After 4 years, I finally had JWs at my door today!

by bebu 28 Replies latest jw friends

  • bebu

    Yesterday I saw two women walking slowly around the end of our street, waiting on porches of empty homes. I told my husband, "Look, there are 2 JWs. We haven't had them come here for 4 years--ever since I mentioned that I had some serious questions (but had never enumerated any points at all)." My husband said, "Guess we've been on the do-not-call list." I agreed.

    Today, those 2 same women knocked on my door. I had fallen asleep after getting the kids out, and when they knocked my dog barked up a storm. I thought, "No... it couldn't be..." and I looked out the window and saw those 2 women slowly leaving my porch.

    Clad in my pjs and a bathrobe, I answered the door, and the ladies returned and one began her little spiel about "Don't you think..." "As a parent, don't you worry..." and I kinda shrugged thru those things. Then I said, "I have a question for you. How long have you been a JW?" They looked very, very happy.

    One has been in since 1988, the only one in her family to join. The other became a JW 50 years ago (her mother converted from Lutheranism). I asked what made them feel confident about becoming a witness. One said it was the only place where she got BIBLICAL answers to her questions. The other said, in a paraphrase, that her mother was anxious about hellfire, as only good people went to heaven and bad people went to hell (this from a LUTHERAN, of all things!). Of course, her mother began to feel the trinity was bogus after studying a bit with JWs, and it all went (downhill) from there.

    Our discussion was probably a bit different than they expected, but it allowed me to get a feel for where they were, perhaps. Only one of them has the internet, but doesn't use it much (but there is hope! ). One has several children, but none of them were ever baptized. (They were very proud of the fact that they didn't baptize infants, and force a choice on them. I commented, well, nobody truly forces a choice on an infant anyway, really...)

    We touched on many, many things. Me playing the uncertain innocent, asked to clarify things as they all came along the pike. And my, so many things came. It wasn't a showdown in any sense, but I decided I wasn't going to tell them what I knew they believed, but clarify what I'd understood... like, 607 BCE not being the destruction of Jerusalem. NOTE: They told me that 607 marked the beginning of the exile from Jerusalem, and brushed off my question about hearing it being published as the destruction of Jerusalem. So, has anything been slowly switched around? Has there been a flash of new light?

    They talked about Luther, and other reformers as if they were recognized by the WT as their heritage! I asked if the JWs accepted Lutheran theology, since they admit that he had indeed acted by God's guidance. They hesitated. I explained that sometimes people do certain things I can agree with, but I definitely wouldn't be using them as examples for my point of view if we were truly different. Why do the JWs refer to reformers at all, if they are unwilling to also agree with any of their basic theology? ...?

    I returned to Lutheranism, and mentioned that it was odd that the Lutheran mom had not known her own theology. Anyone could easily find Luther's writing and discover whether they had really understood his comments at all. The Lutheran catechism is also easily available anywhere, so it was odd to me that she didn't know her beliefs weren't actually Lutheran.

    Following this line, I asked if WT writings were available from the early days. One gave me the WT's official website address. I asked if they cataloged old writings there; she didn't know. She told me she would bring a book she simply calls "JP"--something about proclaiming?--which would give the history of the WT. I asked her if old writings were in it, or simply their own biography. She didn't really answer that one.

    Very nice ladies. The younger one seemed a bit nervous. She does this 6 days a week, she says; and she admitted that she doesn't enjoy it much but does it anyway since 'God is important to her'. She admitted that she prayed every day (looked a bit disheartened here) for holy spirit to help her in the work she was doing. She would not say that she had been filled, when I pressed for clarification.

    The other one, I am now guessing, is a friend of my JW neighbor (who has since moved, but I did not mention it here before). This older one has been very, very kind to my JW neighbor out of all the congregation, so I am hoping this is indeed who I think it might be. I have a personal motivation to help gently get this older lady out of the tower--keeping my JW neighbor's friendships intact on the outside. I hope (and pray) for all of them to come out.

