http://www.ellsberg.net/bio.htm
http://www.ellsberg.net/weblog/1_23_03.htm
Governments lie. They always have, they always will.
GENRAL Tommy Franks has a career to further and is part of the machine.
General Tommy R. Franks
by freedom96 13 Replies latest jw friends
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Reborn2002
Politicians don't lie. They are not crooked.
The Bush Administration is the epitome of wholesome values and integrity. They would NEVER lie, cheat, steal, or bribe.
Get real. Ironic that Scalia was one of the Supreme Court Justices who voted against Al Gore in the 2000 Presidential Election suit. That those who voted against him were appointed by Republican Presidents, and that Scalia has an obvious tie to the energy industry and Dick Cheney, is no mere coincidence. Read the following link.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040205/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cheney_scalia_3
Questions Arise Over Scalia-Cheney Outing 1 hour, 8 minutes ago Add White House - AP to My Yahoo! By ADAM NOSSITER, Associated Press Writer
MORGAN CITY, La. - For many hunters, duck season in the swamps of Louisiana means an outing with a pickup and a six-pack. For Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia ( news - web sites ) and Vice President Dick Cheney ( news - web sites), it included a flight in a U.S. government jet, a ride in a police motorcade and lodging in a floating hunting camp owned by an oil-services tycoon who is a longtime Scalia friend.
A panoply of Secret Service and local law enforcement guarded the hunting party, and though the shooting was poor, the "strictly social" occasion, as participant Louis Prejean described it, was enjoyable.
But last month's trip has raised growing questions about the propriety of a Supreme Court justice going on a hunt with Cheney at the same time Scalia was hearing a case involving the vice president.
Congressional Democrats and newspaper editorials have called for Scalia to step down from the case, which has to do with whether Cheney must reveal who serves on his energy task force. Further complicating the question: The host of the hunting trip is a prominent member of the energy industry.
Scalia has declined to recuse himself, saying he remains impartial. He likened the hunting trip to a White House dinner.
Kevin Kellems, Cheney's press secretary, said Scalia's objectivity is "really a question that the Supreme Court officials are in better position to answer. This is really, at its core, a question about how the court operates, what their rules are and so forth."
Stephen Gillers, a law professor at New York University, said it would be "an easy call" for Scalia to disqualify himself because Cheney apparently paid at least some of the justice's expenses.
"He has to set an example of what conduct is acceptable. Taking a gift from a litigant in a case before you and taking a trip with that litigant in a small group" is not acceptable, Gillers said.
Several people in the party, including host Wallace Carline and Prejean, declined to discuss the trip into the duck-filled marshland at the edge of the Gulf of Mexico. But this was no ordinary hunting trip.
After landing Jan. 5, the party hurried out of a small blue-and-white jet marked "United States of America" and ducked straight into vehicles that had been flown down separately. With flashing lights that illuminated the rainy afternoon, the caravan made its way south to Carline's camp in the marshes.
There, Scalia and Cheney joined a group of about nine, the justice has said. Among them were relatives of Carline's son-in-law, Mike Swiber, who works for Carline's Diamond Services Corp., which provides barges, tugs, and dredging equipment. "I have no comments, no comments at all," Swiber said. "It's over."
Carline's place on the marsh is more a boat than a camp. A Carline competitor and friend, Doyle Berry, described it as a barge about 150 feet by 50 feet that anchors wherever the hunting is best. On top is a house-like structure.
"It's a big camp, lovely camp," said another friend, local Republican lawyer Al Lippman.
Carline, a member of the local port authority, created his fortune from scratch more than four decades ago, friends said.
"He's a very private-type individual," Lippman said. He is also, apparently, a registered Democrat: The only Wallace Carline in the parish is so listed, according to a local voting official.
Scalia, an avid hunter, is a frequent visitor to Louisiana. His hunting companion is often Prejean, a state worker for the disabled and the brother of Sister Helen Prejean, the anti-death penalty activist and author of "Dead Man Walking." In an interview, she has described confronting Scalia about his pro-death penalty views.
The vice president left after two days, while Scalia stayed two more days.
Berry, echoing others here, said locals were just "honored the vice president came down and hunted." But legal analysts elsewhere said it is not that simple.
"The fact is that the vice president is not a nominal party to this litigation. He has a strong personal and political interest in the result. That's the long and the short of it for me," Gillers said.
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William Penwell
He talked about the national press media, and how they bend stories, and flat out lie to the public. ( I heard the same thing a couple of days ago in person by a well known news anchor.)
I will leave the rest of the discussion up to Reborn but I do take exception to the above quote. At the start of the war, the national press media was so quick to jump on the Bush band wagon it made your head spin. For the first few months of the war all you got form the national press i.e. Fox or CNN was pro war news stories. It was a war propagated by lies on the American people and the national press was sucked in. As soon as there was any negative stories about the war, Tommy Franks starts to whine about how they "bend stories". Give me a break, as far the national press is concerned, Bush and company has had it easy and has not been held accountable for much.
Will
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Yerusalyim
General Franks, from the few times I heard him speak while still in uniform, was actually kinda boring...that being said, this man took down two governments in as many years...with minimal loss of life. He's a great military mind.
Pleasure, you refer to him as a war criminal...proof please.
Six, you say the planning was with an idealogical bent...PROOF please.
The fact remains that to date no WMD have been found, and Chief Weapons Inspector David Kay (whom Bush proudly cited in his 2004 State of the Union regarding WMD) has now come forward stating he believes no WMD were there. He also said that given the intelligence we had at the time it was prudent to believe what we did for the last 12 years about Iraq. Clinton believed it. He also says there's evidence that Saddam sent WMD into Syria...but you're not mentioning that. Paul O'Neill, a member of Bush's own Cabinet, stated that this war was being planned pre 9/11.He certainly did...I'd be really embarrassed if we didn't have a go to war plan since our national policy...by law...since 1998 was regime change in Iraq. Paul has also said his comments have been misconstrued. Let's look at facts. Bush's father was President when the US last went to war with Saddam Hussein. Bush 1 did not finish the job and took egg on the face for his incompetency He didn't get infront of the issue of the economy...Clinton would have lost had the Perot not been in the race.and lost his reelection bid. Hussein tried to assassinate George H. W. Bush. An act of war...we should have took him out then. Dubya goes after the attempted murderer of his father and finishes what his father started. Is that the motive? Show me. Hell, I predicted in 2001 when Dubya was inaugurated that the economy would tank an easy prediction considering the recession started the Summer before Bush came in. and we would go to war with somebody. Also an easy prediction considering how many times Clinton used US forces. Wanna know why? Because Republicans pass laws and cozy up to heavy political contributors and lobbyists, So to do the Democrats...this is a case of the pot calling the kettle black...remember Enron happened under Clinton...Bush gets the mess.which means giving breaks to corporations at the expense of the average American. Name these "breaks" and the expense to Americans. And also because Bush has a background in oil and Cheney and Ashcroft among others have backgrounds in weapons. War means profit for the powers that be. The powers that be profit in war or peace, and as the mafia found out...warfare is bad for profits. But you go on believing whatever Tommy Franks tells you.He's a much more honest man than Clark. After all, if he says it, it must be true. If he were the only one saying it...you'd have a point with your sarcasm...as it is,,,you're just pointlessly sarcastic.
