I am right about this dude. He is seriously in denial. You should take a look at some of the debates him and AlanF have had in the past.. it was the final nail in the coffin for me leaving the WTBTS. Poor guy.
GBL
How does the Society refute the 607/1914 discrepancy?
by ithinkisee 42 Replies latest watchtower bible
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No Apologies
I am right about this dude. He is seriously in denial. You should take a look at some of the debates him and AlanF have had in the past.. it was the final nail in the coffin for me leaving the WTBTS. Poor guy.
You hear that Scholar? You were instrumental in helping GetBusyLiving to realize the truth about the TROOF!!! I am so envious of you, I have yet to help anyone break free from the Watchtower's clutches.
I salute you, Scholar!
No Apologies
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Ticker
Very good point I had not thought of before Liberty
*1914 is rendered useless with the passage of time. The watchtower just ran out of time.*
I believe this, the longer it goes on the further and further 1914 will drift from memory but maybe thats what they want. I think they did run out of time as I think their glory years are far gone and now its all plateu. Interesting thoughts, thanks.
Ticker
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Poztate
Apparently you didn't see my scholarly post on this very issue. Everything explained!
Wow....You sure did a lot of research on this topic...I am impressed...You are the best..
I am sure the strongest of JW apologists would see the point and have to agree with you.
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confusedjw
I am right about this dude. He is seriously in denial.
I think Scholar has slide over into the outright lying catagory.
Defend the cult at all costs!
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hillary_step
Scholar,
When you see your friend make sure that you tell him that despite the weight of secular evidence scholars cannot agree on the following:
1. A precise calender date for the Fall of Jerusalem
2. A definite calender year for the beginning and end of the seventy years
3. The length of the seventy years and whether it is literal or symbolic
4. The end of the Assyrian World Power
5. A king list for the Divided Monarchy
6. The historical value or merit of Ptolemy's Canon
7. A Absolute Date for securing pivotal dates for the Old Testament
....and yet you gladly suck at the teats of the whore who would abandon her children for suggesting that the very matters that you descibe above may not be the life or death matter that the WTS has made them. Think of the ashes of those burned by the Watchtower for suggesting exactly what you have done in your post above. You a hypocrite serving hypocrites Scholar.
HS
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upside/down
The real important point to be made is not the " how many angels can dance on the head of a pin?" details of these dates but rather the plain cold reality that it doesn't matter. 1914 is a useless date. NOTHING HAPPENED. Christ did not return and does not rule "invisibly" for the last 91 years doing nothing. What has he done? Even the WT Society has given up on this date as a marker for the big "A". It is a useless date rendered so by the passage of time and not apostate opinion. Do you understand? It doesn't matter. If Jesus came back 91 years ago what is he waiting for? The Bible didn't say he'd return and then do nothing! Why is this date important to you since your own leadership is trying to put it behind them?
Dead on!
I guarantee you that 99.99% of the Dubs out there couldn't even begin to grapple with this subject, that's why it's avoided like the plague. That's why they have a FDS class (clergy) to deal with that "stuff' so they don't have to. This is where the average Dub fails miserably- their personal study. No different than the Catholic that relegates spiritual matters to the priest or Pope and is content to let them deal with these matters. Very 'christendomish", coming from an org that claims to hate "christendom".
Does everyone forget the questionings that got them in the "troof" in the first place? Apparently so! WTS "milk" is so sweet, but it's not real food and definitely not for spiritual "adults".
I think I feel my "wisdom teeth" coming in.... especially since I started teething on JWD1
u/d
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M.J.
I was looking forward to doing a mathematical check of the Bible
7 x 360 = 2520 -607 + 2520 +1 (no zero year) = 1914
prophecy concerning the year 1914 ... My mind was set on finding mathematical inconsistencies
in the presentation, but I found none.I have no Ph.D, but my own meticulous calculations shown above show that, by jove, he must be onto something!!!
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JCanon
Even if I were still a hard core JW I'd be having a hard time understanding how 1914 could have any meaning 100 years after the fact. If this was the start of the signs of the "Last Days" then the warning is of no use to the several generations who have lived and died since then. If the weather service issued a tornado warning a year before it is to occur at some unknown date then the warning is meaningless. How long can you stay is a storm celler on the off chance it might hit in a year or so? Why would God play such a silly game? It all makes no sense. But you maybe right, he just doesn't get it.
Hi Liberty II. You're right, it seems a bit meaningless in the context of how the witnesses present it. But it is not meaningless when you follow the scriptures specifically. Thus 1914 does begin the "last generation" that would begin a series of events, beginning with a world war that would lead to the appearance of Christ within a "generation", which is 80 years. Where most people go astray is not following closely what the Scriptures says regarding the second coming. That is, when Christ comes it is at the time Satan is kicked out of heaven and the kingdom is established, so it is important to be ready so that one can get into the kingdom. But Armageddon does not come immediately. Satan is banished to the earth and then there is an interval of time when Christ then gathers the anointed and judges the world. Thus it is important to know the chronology and watch so that one can get into the kingdom during this interval after the kingdom is set up before Armageddon. That's why it was important to identify 1914 and the last days. So it IS/WAS significant until Armageddon comes to realize there's a chance to get into the kingdom. Problem is, most persons don't realize what is supposed to be happening immediately after the second coming. The other problem is that if you read the Bible carefully, you'll see that the Messiah doesn't arrive until near the very end of that generation, not in 1914. The signs lead up to the second coming, including the "great tribulation" which was the HOLOCAUST. Basically everything happens before the Messiah arrives and thus they become "signs" to confirm his arrival. But witnesses are so focussed on 1914 they ignore the scriptures, like Matthew 24:36 (I believe) which clearly says even the great tribulation would occur before the Messiah arrives, "Immediate AFTER the tribulation of those days....then the sign of the son of man would appear." So definitely, if you are following the Watchtower, it will seem confusing. If you follow the Bible then it all fits into place. But I'm like you. I don't accept the WTS version because it doesn't make sense, but when I consider the direct Biblical version, then it does make sense.
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JCanon
7 x 360 = 2520 -607 + 2520 +1 (no zero year) = 1914
Sorry MJ, but you are FOUR YEARS OFF! 607BCE is based upon 70 years from the 1st of Cyrus to the fall of Jerusalem based upon the 70 years the land was desolate. The WTS quotes Josephus to confirm this chronology originally existed, which is good, the Babylonians did revise their chronology. BUT....Josephus and the Jews do not date the 70 years from the fall of Jerusalem but when the last Jews were finally deported! That was not year 19 but year 23! Thus the Jews that ran down to Egypt that were not killed returned back to Jerusalem and then were deported in year 23. (Jeremiah 44:14,28) That means, the 70 years actually dates the year of the last deportation, not the fall of Jerusalem. So even if you accepted 537BCE for the year the Jews returned per secular re-dating, the 70 years would establish 607BCE as year 23 of Nebuchadnezzar, not the fall of Jerusalem, the fall of Jerusalem would have to be dated 4 years earlier to 611BCE. That means the 2520 years per the Bible (even with the wrong dating) would not fall in 1914 but in 1900. So no matter what, 1914 is miscalculated and the WTS misquotes Josephus regarding the 70 years. Proving Biblically that the 70 years began with the last deportation in year 23 (Jer. 52:30) is the easiest way to debunk the 1914 doctrine by Jehovah's witnesses, since you are doing it via the Bible and not arguing about ancient chronology. JC