New light isn't that new outside the USA?

by KerryKing 10 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  KerryKing

  All this recent new light etc has everyone talking but none of it is that unusual here in Ireland. I've been df'd for 15 years, my parents started talking to me again when I had my first child nearly 13 years ago now. Last year my sister in law started talking to me again also, at the one meeting I attended last year quite a few people chatted to me and said hello.

  I'm just wondering if all this is only a big deal in the USA or is this neck of the woods just particularly rebellious anyway? 15 years ago we had elders with full beards in the cong, one elder's wife wore trousers when she wanted to, it did send tongues wagging but that's all. Elders didn't always wear full suit on platform, mismatched was also ok. Either ties or bow ties were fine on platform. Hardly any man wore full suit going in the ministry, wrong climate for that carry on.

  Df'd children were never kicked out of their home and witnesses didn't necessarily stop visiting said home because of a df'd family member living there.

  During COVID quite a few elders didn't take the Vax, they weren't removed and are still there now.

  Any other countries as relaxed as Ireland??
• 

  Jehalapeno

  Some families for years used the "necessary family business" loophole to continue communicating with their disfellowshipped family members. Not all, but some. I know of several families who did this.

  As far as the people that greeted you at the hall, they may have forgotten or not realized you were disfellowshipped. In my experience, some elders always greeted the disfellowshipped ones if they had an opportunity. Not all, but I saw some do this multiple times. The reasoning my elder dad gave me was that, "Elders still have to communicate with them to see if they're ready to come back."

  Regarding dress and grooming, in my lifetime this has always been dependent on the local culture.

  In South Texas, coats were never worn in the door to door work during the warmer months. The brother conducting the meeting for field service was instructed to wear a blazer during the meeting for field service. But that's about it. From time to time, we'd have a circuit overseer come through the area that came from a different region of the country and his first visit he usually admonished the elders and ministerial servants about wearing coats in service. That usually only lasted one visit and by the next the CO would realize why it wasn't a thing in South Texas (weather.)

  I had family that served in Mexico (need greaters) and heard tales about being able to go in service and bookstudy without ties.

  This recent announcement just makes it official organization-wide.
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  Vidiot

  Beards were fine in a bunch of European countries, too. No one ever really gave me shit for growing out my facial hair here in Canada, either.

  Sometimes I think the problems start in the US partially due to typical American dialed-up-to-eleven all-or-nothing go-big-or-go-home culture.

  I could be wrong.
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  Phizzy

  I understand how naturally different things would be in Ireland, i have a good number of relatives there, love the place and the people.

  In my own Congo. here in the the U.K things were much as you describe in Ireland many decades ago, I was a M.S giving away talks, wore a beard from 1975 on, and never wore a suit on the Platform.

  But we were an unusual Congo. with a rare bunch of sensible Elders,we were rural, and countryfolk didn't bother with all that fancy towny stuff. When I joined the Congo. in the early 70's the C.O told me he had a hell of a battle to get the bros to wear a tie on the Platform !

  Our Elders were of the opinion that " we'll have none of that nonsense here". A new C.O to us told me that previous C.O's had told him they dreaded coming to us, because "Everywhere else they accept what the Society says". We didn't.

  But not far away were Congo's so very different, towing the line, and led by Nazi Elders, hence over the years J.W's gravitated to our Congo. , known for being " Liberal".

  So despite being Rural, and we should have been a small Congo, we were joined by many who lived in the territories of surrounding Congo's , so we split in to two, in the middle of the 2,000's.

  All of this shows that if the Org. wants to retain members their latest moves make sense, but they should have done so decades ago.
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  stan livedeath

  a prime example is about shunning within a family.

  My wife is Filipina--and she has a good knowlege of JW practice in the Philippines: she dated a JW in her younger years--and showed interest in his religion. She tells me family shunning of d/f family members was unheard of--as family ties are very close in her country.
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  BluesBrother

  I note what the o/p says about things in Ireland . I can believe that because there are definitely regional differences. I have long noticed that things here in the UK are not so hard nosed as many have reported from the USA.
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  St George of England

  In the 1970's I had a beard for years. Nobody ever said anything about it nor did it impact on anything I did in the congregation such as talks etc. I have read on here also about having a practical car that can take others out in FS. I had two seaters and remember the laughs we had extracting the 80+ year old PO after giving him a lift.

  My wife regularly wore trousers to the meetings and in FS, it could be very cold "up North"!

  My current congregation must be very apathetic, I have never heard any comments about the changes, we will see if anything is said after this evening's item. As for AM III's involvement in any of this, I doubt if many of them even know who he is or was.

  George
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  TonusOH

  It is interesting reading these experiences. I grew up in the Bronx (NYC) in the 70s and 80s, and the congregation I spent most of my time in was led by a strict old-school type who had been in since the 20s or 30s and had traveled with Knorr on some of his trips around the world. Let's put it this way: COs and other traveling bigwigs treated him like the big shot, and never the other way around.

  That also meant that dress codes (and behavioral codes) were also strict. Beards? You could get a lecture just for having a five-o'clock shadow. A sister who flashed a knee was likely to hear about it. And so on. I guess I should have realized that we were in our own pocket dimension, because conventions were full of people who would have gotten an earful if they were in our congregation, based on hairstyles and the way they dressed and acted. But I just saw them as outliers, as exceptions to the strict rules that every JW loyally adhered to.

  I was in a bubble inside of another bubble!
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  KerryKing

  When I lived in Spain for a few years, I remember meeting American JW tourists who couldn't believe that sisters were allowed to wear spaghetti strap tops haha. That was in 40°C+
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  Diogenesister

  15 years ago we had elders with full beards in the cong,

  Yes I'm in the UK and I knew JWs in good standing with very full beards....and not particularly neat, either.

  70s converts. In Europe/UK Jws attracted a lot of hippy types back then

  Phizzy I understand how naturally different things would be in Ireland, i have a good number of relatives there, love the place and the people.

  Me too. Going to Ireland always feels like coming home. And I'm English lol.