated those who decided to study the bible by itself (no watchtower magazines) in Bethel, he degraded them called them worms, leeches, spiritual fornicators and had them kicked out of the WTS just imagine it, because they were studying the Bible without watchtowers. That's a sure hallmark of a babylonian.

    And they made a hell of a lot of money out of religion.

  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas

    When we realize that the chief architect of JW dogma was Freddy Franz, much becomes clear.

    Franz was convinced of the "trooth" and became a coleportuer in 1914 - before Russell's death - and he moved to Bethel in 1920, where he served Rutherford and after him, Knorr as the Watchtower's resident seer. Then he became president of the WTS in 1977. He died in 1992 having seen not a single one of his insane prophecies come true.

    Today the WTS has no lack of power-hungry antisocial schemers and sincere but daft true believers, but none of them has the sheer testicular arrogance that Frederick William Franz was capable of summoning, for it was HIS voice that made the Jehovah sock-puppet speak.

    Today the leadership of the WTS has little trouble identifying those things they believed that were wrong, for HISTORY is a very capable instructor, but the Governing Body hasn't yet figured out what the f*ck they do believe.

  • greendawn

    Nathan N is it a case of them not knowing what they should believe or of knowing but not practicing it because it's not in their interests?

    I detect so much subtle manipulation in the GB's handling of the JWs it has to be carefully planned and all done by design there is a definite intention to deceive and exploit.

    We have people here promoting the interests of a big business empire while pretending to promote the spiritual interests of a religious body of follopwers, very genuine babylonians.

  • DannyBear

    Nathan said;

    Today the WTS has no lack of power-hungry antisocial schemers and sincere but daft true believers, but none of them has the sheer testicular arrogance that Frederick William Franz was capable of summoning, for it was HIS voice that made the Jehovah sock-puppet speak.

    Great stuff Nathan!

    Ever since the wtbs lost Freddy......they have been floundering in the wind as respects down and dirty fortune telling. Freddy just had a way with words, he summoned up more paranoia and fear amongst the r&f than any other, well with the exception of da judge maybe.

    Jeez if these people would just go back and read some of the crap he wrote, maybe they would wake up.....pipe dream I know.

    Enjoyed your comments Nathan.


  • Maverick

    The WTS has no clue. They have no more insight to the Bible than my cat does. Throw out all the special, inside knowledge you got for those dummies! All the crap they filled your head with is anti-knowledge. It's fiction, fantasy, and foolish!

  • DannyBear

    'The boys in the writing dept' are steeped in the tradition of fortune telling. Every administration since Charles Taze has had it's cause celeb.

    Taze was mesmermized by the 'second coming', Rutherford was obsessed with Christendom, Knorr was a stuffed shirt that let Freddy spell out Jehovah's own thinking on things, Knorr serving as the major 'prick' enforcer of all the talmud like policy he could muster. Not to mention his love of dressing down anyone he presumed was not living up to his standard.

    After Franz was gone the poor dubs had no one to shore them up, to boost thier spirits. Instead they had to watch every single promise veiled or outspoken fall by the wayside. 1914 was huge, Babylon the Great, the 'great tribulation', 6000 yrs of mans exsistance.

    God what a pitiful record they have!

    Heaven forbid the day they actually call something right. They would be beside themselves for another 120yrs, never letting anyone forget about it.


Share this