Advantages to being a JW

by MGonzales 63 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • whyamihere
    whyamihere

    Which lie? That God exists? That God is love? Or something JW specific?

    Mark,

    I don't know if this was a hack on me or what. Anyway, I guess when a Elder can lie over decades and never be caught is a great Liar! Also, if a group of elders all admit something(that they were wrong) to you and then lie to the Society about the matter that saves their asses... that is a great Lie! All I have ever known were lies! I am not speaking for others I am only telling you what I know and have seen!-

    So YES it makes you a great Liar! I am not saying those who truly believe in it are lying because they don't know the truth. However those who Plainly lie to your face over and over and over are great Liars and that's what I am talking about! They are Good at it!

    Brooke!

  • MGonzales
    MGonzales

    Deputy Dog, most people aren't students of the Bible and my example was to show that words have been added (or removed) from the Bible over biases.

    I remember reading about this once in a Catholic Encyclopedia, how it was the Church's decision to remove the text and I applaud them for that. They seem to have wanted to correct an error. But how could such a blatant error ever be made in the first place? And more importantly, how did it slip through the cracks for so long (how many centuries?).

    If I understand it correctly, Protestant Bibles were translated from Catholic sources which include the erroneous text thus the damage has been done (if it doesn't belong). My point is that the Word of God (if there is such a thing) was both altered and went unchecked and I can't help but wonder what other "slipups" (maybe more subtle ones) haven't been discovered yet?

    I come down pretty hard on the RCC about this although they ultimately seemed to have done the right thing, because I believe the erroneous text was inserted at a time when the lay person would have been tortured and executed by the Church for merely possessing a copy of the Bible. They were the sole keepers of the Word at the time and didn't keep it pure. Not good.

  • MGonzales
    MGonzales

    Brooke, I wasn't trying to be a butt-much but I had no clue what you were talking about (kinda vague). Now I do.

    P.S. I'm sure I just need to figure out what I'm doing, but I've never had the troubles on other message boards that I'm having on this one (i.e. formatting, text size, where did it just put me?, etc.). Heck, I guess I still prefer the simplicity of Usenet newsgroups using Outlook Express.
    --


    Mark

  • NeonMadman
    NeonMadman
    NeonMadman, you were a JW for 30 years and didn't learn the Bible?

    Oh, I'm not saying I didn't learn anything about the Bible. I knew all the proof texts, and I knew the basic outline of the Bible stories. In fact, I was well respected in the congregations as being very knowledgeable. But I'm saying I didn't know the Bible with any thoroughness. I couldn't have given you a good outline of the history of Israel. I didn't have any reasonable understanding of, for example, the book of Romans, in which Paul outlines the means of salvation and explains God's grace. I had no idea as to the historical-grammatical method of Bible interpretation - didn't need to, since all interpretation was spoon-fed by the organization.

    I couldn't have told one prophet from another (possibly with the exceptions of the ones the WTS actually wrote books about), except to use them as a source of proof texts. I couldn't have told you, for example, that Zephaniah wrote during Josiah's reigh, that his book was apocalyptic in nature and emphasized the Day of the Lord, that the book divides more or less evenly between God's judgment and blessing or that it promises an ultimate reconciliation between Israel and God - you know what I could have told you about Zephaniah? It was the book that had the text about "probably you may be concealed in the day of Jehovah's anger." That's it. That's about the only way the Society ever used the book, so that's all I knew.

    New Testament? Oh, I knew all the proof texts against the deity of Christ and the Trinity, but I never even knew that John 20:28 existed until a born-again Christian pointed it out to me. Because you can be sure the Society never brings up that text.

    And I was, as I have said, considered very knowledgeable. Know why? Because I knew the Watchtower inside and out. And because, in the later years after I had decided it wasn't the Truth, I started studying the Bible apart from the Watchtower pubs, which gave me a lot of insight that the JWs who just followed the Society's program were not getting.

    I'm not saying that the average JW doesn't know more Bible than the average non-JW (putting aside that I think their interpretations are wrong). But that's because the average JW knows a little Bible (i.e., basic Bible stories and proof texts), while the average non-JW knows virtually no Bible at all. When I came out of the organization, I started attending a "new believer's" class at a Baptist church, and I have often said that I learned more Bible in 12 weeks in that class than I did in 30 years as a JW. And it's not a matter of interpretation - I'm not saying that the Baptists were "right" and the JWs were "wrong" - what I'm saying is that the Baptists actually studied the Bible, while the JWs studied other publications, with virtually no direct Bible study. JWs call themselves Bible students, but they are not - they are students of Watchtower publications. The pity of it all is that most JWs think of themselves as Bible experts, when they are actually quite impoverished in that area.

  • ellderwho
    ellderwho

    Neo-

    But I'm saying I didn't know the Bible with any thoroughness. I couldn't have given you a good outline of the history of Israel. I didn't have any reasonable understanding of, for example, the book of Romans, in which Paul outlines the means of salvation and explains God's grace. I had no idea as to the historical-grammatical method of Bible interpretation - didn't need to, since all interpretation was spoon-fed by the organization.

    My point exactly. The JW cannot think outside the wt box or for themselves. They never give their own answer. Have you ever seen a witness give an indepth answer without referencing a wt book?

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    Mark

    Deputy Dog, most people aren't students of the Bible and my example was to show that words have been added (or removed) from the Bible over biases.

    You mean most "JWs" aren't students of the bible, they are students of the WT.

    If I understand it correctly, Protestant Bibles were translated from Catholic sources which include the erroneous text thus the damage has been done (if it doesn't belong). My point is that the Word of God (if there is such a thing) was both altered and went unchecked and I can't help but wonder what other "slipups" (maybe more subtle ones) haven't been discovered yet?

    You don't understand it correctly. The "slipups" happened when one scribe would copy another's notes as part of the text by accident. It was hard to tell the difference because they were both hand written. It had nothing to do with biases. This is why some rely on the older manuscripts.

    They were the sole keepers of the Word at the time and didn't keep it pure. Not good.

    The older manuscripts show that over all they did a very good job.

    There is much more to studying the bible than knowing the order of the books.

    D Dog

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    My point is it's not an "advantage" to have someone tell you what the bible says.

  • MGonzales
    MGonzales

    Well, the point of my thread wasn't to defend JWs but how many people do you know believe what they believe because they read the Bible and formulate their own beliefs? Come on, people! We believe what our religion teaches us to believe and to many (if not most) it's usually just basic stuff anyway! People are usually born into a religion and stick with those beliefs, if they even KNOW what all their church teaches. Of course some do and some even disagree with their Church (not being JWs they have that freedom).

    The people I know trust that their Church teaches them correctly and have no interest in investigating further. Hmm...like JWs, I suppose.

    I realize this may not apply to many of you though, I mean you people are spending time on a religious message board for Christ's sake!
    --

    Mark

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    Mark

    The people I know trust that their Church teaches them correctly and have no interest in investigating further. Hmm...like JWs, I suppose.

    Good point! I guess I found the Catholic Church wanting (as a child). It doesn't teach the bible very well. Just look at the Pope and what he tought.

    D Dog

  • Doubtfully Yours
    Doubtfully Yours

    Growing up a JW here in the USA, daughter of immigrants that didn't speak the language and therefore attending a Spanish congregation taught me to speak, read, and write Spanish perfectly. That's a major plus in this day and age where knowing more than one language is golden.

    DY

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