This is why I'm Disappointed....

by Nickey 80 Replies latest jw friends

  • Nickey
    Nickey

    At what?: This Board

    Why?: Look around

    Yes, people can post what they want. It's a public board. But I often sit back and wonder where people's heads and hearts really are.

    When I first came here, I was a lurker. I was still a JW. I came here looking for answers to my questions and doubts. I found that. But only after I dug through the jokes and snide talks. If I wasn't determined and headstrong, I would've quietly backed away back into the JW's and no one would've never known I was here. It takes alot to actually step forward and actualy post. That goes against everything you've been taught and "instructed" to do. And sometimes actually putting your ass on the line. Losing your family, being disfellowshipped. It spills over into your personal life and has real consequences.

    It took me a loooooong time to slowly help someone in my family to open up and speak about their doubts. Giving small bits and pieces so as not to give them the feeling I had when the truth about "the truth" was dumped on me. I know that's not the way to do it. I recently started sending links of short articles to read. But they still have questions...

    I thought for a bit.... should I? Yes, I did. I sent them here. Although I was hesitant, I went ahead and did so. Afterall, I spent a little over a year getting them to open up more and more.

    No, they don't find answers. They find people being grimey and trying to come up with jokes to play on JW's.

    They find posts about "What Rumor to start about JW's." with AIDS jokes. Or Christmas pranks to do at the Kingdom halls. And just flat out foolishness that does nothing but throw the JW OFF, get confused, scared and what not and REVERSE. Going right back to square one or NONE. "What scandal/gossip can I dig up today?" "What prank can I pull off.... let's put carved pumpkins in front the KH. Let's decorated the trees.... that'll piss them off." Some of that stuff is just LOW and childish. Why would you even take pleasure in acting like that? Bitterness? Anger? Boredom? Fun? Whatever the case, it becomes so self absorbed that nobody considers who's watching and contemplating. The consideration, decency and common sense has gone down the drain.

    There goes the justification to say "Look how they act... I don't want to be an apostate." And they go right back in.

    And now it has reflected on me in a bad way....... because I have to say, I was a bit ashamed myself for posting among it.

    So now, we have a family member going back to studying with an "annointed" JW, who has spoken about concerns of me and why I'd want to post among people like that. Which leads to me getting the 3rd degree and now having to go up against damn near everybody. No peace. Full stress.

    I've come to the conclusion... the negative far outweighs the positive. I'm truly disappointed and sick of half the behavior on this board. There are some nice considerate people here, I must say. But FEW. You know the one's who CONSIDER other people with kindess. Who don't sit around and think up every negative thing to do and say. Who don't think pranks on JW's are funny. Because they keep in mind that it isn't so much the JW themselves, but those at the headquaters/GB who are MISLEADING many people who genuinley believe they are doing the right thing. And they also remember that they were once in THOSE SHOES and know they wouldn't want to be disrespected and joked on. I know I didn't want to be, so therefore I'm NOT going to turn around and do the same thing.

    So whatever... this probably means more fights and black eyes for me. And I owe it all to half of ya'll because I was stupid enough for thinking this would be a good place to start for answers and meaningful knowledge to someone who was seeking.... it happens to many others, not just to me. But that's the risk people take I suppose.

    This place? Forget it. I don't know who's worse... Judgmental JW's.... or Vindictive Ex-JW's' and the instigators that snitch on the side.

  • Sirona
    Sirona

    Nickey,

    Good post. Even those of us who want to talk about actual JW issues and beliefs are guilty of also taking part in the stupid threads (or even starting them).

    I think we do need to be reminded that active JWs may be looking at this board.

    However, in defence of this board, I think that there are many high quality threads which provide great information to the person who wants the truth about JWs. Just do a search on U.N. or Blood and you'll find lots of quality information.

    This is a place for us to come and voice our true feelings about JWs and not be censored. Many of us were badly hurt by the JW religion and therefore its natural for us to go through a process of being angry or bitter before we can move on. I tend to see this board more as a place for ExJWs to heal and talk than a place for JWs to be converted "out" of the organisation.

    Sirona

  • Nickey
    Nickey

    sirona,

    That's true and I agree with that. There are alot of good threads here and I use the search feature all the time.

    I just needed to vent. I see this place more for Ex-JW's as well. And that makes alot of lurkers hesitant because they may not be ready to take that step in becoming an ex-jw. Everyone reacts differently. Some faster, some slower... It pulls alot of active JW's in because of the name and it's one of the first sites to come up in the search engines. That's how I found this place... off Google. With the assumption that it was a JW board before I caught on and started to read the threads and figure what everyone was talking about. And that's alot, because the only sites I've seen JW's go to without being called up on is the Official Watchtower site and "some" of the pro-JW boards.

    I would hope this board would be a place for both ex-jw and active jw's to come together and discuss issues... that's more helpful and positive. But sadly, I don't see that. I joke around sometimes, but not when I know it can actually hurt people physically, emotionally, mentally.... in any way.

    I'm not trying to bash everybody. I'm just highly ticked at the moment.

  • greven
    greven

    Well, you got a point there!

