Comments You Will Not Hear at the 5-30-04 WT Study (April 15, 2004)

by blondie 21 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Maverick
    Maverick

    Thank you Blondie!

    I wonder if sometimes they write up these kinds of articles so the RF can show non-JW's how wonderful they are. The publishers can point to these studies and use them as proof of the love and kindness they have. "See how the faithful slave encourage us to show kindness!"

    You made a good point about assuming that the statement made about an unkind world is just accepted without any real foundation. Never was I betrayed, insulted, and treated as poorly as when I was in the company of my "loving and kind" brothers. We were lead to believe we could let our guard down among the brotherhood! They are vicious at heart and clueless in thought! Maverick

  • cyber-sista
    cyber-sista
    Another story that went around was that Tommy James of the Shondells had studied also in the late 1960's and wrote the song "Crystal Blue Persuasion" about the "Truth" book.

    HAPPY DAD I heard this one too from a sister whose brother is a musician and was supposedly in the know, but this sister is rather delusional so don't know if it is true or not. Could be another JW urban legend

    But to go along with the above kindness song--here's a poem that I have loved.

    The House by the Side of the Road

    T HERE are hermit souls that live withdrawn

    In the place of their self-content;

    There are souls like stars, that dwell apart,

    In a fellowless firmament;

    There are pioneer souls that blaze the paths

    Where highways never ran-

    But let me live by the side of the road

    And be a friend to man.

    Let me live in a house by the side of the road

    Where the race of men go by-

    The men who are good and the men who are bad,

    As good and as bad as I.

    I would not sit in the scorner's seat

    Nor hurl the cynic's ban-

    Let me live in a house by the side of the road

    And be a friend to man.

    I see from my house by the side of the road

    By the side of the highway of life,

    The men who press with the ardor of hope,

    The men who are faint with the strife,

    But I turn not away from their smiles and tears,

    Both parts of an infinite plan-

    Let me live in a house by the side of the road

    And be a friend to man.

    I know there are brook-gladdened meadows ahead,

    And mountains of wearisome height;

    That the road passes on through the long afternoon

    And stretches away to the night.

    And still I rejoice when the travelers rejoice

    And weep with the strangers that moan,

    Nor live in my house by the side of the road

    Like a man who dwells alone.

    Let me live in my house by the side of the road,

    Where the race of men go by-

    They are good, they are bad, they are weak, they are strong,

    Wise, foolish - so am I.

    Then why should I sit in the scorner's seat,

    Or hurl the cynic's ban?

    Let me live in my house by the side of the road

    And be a friend to man.

    Sam Walter Foss

  • Gopher
    Gopher

    Sorry to take this thread a bit more off track...

    It was going around in the JW circles that someone had studied with Glenn Campbell but he couldn't give up his career as a performer for a religion.

    I heard that this was absolute bunk. What I heard (third-hand) is that perhaps someone in the subscription department (remember they used to have magazine subscriptions?) had seen the name of a certain "Glen Campbell" on an outgoing WT or Awake magazine label, but it wasn't the famous one.

    Another story that went around was that Tommy James of the Shondells had studied also in the late 1960's and wrote the song "Crystal Blue Persuasion" about the "Truth" book.

    I heard that one too. The ideals expressed in the song seemed to match the first chapter of the "Truth" book, and of course the "Truth" book had a blue cover.

    I also heard that John Lennon's inspiration for "Imagine" was the Truth book. I seriously doubt that one, though.

  • wannaexit
    wannaexit

    In my experience the kindness shown by jw's is not real. When push comes to shove they show their true colors.

    Thanks Blondie for taking the time out of your busy life to comment on the weekly "rag".

    Wannaexit

  • blondie
    blondie

    It is indeed very difficult to maintain kindness when the objects of that kindness are described as vicious, spiteful, unfriendly, shout, curse, ride roughshod, rivalry, force opinions, deceitful, crafty, undermine one?s reputation, bullying, show off, parade their prowess, superior, they think they are smart . (All adjectives used in this article to describe our neighbours).

    Good summary, jgnat, of how the WTS demonizes non-JWs ("worldly people").
    Secure that I am loved, it is easy to love outwards. When I am loved, happy and grateful, it is easy to be kind to those around me.

    JWs do not feel loved; they feel like they never measure up, that what they do is never enough per the WTS which teaches that God?s love is always conditional. Think about it if it were conditional, God would never have sent his Son to die for humans, because humans could never meet the conditions.

    Gopher,

    In contrast, the JW's tend to isolate themselves and look down on their neighbors.

    This sets up a dilemma, because how effective can they be in preaching with this attitude.

    Notice this comment in conjunction with 1 Corinthians 15:33:

    ***

    w02 6/1 pp. 27-28 Rewarded by Practicing Godly Devotion ***

    This has caused the children to look inward for companionship instead of outward. They have learned by our example to monitor their associations because Veronica and I do not spend an undue amount of time in the company of those who do not share our beliefs.

