Is WTS wrong Christianity flawed?

by XQsThaiPoes 20 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • A Paduan
    A Paduan

    Jwism isn't christianity - of any century.

    Imagine if the epistles where written today. They would be watchtowers.

    Well, I read the start of the first letter in the bible, and I read " For God is my witness...."

    Watchtower reckons you need another one as well

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    A few lines further I read

    Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man........

    S ounds as though groups like the wtbts get a mention though - imaginary gods who are like men?

  • A Paduan
    A Paduan

    Considering the bible, it is as if I have read a whole different book from the wtbts. All the way through I read how attitudes like those of the wtbts are confused, of the evil one, to be avoided, what not to do or think, what not to go after, etc etc. How it is christian I know not.

  • XQsThaiPoes
    XQsThaiPoes

    You are proving my point. It is the same thing.

    Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man........

    Ro 1

    22 (42) Professing to be wise, they became fools,
    23 and (43) exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and [4] crawling creatures. nasb

    *** w73 1/15 pp. 49-50 Encouraging Others to Endure ***

    12

    What are some of the spiritual benefits that we as Jehovah?s Christian witnesses can speak about to one another? They are very numerous. We can start by saying we know how to get life; we appreciate the ransom sacrifice of Christ. (Rom. 6:23) Think of those who are still practicing Judaism and still waiting for a Messiah, or think of those who are pagan, knowing little or nothing about Christ and the hope of life. (1 Cor. 1:18, 23) Or, think of Christendom, which is all mixed up with many false theories and philosophies and is not taking the course that leads to salvation by Christ. (Compare Matthew 15:1-9.) In contrast, Jehovah?s servants have been set free from the traditions of Babylon the Great. (John 8:31, 32) We do not live with fear of suffering in purgatory or hellfire. We know that the dead sleep. We have the wonderful resurrection hope. (John 5:28, 29; 1 Thess. 4:13-18; Rev. 20:4-13) We are not confused by any false Trinity teaching. We have been made free from superstitions?not relying upon charms, images, idols, not having to crawl upon our knees up the sides of mountains or to altars in religious ceremonies. We do not suffer from spiritual neglect by the false shepherds in Christendom nor are we oppressed by her clergy. (1 Cor. 10:14; Matt. 9:36; Luke 22:25, 26; 2 Cor. 1:24) These truths are something special that comparatively few people understand.
  • czarofmischief
    czarofmischief

    I myself have pondered this. I am certainly a theist. My prayers are often answered. I have a deep spiritual sense of ecstasy when I pray. But the jesus thing?

    I have, until recently, addressed my prayers in the name of Christ - but then I stopped doing so. I felt like a hypocrite for doing something like that through the name of someone that I don't really believe in. I certainly don't believe that he came back from the dead. I don't believe that life works like that. Not that I think it is absolutely impossible to do so, I just don't see what the point would be. How does that help anyone?

    Paul argues that it is senseless to deny the resurrection because it denies the sense of reward for a good life. "Let us eat, drink and be merry, for tomorrow we are to die." I disagree. I think living a good life brings fruitage in this life.

    If there is no resurrection, it does beg the question why would we listen to Paul's long list of pharisaical requirements for the holy ones? Well. We wouldn't, would we? So I don't. I drink as much as I please, smoke what and when I want to, enjoy the delights of this life.

    I think there is a sense of working in harmony with the entire universe through good deeds, a sense that is above and beyond (and at the heart of) true Christianity. If the universe is a machine designed to produce better and more complex beings that eventually attain a certain level of divinity, then the problem of "sin" is reduced to merely "bad choices". True wickedness is evidenced by delight in the suffering of others, stealing from others, especially sentient beings, for mere pleasure or power. We become parasites of the universe instead of healthy participants in it.

    Christianity is flawed, especially Pauline Christianity. But I think that it is superior to the pagan practices of Rome (at the time) and therefore represents a step forward in mankind's spiritual evolution. Through Pauline Christianity, we are introduced to a Creator. We meet a symbol of perfection. We form a concrete idea of morality. We learn to respect other human beings. Racism is overthrown (a BIG Imperial Roman concept). Violence is abhorred. Judgement is often left to God, especially of those outside the Christian community. Evangelism is encouraged.

    But to go BACK to Pauline Christianity would probably be a step backwards. What is next? I'm not sure. the needs of the time will dictate the next phase.

