by Disillusioned JW 27 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Using the logic of the WT, God would have to appoint people to specifically violate his laws in order to fulfill the governmental ministry He called them to!
Whether I pull the trigger or pay someone else to do it, I am still responsible for a persons death. I agree with Sea Breeze on this one. If government agents with "swords" use those swords the way they are intended they are doing God's will as He appointed them to do so.
A lot of the women are quite appealing to my eye. I liked how naughty committing fornication felt.
The one thing that comes to mind is the advantage of meeting different people in a social environment that you could say you had something in common.
Yes that includes meeting people of the opposite sex.
Sea Breeze and truth-b_known, for many years when I did independent study of the Bible (after ceasing to attend the Kingdom Hall) and later became an independent Christian, I suspected that Romans 13:4 (and the rest of the first part of chapter 13) was spurious (or I at least wondered if it was and I hoped it was). I thought that considering how cruel and evil many of the actions of the Roman government were (such as crucifying Christians).
For another perspective see https://www.jstor.org/stable/1561585 .
I suspected that Romans 13:4 (and the rest of the first part of chapter 13) was spurious (or I at least wondered if it was and I hoped it was).
That is refreshing DisillusionedJW. There are three criteria that be apart of any philosophy/belief system/religion -
First, we must have faith. This is not a clinging to belief and ignoring contrary ideas or facts. Rather it is accepting truth as we experience it. We first must accept something to be truth.
Second, we must doubt what we accept as truth. This is not skepticism. Rather, it is the refusal to accept something without evidence.
Third, we must be determined to seek evidence about what we have faith in.
I have a lot of doubt in the writings of Paul. Honestly, I doubt he was ever sent by Jesus. I think Paul was that type of person that is easy to believe based on how he presents himself.
Sea Breeze the WT view is not against human governments using the sword to carry out justice (even in the use of capital punishment, though I personally disapprove of capital punishment). The WT view however is against Christians intentionally causing human deaths - even in the carrying out of justice and in protecting their nation from attack by other nations. In contrast though, the WT is in favor of Christ and the 144,000 anointed ones (while in heaven) using deadly force to execute people during the battle of Armageddon.
If Christians join a military however, they run the risk of intentionally killing fellow Christians (even of their own denomination or sect) in warfare - as what happened during the USA civil war, during World Wars I and II, and during many other wars conducted between lands of Christendom. But, according to the Bible Jesus told fellow Christians to love one another (to love fellow Christians) and to not harm each other. Christian clergy [Christendom's clergy] (but not any of Jehovah's Witnesses) on each side of battle fields have told Christians soldiers to kill those on the other side (which included other Christian soldiers). How could such people (claiming to be Christians) be heeding the words attributed to Jesus Christ?
Historians have said that in the early years of Christianity Christians (except maybe for a very tiny percentage of Christians) did not join the Roman armies.
Sea Breeze my views about the subject of whether the Bible teaches that Christians must not kill humans (including in wars between nations), as stated in my previous posts, were greatly the result of the WT's teachings on the topic. Furthermore the primary scriptural verse which I based my view upon was Matthew 26:52. But a post of yours in this topic thread did get me thinking about whether there are any biblical verses which indicate that Christians should never take up the sword (or use deadly force) against another human. As a result I researched the matter in other commentaries (and in annotations of other study Bibles) than the ones I quoted from in this topic thread. As result of such research I now think that Matthew 26:52 does not indicate that Christians should refrain from being in a police force or even in a military. Also a number of verses referred to by you and others in this topic thread are ones which I am aware of as being problematic for the idea that Christians must not be in a military. Furthermore, some other verses were mentioned in this topic thread which I likely had not thought of before in regards to whether Christians, according to words attributed to Jesus Christ, can be in a military.
It now seems to me that Matthew 26:52 is speaking of those who use deadly force against humans in unlawful ways (ways which violate the laws of human governments), including (but not likely exclusively) against police officers and established governmental military personnel of one's own community (or nation).
However, there are statements in the Bible attributed to Jesus Christ which strongly encourage the followers of Jesus Christ to be nonviolent in regards to fellow humans. These statements include ones about the meek and peacemakers being happy/blessed and becoming called sons/children of God as result and inheriting the the Earth and the kingdom of/from heaven (and of God) (see Matthew 5:5-12), loving one's enemies (and even praying for them) and about turning the other cheek (see Matthew 5:43-48 and Luke 6:27-36), and about loving one's brother.
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