    ***

    w02 10/1 p. 21 Cultivate Obedience as the End Draws Near ***

    How important, therefore, that we avoid association with all individuals?inside and outside the congregation?who are a morally corrupting influence!

    ***

    w00 6/15 p. 22 "All You Are Brothers" ***

    Considering people in general, we can pave the way for giving a witness if we always try to be neighborly.

    Of course, we refrain from the kind of fellowship that may involve spiritual hazards.

    ***

    w99 3/15 p. 13 Pay Constant Attention to Your Teaching ***

    A word of caution, though: A Bible student may be progressing rapidly but may still have some unchristian ways to overcome. So it may not be wise to be unduly close socially with the individual

    . Proper Christian boundaries should be maintained.

    ***

    w99 8/1 pp. 23-24 Peer Pressure?Can It Be to Your Advantage? ***

    Even within the Christian congregation, we can come under the influence of unwholesome peer pressure

    if we choose spiritually weak individuals as our close associates.

    ***

    w74 2/1 p. 93 Finding Joy in Training Children ***

    Christian parents often find that problems arise when their children begin to

    associate with other children in the neighborhood or with schoolmates . They must, of course, have some association with outsiders. Complete isolation today is next to impossible and is inadvisable . Worldly associates vary in the degree of unchristian influence that they exert. But parents need to know with whom their children talk and play. While some worldly persons today have certain admirable characteristics, it must be remembered that one who is not a worshiper of Jehovah cannot be said to be good company.

    ***

    w70 11/15 p. 695 When Hatred Is a Good Thing?a Protection ***

    Some people may appear to be "nice people," but one must ask: "Do they have Christian morals and principles? Do they love Jehovah?"

    Their love of God and neighbor should determine what our relationship with them will be. This matter of association is important, for if we enjoy being with those who do bad things we will soon cease hating what they do.

    ***

    w69 3/15 p. 169 What Influences Decisions in Your Life? ***

    When we look closely at the prevailing spirit of this world we see how vital it is that we avoid its influence. How accurately the apostle Paul describes the world of mankind today when he foretells that "men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, self-assuming, haughty, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, disloyal, having no natural affection, not open to any agreement, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness, betrayers, headstrong, puffed up with pride, lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God." (2 Tim. 3:2-4)

    Whoever we are and wherever we live, do we not see these godless qualities in the people about us? How then can we avoid the ungodly influence of the worldly people among whom we live? Paul?s answer is simple and to the point. He says, "From these turn away." (2 Tim. 3:5) In other words, though they may be our neighbors, they should not be our associates. Do not let them influence your thinking, your actions, your decisions .?1 Cor. 15:33.

    Thanks, cyber-sista,

    If the JWs truly had the spirit of God then they would automatically have kindness. JWs are trained to view those in the world as dead and wicked.

    And the quotes above certainly prove that point.

    Voyager,

    Encouraging words like yours keep me going. My husband is my best supporter. I find him down here reading after I?m done. It helps me see that my decision was right to leave. It may seem strange to say that and then have my head in the WT every week. But it inoculates me against the empty platitudes of the few JWs I still encounter.

    OHD,

    Even on some "loyal" boards Witnesses are complaining about present or past mistreatment and the lack of kindness in the congregations

    I?m surprised they are allowed to complain much and aren?t forced to maintain the WTS illusion that they are the "happiest people on earth."

    Kindness is not a quality that requires a ticksheet on how to do it. As jgnat points out, if you are full of love, it naturally flows out from you. If you feel loved, you give love naturally.
    Keeping them in
    never seems to be as important as just bringing them in. What a shortsighted policy.

    Funny you should say that, I once commented at a WT study that while it was important to find the sheep in the field, that it was just important to keep the sheep in the flock watching out for those who wander off or who are sick and lag behind. I must have had 10 JWs come up afterwards and thank me for saying that, even one sincere elder.

    HappyDad, welcome
    Thanks for the Glenn Campbell ditty. It brings to mind something I heard about him when I started studying in the late 1960's It was going around in the JW circles that someone had studied with Glenn Campbell but he couldn't give up his career as a performer for a religion. And that is why he wrote and had a major hit with Rhinestone Cowboy.
    Has anyone ever heard anything like this?
    Another story that went around was that Tommy James of the Shondells had studied also in the late 1960's and wrote the song "Crystal Blue Persuasion" about the "Truth" book.
    Any comments would be appreciated.

    After over 50 years as a JW, I keep hearing these stories. They have never been substantiated in the non-JW world that I can find, and little real proof in the JW world, just gossip. I once heard it was Campbell?s wife at that time that was studying, not him but no proof. The same goes with Tommy James?nothing in his official or unofficial bios. You could always write to Mr. Campbell and ask. Is Tommy James deceased?

