No More Harboring Private Ideas!

by RationalWitness 40 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Flip

  Just wondering what You Know's thoughts are on this WT article.

  Although I agree YK’s posts sometimes serve as a comparative example, in this case the individual would have to be secure in the knowledge that he can take the pseudo high ground to respond, if only for awhile.

  Like those poor excuses for humanity he attempts to emulate, YK has proven to subscribe to the theory and promotion of FUD, which has always been this individual’s typical response, devoid of truth when necessary and mostly vacuous of “heart”, an excellent example of a Jehovah’s Witness, but still a "loose-cannon" nonetheless.

  Flip
• 

  mustang

  Farkel,

  Yes, I always laughed silently and shook my head about them carrying on the Golden Age w/ the 'g' designator. LOL.

  Mustang
  Still chuckling
• 

  waiting

  hey flip,

  Belief is highly over-rated when compared to cult conformity because drinking ‘spiked’ Kool-Aid or “shooting it out” with an alcohol and drug enforcement agency in Texas for example, is financially counter-productive and not an activity the smart cult would indulge. -Flip

  What an interesting idea. Remember that court case where Fred Franz and his lawyer said, under oath, that obedience (& conformity) were more important than being right? A Christian should be df'd if he *ran ahead* of the FDS, even if he was right?

  Just like the WTBTS knows that they have sexual deviants among their followers, and they know that many of their followers suffer from anxiety and depression - it would also be reasonable that the WTBTS would be safe in assuming that they might harbor *truly restless* socially violent/depressed among themselves. Just like schools, families, and the Postal Service found out.

  police for self-preservation. The side help would be more conformity, even in thought - average jw too frightened to be cast as "less than mature," "independent thinker," "secret doubter," "too many private opinions."

  Man, we could label with a critical eye for anything.

  waiting
• 

  RationalWitness

  Hi Flip,

  You said:

  Rational you miss the point of this article; the society is not trying to ‘legislate’ belief.

  I have to respond that everything the Society publishes is 'trying to "legislate" belief'. (Legislating and enforcing are slightly different things.) The quoted paragraphs could not be more clear about that.

  You are right, of course, that the article refers to the behavior of "mature Christians." And that would obviate using this as a single argument for disfellowshiping a dissident. But as I said in my response to Farkel, it does give the elders--particularly hardliners who will read it this way--license to pursue, i.e., to force the issue with ones who they know 'harbor private thoughts'. Not only does it provide a means of quarantining (as you rightly point out), but it will have a chilling effect on freedom of individual expression among JWs. Who wants to be saddled with the label 'immature' Christian?

  Rational

  Trust those who are searching for truth; doubt those who have found it.
• 

  Copernicus

  Articles like this one just flat piss me off, and are half the reason I’ll never return to a KH.

  It’s so typical of a high control group like the dubs to use this approach. Rather then just acknowledge that in the area of religion (as in all areas of human endeavor), it’s perfectly EXPECTED and NORMAL that one would have internal questions and doubt, they turn it around on the poor sap believer by making them guilty of a lack of faith for doing so. Then follows all the guilt and self-chastisement for ever having had the audacity to mentally question the bullshit you’re constantly being fed. Not to mention, the effect it could be having on your personal relationship with God. His having endowed us with the ability for independent thought is apparently one of Jehovah’s greatest misgivings – or so the WT would have us think.

  I never cease to be amazed at the confidence they have in their own propaganda, and the mental grip it holds over their followers. How else could they expect for a moment not to have the brother presenting such trash laughed off the platform for his efforts?

  Yes, rather then just deal with the perfectly justifiable reasons that many JW’s have doubts and harbor private ideas, they make it an issue of loyalty. Jesus said, “for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.” How then could anyone be coerced by blatant mind control (such as this article) into restraining themselves from verbalizing legitimate feelings and questions?

  In fact, how can a Christian be in oneness with fellow believers if he only believes or accepts a certain part of “the faith”?

  It appears the unquestioning belief is now formally being demanded by the WTS. This is astonishing in light of a WT article of several months ago that admitted there where MANY things they didn’t know. The siege mentality taking over in Brooklyn is becoming worse then I ever could have imagined.

  I remember when I first voiced (quietly and carefully) the fact that I harbored serious personal doubts about the org’s teachings and veracity. The response? They told me that if I kept my mouth shut, they’d make be an elder. Hmmmmmm. . . what does that tell you?

  There are many elders in this org who know that half the society’s stuff is pure bullshit, and yet for their own selfish reasons they continue to garnish it with a little sprig of parsley and serve it up as “spiritual food.”

  It’s enough to make me wish there was a burning hell.

  And I too am looking forward to observing YK’s application of this clear direction. The noose gets ever tighter, doesn’t it?
• 

  mustang

  "IMMATURE AND PROUD OF IT" tee-shirts, anyone??

  From pioneer to fence-sitter, you can do it, too.

  Mustang
  You don't have to reach out Class
• 

  wasasister

  This really is alarming. Can anyone sit through this WT study and not be struck by the amazing control going on? What stood out to me was this comment, defining the word "faith":

  Second, the expression “the faith” refers, not to the conviction that each individual Christian professes, but to the totality of our belief, “the breadth and length and height and depth” of it.

  Who gets to define "the totality of our belief"? Totality, totalitarian, hmmmm....

  This one is over the top. I wish I had more input from those of you who are obviously "in the know" as to who or what is being this noose tightening.

  An amazed Wasasister
• 

  CornerStone

  BIG PUSH, BIG PUSH, BIG PUSH!!!