    CZAR

  • zen nudist
    zen nudist
    Christianity is flawed, especially Pauline Christianity. But I think that it is superior to the pagan practices of Rome (at the time) and therefore represents a step forward in mankind's spiritual evolution. Through Pauline Christianity, we are introduced to a Creator. We meet a symbol of perfection. We form a concrete idea of morality. We learn to respect other human beings. Racism is overthrown (a BIG Imperial Roman concept). Violence is abhorred. Judgement is often left to God, especially of those outside the Christian community. Evangelism is encouraged.

    all these concepts and more were part of the pagan mystery school teachings long before the Jesus myth was invented as a jewish verision of the same hero with a thousand faces... which to the initiated is a symbol of your own spirit, your own connection to the divine, your oneness and wholeness hidden from the uninitiated by many layers of false beliefs....gnosis.

  • myauntfanny
    myauntfanny

    I have to agree with you, XQ. I'm not a bible scholar but when I look at the bible I see a fair amount of justification for what the JWs do, and it just makes me dislike the bible.

    Robert Graves wrote an interesting book about Jesus called "King Jesus" in which he goes through a lot of historical evidence that the story of Jesus was a reworking of the pagan Fisher King pagan mythology that had been around for centuries.

  • XQsThaiPoes
    XQsThaiPoes

    I think my "problem" is I am too smart to be a JW so I can be a JW (I'm not calling other people dumb BTW). I have read, and watched allot about religion. So I don't believe JWs have the truth, I don't believe anyone does. You want the truth you can't handle the truth" (I have always wanted to say that in context). I don't care if the WTS "lies" because they are perpetuating someone else?s lies. What makes it scholarly dishonest if they make up another "lie" to add to it? They have added much less in 120 years than every one else in the last 2000.

    Truthfully their doctrine is borrowed from a bunch of Gnostics before them. They are telling the truth when they say they are trying to resurrect dead religion/s. Even 1914 is not really a JW thing. The anointed is from the Carthars, and the paradise earth is from a non-Christian Jewish sect. I think that believed common people lived in the earth with Pluto in goldmines, and holy people went to heaven (there were many variations of this). I think the only problem is claiming JWs left Babylon the Great. We have no objective proof we left and our doctrine shows it. That is the tricky thing about religion there is not one based on "everyone is wrong, we are right, we believe in nothing, nor do we borrow our beliefs from anyone".

    If some book campany wants to claim Jesus gave it the keys to the kingdom until he returns so what many people have said the same thing before the WTS was concived. Many of the were less aloof, and benevolent about it.

  • dan
    dan

    I think you may believe that you are too smart to be a JW, but the truth may be that you (think you) are too smart to have faith. Faith has a lot to do with not knowing everything, but still believing. I'm not a JW, but I know that truth is out there, and I know I am exposed to the fullness of it, even though I may not understand it all. Funny thing about borrowing things fom other religions: can you name a common practice among the covenant people (mentioned throughout the Old Testament) that was borrowed (by God) from a pagan people? Tick, tock, tick, tock. Let's see how smart you really are.

  • LittleToe
    LittleToe

    Dan:
    You've certainly joined this forum with all guns blazing.

    Might I point you to a certain brand of netiquette that requires you to lurk a while (to get the flavour of a board) post lightly (to get a feel for it) and then join the mainstream debates.

    That advice, which was first given to me nearly a decade ago, has put me in good stead for joining boards without alienating myself within the first few days....

    Currently I know nothing of you, other than some pretty brusque replies.
    It'd be nice to get to know you better, before seeing you dust the carpets.

    Just my 2p.

  • zen nudist
    zen nudist
    I'm not a JW, but I know that truth is out there, and I know I am exposed to the fullness of it, even though I may not understand it all

    you KNOW? I believe, that is the first lie most people tell themselves, they claim to KNOW what they only believe.... what does "to KNOW" really mean? To me it means by direct experience... to claim to KNOW something you have never directly experienced is a lie... the other meaning of KNOW is to understand.... you may be claiming that you UNDERSTAND that the truth is out there... but is that a valid statement? out where? the ONLY things I believe we know are our own mental symbols, our own mapping of a world we have never and will never directly expeirence as our direct experiences are shielded from such a thing... our direct expeirences seem to be of only what our own minds invent... a dream about reality which may or may not be based on reality. Movies like the 13th floor and the MATRIX illustrate that what we think we know about reality may not be real, but something far different invented by means we have no way to detect from inside.... Plato spoke of this as the shadows on the wall mistaken for the realities causing them... Paul spoke of seeing reality in a distorted mirror...

    I believe there is an objective reality, but I also believe no one can ever verify it as the only thing we are able to know is our own view... we assume if others agree with us that makes it a verification, but the catch is, those "others" are also within your own mind, possibily invented by your own mind and their opinion is no greater than your own by itself.

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