    Maverick,

    I wonder if sometimes they write up these kinds of articles so the RF can show non-JW's how wonderful they are. The publishers can point to these studies and use them as proof of the love and kindness they have. "See how the faithful slave encourage us to show kindness!"

    Actually, I have had elders through photocopied articles at me about such things to prove they are loving. I just say "saying it is not doing it" give me some specific examples in this congregation. Uh, uh??

    You made a good point about assuming that the statement made about an unkind world is just accepted without any real foundation. Never was I betrayed, insulted, and treated as poorly as when I was in the company of my "loving and kind" brothers. We were lead to believe we could let our guard down among the brotherhood! They are vicious at heart and clueless in thought!

    That is true, we were like sheep led to the slaughter.

    Wannaexit,
    In my experience the kindness shown by jw's is not real. When push comes to shove they show their true colors.

    If I remember right, you are still trapped in the Borg. I hope you are finding kindness outside that group. Kindness must be freely given, not with a ticksheet handed to you by the WTS as to what is allowed and what is not.

    Thanks everyone for the song and poetry. Amazing how non-JWs understand true kindness. (Of course, if Glen would confine his drinking to his home and not while he is driving).

    Blondie
  • Flash
    Flash
    Pardon the abbreviated version.

    Hey, you have a life too. It takes time to put theses things together!

    The unkindness and cruelty at the KH led to my physical and spiritual problems. That is why I no longer attend.

    ...who acts deceitfully or craftily thus undermining one?s reputation with the employer.

    Actually, I have had this happen in the congregation more often than at work. What about you?

    YES, DEFINATELY. The Elders did the most damage!

    At that moment it might not be wise to go into detail about how wrong it would be to comply with the employer?s wishes.

    Wishy-washy...typical

    Other young people like to show off scholastically
    Not JWs, they take pride in non-education, at least beyond the three R?s

    In sports or other activities (cheerleading, art, drama, music???)

    Sad, isn't it??

    How important it is to be a loyal servant of Jehovah

    (first a Christian now servant of Jehovah).

    How about...a 'Christian' servant of Jehovah??? I still have people ask me if I believe in JESUS!!!! It's 2004, do you think we can at least get the message out that WE'RE CHRISTIAN??????

    What if they are rude at times or ignore you altogether?

    Who is taught to ignore whom? "Worldly" people are constantly presented as bad association, people to be avoided, by the WTS.

    Your absolutely right Blondie. It's conditional kindness!

    As a servant of Jehovah (Christian?), expressing kindness to the extent possible
    (like the Samaritan?) will be beneficial?he might even become a praiser of Jehovah.

    Do you think that the WTS is realizing that the increase from door to door is drying up and that they have to get JWs to be "kind" to family, workmates, schoolmates, and neighbors to have any new JWs come in?

    That's an excellant question Blondie. I wouldn't be surprised.

    Remember, one of your Christian brothers or sisters will most likely call at that home in the near future

    (yeah, like they will be less irritated then!), put for special effort to show kindness.

    Tell me about it...I would often get blasted by someone who was treated badly at their door!!!

    Concluding Comments

    I will agree that kindness does not characterize JW congregations. In their desire to assure their own salvation and that of their families, they have little energy to show kindness to fellow JWs let alone people outside their congregations.

    The "reminders" here are ludicrous. Non-JWs understand and practice the principles of kindness espoused here by the WTS and without the constant reminders 5 times a week.

    The accounts on this DB from far and wide, urban and rural, of congregations that lack love in their dealings with each other, illustrate why the WTS seems compelled to state the obvious.

    Love your neighbor as yourself.

    Blondie

    DITTO.

    PS: the page is not posting my quotes correctly...I'll try once more...sigh.

  • Deleted
    Deleted

    Something just dawned on me after reading your paraphrasing of the article (thank you) Blondie and that's this. I don't recall the last time anyone has been unkind to me in this "so-called" Satan's world. The last time I felt some level of unkindness was with the former brethren.

  • OHappyDay
    OHappyDay

    How about...a 'Christian' servant of Jehovah??? I still have people ask me if I believe in JESUS!!!! It's 2004, do you think we can at least get the message out that WE'RE CHRISTIAN??????

    Not as long as it's always "Jehovah" - this, and "Jehovah"- that. Jesus is given such short space and so little time in the JW religion. Acts 1:8 says that Christians are "witnesses of [Jesus]," but that fact is apparently lost on JWs.

    It's an Old Testament religion mired in Old Testament harshness, despite the current call for showing "kindness."

  • sf
    sf

    Allow me to re-titled this study article:

    "PERSUING KINDNESS IN HOSTILE YAHOO JW CHATROOMS"

    sKally

  • HappyDad
    HappyDad

    Deleted,

    You took the words right out of my mouth. I never really though about it but maybe I'm not getting back a little of what I always gave. I never got it back from anyone in the cong., but I get plenty of kindness from everyone I have any dealings with.

    HappyDad

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