    I too would be hesitant to send jw's here. But remember that this board is not primarily aimed at jw's. It is a place for anybody that wants to discuss witness topics. A lot of ex-jw's have been hurt and humor is part of venting and healing.

    When I started roaming the internet I found this board useful when going for the research topics...the fluff only started to interest me later. I think that if you want to reach a jw it is better to send them first to a research site before sending them here. Because they grew up in a protected environment seeing ex-jw's behave like worldlings may startle them. That's why this board is moderated for foul language and overheated arguments. We should be more decent and aware that jw's lurk here too. We must give a good witness so to speak. But overall this place is not bad...not bad at all.

    Greven

  • be wise
    be wise

    I haven't been on this board for quite a while but I owe a lot to many of the posters here.

    A few posters come to mind who posted here for totally unselfish reasons and probably still do because they have battled through a lot of the bull. I think it's a healthy mix even stuff that some may not like because there is a mix of any view anyone wishes to express - like the real world, totally opposite to the JW mind-set. That isn't to say you have to agree but who wants sensorship. We come from a background where everything was sensored. I would say freedom and truth have nothing in common but at least when you're free you can express your own opinion. I can understand how some newbies might react though but hopefully they would feel strong enough to dig that bit deeper.

  • Nickey
    Nickey

    I don't necessarily call for complete censoring. But going on KH properties and physically pestering people is where I see it as taking it too far...

    Also, I don't equate "worldly" as being disrespectful and foul. In my mind, there is no "worldly". But there is inconsiderate, cruel, disrespectful... there are those terms for describing people. I've seen a few jw's act 10 times worse than any "worldly" person I've seen....

    I don't go around coming up with pranks towards jw's, muslims, jews, or any other person practicing some type of religion. I don't go to churches, kingdom halls or mosques putting things on their property or destroying it... no matter who's it is, it's wrong. Somebody here actually felt proud to tell everyone they peed on their bushes.... That's where I shake my head.

  • run dont walk
    run dont walk

    I agree with you on many points, a lot of the topics and post are really ridiculous, I think people just run out of things and questions to say.

    But for me I have looked past that , and searched out information that was valuable to me, to help me with my family (all still JW's), and this board has been a huge Help to me in that sense,

    but someone lurking here or just starting, must wonder what the hell is going on here !!!!!!!!

  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    What you're highlighting are concerns voiced at regular intervals on every almost xJW board I've been on in the past six years.

    No one has come up with a solution yet; I can understand it bothering you.

    For a start you have the uncomfortable implications of censoring people's posts or of having a board policy of 'not being a stumbling block', or of being 'a shining example to the world'.

    Many people feel that trying to get people out by creating a false and deceptive atmosphere on boards designed to cater to JW who are on their way out is simply carrying on playing by their rules; the next step would be love-bombing new posters so they felt at home. Making people conform to a standard of behaviour AGAIN is a troubling idea, no matter how well-intetioned it is. As you point out, Witnesses are well intentioned by-and-large... look what that engenders

    On the other hand the 'Liberty Hall' atmosphere that can prevail on boards occupied by people escaping from an oppresive and controling society can undoubtedly put some people off.

    Expecting to get a consensus from such a disparate group of people who often are becoming more diametricly opposed in their post-cult opinions (as they develop them) is like juggling jelly or herding cats. You can try, but it's unlikely to get you anywhere.

    Perhaps boards like this one will increasingly try to provide a high-moderation route for those whose sensibilities are still easily inflamed, and boards without such policies will provide for those who want total freedom in what they post, people moving from one to another.

    Perhaps forums will arrise who will get the balanece better, or existing boards will manage to crack the problem.

    I've wondered if multiple interest forums on a single board serve any purpose really, and whether the problems outloned above would be better served by having three forums; one for fluff, one for discussion of xJW topics, both WITH moderation, and a forum for those who don't want to have to think 'ooo, what will 'new ones' think when they read this' which would not be moderated.

    Although getting people out and helping those who are out is the raison d'etre of these boards we mustn;t be deceptive; getting people on to 'solids' as quickly as possible is the aim, as their recovery won;t really start while they still eat half-mashed pulp.

  • Gopher
    Gopher

    Nickey,

    That was an honest and sobering opening post on this thread. For the reasons you stated, this may or may not be the best place to send a "searching" JW at first. Personally I agree with Greven -- I went to the www.freeminds.org site first, and between that and the book "Crisis of Conscience" I became fully convinced never to return to the Kingdom Hall. AFTER THAT, I came here to read more stories and gain more support.

    When I first came to this board in 2001, there were a lot of flame wars and silliness happening. But there were enough decent people and insightful threads that I stuck around, because I had already made up my mind about the JW's.

    This board DOES work for some people. It worked for you. But it has to be the right timing and the reader has to be in the right frame of mind so that they will look past some of the "revenge" threads and go to the more meaningful stuff.

  • link
    link

    Nickey,

    I have to agree with you. I have sent a couple of people with doubts to this board and they shot straight back to the Hall and as far as I know are still there.

    The thing is that they were not yet at a point where they could seperate the rubbish from the "real" stuff, it was too soon for them to be here. Timing is the important thing, if you get that right some of the information on this board can be of real practical help.

    link

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