  The org is doing EXACTLY what any high control group does when faced with the sustained loss of many of it's members, it's putting the SQUEEEEEEZ on them harder. This latest "New Light", (barf!), is just another example of that.

  Of course, as most reasoned people know, the harder you hold onto a handfull of sand, the more poores out between your fingers.

  I had planned on using this excerpt from the wretchtower as a defense against possible charges of apostacy:

  9 We now come to the matter of being loyal to Jehovah's visible organization. Certainly, we owe loyalty to it, including "the faithful and discreet slave," through which the Christian congregation is fed spiritually. (Matthew 24:45-47) Suppose that something appears in Watch Tower publications that we do not understand or agree with at the moment. What will we do? Take offense and leave the organization? That is what some did when The Watch Tower, many years ago, applied the new covenant to the Millennium. Others took offense at what The Watchtower once said on the issue of neutrality. If those who stumbled over these matters had been loyal to the organization and to their brothers, they would have waited on Jehovah to clarify these matters, which he did in his due time. Thus, loyalty includes waiting patiently until further understanding is published by the faithful and discreet slave.

  watchtower 3/15/96

  The same old tired EXCUSE of "waiting on Jehovah" that the org masters use on their adhearents I was going to use on them. "Well brothers, I'm just waiting on Jehovah."

  Now, it seems, ANY DOUBTS about the orgs belief system can be grounds for more serious punishment.

  First, since “oneness” is to be observed, a mature Christian must be in unity and full harmony with fellow believers as far as faith and knowledge are concerned. He does not advocate or insist on personal opinions or harbor private ideas when it comes to Bible understanding. Rather, he has complete confidence in the truth as it is revealed by Jehovah God through his Son, Jesus Christ, and “the faithful and discreet slave.” By regularly taking in the spiritual food provided “at the proper time”—through Christian publications, meetings, assemblies, and conventions—we can be sure that we maintain “oneness” with fellow Christians in faith and knowledge.—Matthew 24:45.

  wretchtower 8/1/01

  This is just the type of garbage that will give an "attitude adjustment" to any who have sincere questions about ANY doctrine or social issues the Borg have an opinnon on. Now, when there is doubt or concern about ANY issue, the elder drones can whip out this latest "gem" o knowledge and brow beat the poor sap by saying, "See here, it says MATURE Christians are not to "harbor private ideas when it comes to Bible understanding." SO STOP ( WHAP! ) THINKING ABOUT THINGS ( SLAP! ) THE SOCIETY HAS ALREADY ( BEAT! ) THOUGHT ABOUT FOR YOU! ( HIT!! HIT!! HIT!! )

  This "new light" makes it sooo much easier for elder drones to follow the letter of the law. Doubt and indecision = immaturity and possible DANGER to the congregation. Corrective action = d'fing. Case closed. Simple as pie.

  Ofcourse, it will be interesting to see, IMHO, the backlash that this type of Orwellean control will have on the "flock" and on the rest of the world who will pay attention to org issues.

  CornerStone
• 

  Copernicus

  Wasasister:

  While I understand your thought, I don’t think we’d have to be “in the know” to recognize the motivator here – it’s fear. Fear of being challenged by an ever more aware and knowledgeable flock, fear of the domino effect once their authority is broached, fear of being unable to contain the growing independence among free thinkers.

  Why control the group directly (they don’t really have the means to do so) when you can force individuals to control themselves, and view everyone else with suspicion? Much neater that way.

  I’ve said before that I think that not much is of concern to the GB. They’ve got their hide-a-way secured, and they can lay back and let the chips fall without damage to themselves. So why should they care? They’ve left to others the job of dealing with the consequences of their years of nasty little works.

  When I see stuff like this, I think I can see that the cat is out of the bag, so to speak. Garbage like this article is damage control, pure and simple. I wonder how many more fingers they’ve left to stick in the dike?
• 

  Amazing

  Hi RW: Excellent post. Many JWs will not see the thought-control behind this. They are primed to trust the Society, and simply see this as another loving provision to protect them from Satan's influence, or clean out those who succumb to apostasy. Hopefully, some, maybe many JWs will see this as going too far, and finally choose to leave. I have no doubt that this is exactly what the hardliners want, especially the Governing Body.

  They want a group of followers who will follow them to the death. If this trend continues, along with the incumbant corruption that such power holds, it will eventually lead to a Jim Jones type of group, where they are reduced in ranks, but what is left are willing to drink cyanide coolaid.

  This type of corrupt power is very addictive, needing to test the boundaries of its insane demands more and more, until the only thing left is to test people to death. While this will drive away members, there are those who remain, because their need to be dominated is an opposite but equal addiction, needing more and more fixes to feel secure in this demonstration of total loyalty. Finally, the few left are not just willing to drink poison coolaid, but they often beg for it.

  In the past, the JW poison coolaid was to engage in behavior that brought about persecution, not that that is bad in itself, to stand for one's belief, but these stands were artificially induced by the Judge and subsequent policy makers. But, with the above level of thought-control that the Watchtower has published, the only thing that seems to remain before the 'literal' poison is issued to the rank and file, is the Watchtower article that deliberates on the actual flavor, i.e. grape, lime, or cherry. Of course the flavor chosen will be according to Jehovah's will ... perhaps grape, as a fitting 'spirited-directed' symbol in which to carry out their insane behavior, symbolized by a blood oath.

  I have another related view on this that I will make a separate post about. Thanks again, RW for posting this latest level of Watch Tower control ... while it hurts to see them take this even lower road, it is not totally unexpected. - Amazing