Another question from the new guy...

by SwampThing 20 Replies latest jw friends

  • SwampThing
    SwampThing

    Hello again,

    I have another question if you all would be so kind as to enlighten me. After reading hundreds of posts here, I understand now why some people stay in the WTS even though they would like to leave. The loss of friends, family members and such from this bizarre practice of "shunning" could be devastating in the lives of some people.

    However, what if there was someone who want?s out, and has nothing of the sort to lose? In other words, there are no family members involved, and once they realize the cult environment of the WTS, they really don?t consider the acquaintances they?ve made as friends. What then? Is there still some sort of dis-fellowship hearing or some such thing? If the person I am describing decides one day that he or she just doesn?t want any part of it any longer, and just doesn?t go back, do they still try to make you appear before the elders to explain yourself and accept their form of justice?

    If so, why would you show up for that meeting or whatever it?s called? (forgive my language, ladies) I think I would have a tendency to shake my thing at them and tell them where they could get off the train.

    All help in understanding is truly appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Swamp Thing

  • gcc2k
    gcc2k

    Someone who is baptised will be called in for a chat, and eventually a committee meeting (with 3 elders) where he/she will be asked a few pointed questions. Failure to answer those questions correctly will result in the indivual having disassociated him/herself by his/her response. Someone who just wants to leave can simply ignore any contact attempts by the elders, in which case they will have the meeting without the inidividual, and the same conclusion is reached. Sorry if the formatting of this post is off, I guess we still only support IE browsers (grrr)

  • Valis
    Valis

    I just wouldn't go back under the conditions that you are talking about. I would tell them to get stuffed and leave me be..You don't have to let them play thier stupid head games.

    Sincerely,

    District Overbeer

  • kls
    kls

    Hey SwampThing, usually a person would just do the fade. They would not have to face the elders unless they are being accused of something. But i have been out a long time and jw lit. changes ,so let's see what the rest of the forum say's.

  • XQsThaiPoes
    XQsThaiPoes

    Actually from what I have seen if you just leave then the elders do nothig much. How the JWs retain control is peer pressure if you dont have any peers in the Hall then they really just encourage you to make more meetings, study and go out more.

    THe problem is this hypothetical rarely happens because most people want a show down before they leave. Also they really dont DA you unless they really have to because it makes them look bad number wise and involves paper work. DAing means you are not "guilty" of anything so it is on of those things where if you slip off into the night they wont go running after you.

  • Valis
    Valis
    They would not have to face the elders unless they are being accused of something

    hi kls..not necessarily. Just because the elders accuse you of something certainly doesn't a good enough reason to go through a JC...especially if you can leave w/few strings attached.

    Sincerely,

    District Overbeer

  • kls
    kls

    SwampThing, what do you think now that you know what the jw cult really is? As an outsider looking in to this cult what do you think of their practices and beliefs? ,,,,,,,,Just curious

  • gitasatsangha
    gitasatsangha

    Swamp Thing,

    A person in that situation would probably not go through with a Judicial Tribunal Committee, since he has no reason to go though it, though he might just to be cantankerous and try to prove a point to the elders. He/She might, however right a letter stating their reasons for leaving, or just that they were leaving, in order to formally sever ties with the religious organization. That person would be considered Disassociated.

  • kls
    kls

    Valis, one of these days i am going to pull your nipple ring : >


    Very gently.

  • SwampThing
    SwampThing

    Thanks for the responses, everyone. You guys and gals are sure quick on the draw.

    KLS, as to your question, I still shake my head every night when I go to bed from what I read on this forum. The WTS has to be one of the most despicable organizations I have ever read about. You may find it strange, especially for someone who has never been a JW, but I probably spend a minimum of 3 to 4 hours a day reading this site and related JW sites. Yes, I have a reason.

    The best way I can think to explain my understanding of the WTS thus far is to relate to you that my wife comes from several very abusive past relationships. The last she was in was so bad that she is missing part of a finger due to her partner?s temper. She and I have had many discussion regarding why she stayed in the relationship as long as she did, and why she kept choosing men who wanted to beat her up. Her answers are very similar to what I have read on this board. As a side note, an odd part of our relationship now is that sometimes she does not know what to do with her freedom since she married me. It has taken her nearly 5 years to understand that I am not going to yell at her or beat her up if she wants to join a book club, or attend a party with friends she works with. Being controlled is what she always knew from men, and I didn?t fit the pattern. It caused us some problems early on, but now she is like a kid in a candy store when she bursts in the door to tell me how much fun she had at whatever event she just attended, without me present.

    So, what do I think now that I know what the JW cult really is? Well, to be honest, I am torn. One part of me wants to be angry with the man who has screwed me so bad, yet another part of me says he is not in his right mind, and is controlled by a cult, so I should be angry with the cult. I flip back and forth on this and it consumes me. It is very much like the circular argument of the chicken or the egg. I remember back when I watched Star Trek, and the Borg were first introduced into the series. I wondered to myself if the way to destroy them would be to have them ponder the question of the chicken and the egg, and watch their collective heads explode. Maybe that?s my answer.

    It is difficult for me to be critical of people who have been drawn in by the WTS. I am sure that when they were first introduced to it, they were well-meaning and felt that this is what they needed in their lives. Who am I to tell someone they cannot practice the religion of their choice? However, somewhere along the line I have to wonder at what point, if there is one, do you hold them accountable for their actions? At what point is the mother responsible for the damage she does to her children by shunning them? Or the elder for taking advantage of his position and destroying people?s lives?

    The past few weeks of reading this board has been a real education for me. Sun Tzu teaches that to be a victorious General, one must know his enemy better than the enemy knows himself. This was part of the reason I have spent so much time educating myself with regard to the Witness friend I mentioned upon my arrival here. The moral dilemma I am currently dealing with is that Sun Tzu also teaches that a victorious General exploits his enemy?s weaknesses in an effort to throw him off balance, and thus win the war. If I were dealing with a man who was in control of his own mind, I have no problem with that philosophy. But now that I know I am dealing with a man who?s mind is under the control of the WTS, is it right for me to take advantage of his weakness?

    Sorry to ramble....

    Most respectfully,

    Swamp Thing

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