    I'll be brewing coffee here soon--maybe tomorrow! I'll also make sure I'm not in pj's and bathrobe. (And I will have them use the back door, or they will see a little too many book titles in my front room booshelves and the ploy will be over.)


  • confusedjw

    NOTE: They told me that 607 marked the beginning of the exile from Jerusalem, and brushed off my question about hearing it being published as the destruction of Jerusalem. So, has anything been slowly switched around? Has there been a flash of new light?

    That is quite interesting really. Since the WT has only referred to it as the date of Jerusalem's destruction, but the WT could see the need to switch this to deal with the growing body of knowledge that a.) Overwhelming evidence shows 587 to be the actual date. b.) Using their own WT official record of the lineage of Babylonian kings, 587is determined to be the date of Jersalem's destruction c.) The prophesy in Daniel says that the 70 years of desolation was for the nations (plural) not just Jerusalem.

    I'm afraid you had apostates at your door as they are "running ahead"

  • M.J.

    I wish I had your chatting ability. Sounds like you did a great job of showing a personal interest in them and making them open up to you.

  • RunningMan
    she doesn't enjoy it much but does it anyway

    That's pretty honest of her. Not to mention typical of the JW experience.

  • BluesBrother

    well done, bebu.. I dont think I could have done what you did, without becoming confrontational - and then they would not have called back .. Sad for the girl to admit that she does it so much , and does not enjoy it.... Keep at it, there may be hope.

  • DaCheech
    she doesn't enjoy it much but does it anyway

    Ditto here! Never liked it!

    They even say it in a snickering fashion during experiences: "When I did my first day of service, I was praying for the householder not to be home!"

    No sh-t sherlock!

  • bebu
    I'm afraid you had apostates at your door as they are "running ahead"

    I asked them if things had changed from the time I'd read that point. They sure seemed certain that 607 BCE had only and always referred to the beginning of the end (captivity), not the end (destruction), of Jerusalem.

    MJ, it's easier to chat with people who make you feel at ease. Getting them off the questioning end, and asking the questions myself, is so much easier.

    Tomorrow I will tell them I had run into some odd things on the internet while wondering if I could find some old WT materials... and see if she can return next week to answer them... by then, I should have many more "interesting" questions.


  • Bubbamar

    I love it Bebu -- Please keep posting!!

    I can only pray that my mom comes across someone like you some day!

  • bebu
    Sadly, the peace and security of the nation did not last long. Though having God's Law, the Israelites did not observe it; they allowed selfishness to choke out their concern for others. This, along with apostasy, resulted in hardship to them individually and as a nation. Finally, in the year 607 B.C.E. , Jehovah allowed the Babylonians to destroy the kingdom of Judah, the city of Jerusalem, and even the magnificent temple there.

    From official WT site. Guess those ladies WERE racing ahead!


  • codeblue

    Bebu: good job

    I am surprised it took them 4 years to find you at home....

    I wish they would never call back on has been about 6 months...I guess when the CO shows up they will be a calling with the brother that works with NOdenial (he is on a spiritual high cause he would have been df'd for living with his "worldly" gf for 2 years...but he confessed and started a study with an elder).......

    But they never want to HEAR from me...I am the wife, the one without a (I attended more meetings and went in the f. service when we relocated here (NOdenial never went in f.service. During that f. service I had to show sister elder/pioneer where a scripture was to answer her return visit's question. After we left the r v.'s house, sister/elder/reg. pioneer asked me: Is this enought f. service time for you? I quickly said "yes" and never went out in the f service again. )...but do they want to talk to me.........NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO)

    Actually...I don't want them in out house...NOdenial let's them in to intrigue them with his newfound knowledge wants me as his witness that he doesn't say anything wrong...

    I told him: you are wasting your time and it just screws me up to see these men in my house and treat me like I don't have a BRAIN. They don't care anything about me....They only want our "time cards" from our old KH.


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