Unitarian Universalists

by SpunkyChick 30 Replies latest jw friends

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  hooberus

  The site also uses faulty arguments against the Trinity such as this quote from a book they sell:
  

  (15) In the future, the Son will be subject to the Father. 1 Cor. 15:28 says: ?When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him [God] who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.? Trinitarian dogma contradicts this by making Jesus eternally equal to the Father.

  The Trinity doctrine Teaches that Jesus is equal to the Father by nature of being God, yet it also teaches that the Son can be positionally subject to the Father.

  For example an earthly father and son are equal in terms of their humanity, yet the earthly son can be in subjection to his father positionally without denying that they are equal in terms of their humanity.

  The fact that the site quotes sources that do not understand what Trinitarians believe about things such as Christ's equality makes me question the site.
• 

  logansrun

  Hooberus,

  Yes. Similar to your faulty arguments for creationism and the whole of Christian doctrine.

  Bradley
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  gaiagirl

  I also attend a Unitarian Universalist church. They admit that they have their original roots in the Judeo-Christian tradition. However, they do not seem to share the dogmas which most other churches with those roots. The Bible is viewed generally as a collection of documents written by many authors, containing much that can be labeled 'wisdom' and much other material of historical interest as a reflection of the views of the authors, but not necessarily absolutely true. So, the minister may quote Jesus at times, in encouraging the congregation to demonstrate love for one another. The minister would be extremely unlikely to quote Paul where he states that women should remain silent, that the man is the head of the woman, etc, as this is not seen as an inspired expression from God, but simply Paul expressing his opinion, as Paul himself admits (speaking on another topic) at 1 Cor 7:25.

  Sermons at the UU church I attend are just as likely to quote from other sacred books as from the Bible, so the congregation is exposed to the wisdom contained in the writings of Buddhism, Islam, Taoism, as well as individuals such as Einstein, Ghandi, Starhawk, Black Elk (all of whom are contained in the UU hymnal), as well as many others. There have been services honoring the various traditions mentioned, as well as a few with a distinct neo-pagan flavor.

  While a JW, one is exposed to a single narrow view, claimed to be that of the only people on Earth to whom God ever revealed himself. In contrast, at the UU church, the view is more like: God, however one chooses to define the term, would logically be equally accessible to all people, in all nations. Each nation, even each individual may have a unique perception of 'God', which may be equally valid. Some view 'God' as very close to the classical Judeo-Christian image, others have a more abstract definition, some don't believe in 'God' at all. UU's feel that just because someone has a different perspective, this does not have to be grounds for division. There is a word in one of the traditions, 'Namaste', which means 'I honor the sacred within you'. This word is sometimes used as a greeting, in which we recognize that other individuals often have differing views, we try to look for the things we share in common, and build on those things, rather than focusing on our differences.

  Bright Blessings

  gaiagirl
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  gumby

  So, the minister may quote Jesus at times, in encouraging the congregation to demonstrate love for one another. The minister would be extremely unlikely to quote Paul where he states that women should remain silent, that the man is the head of the woman, etc, as this is not seen as an inspired expression from God, but simply Paul expressing his opinion,

  So who decides which part of the bible is truth or bunk......you or the minister?

  Gumby
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  Athanasius

  Back in 1987 I attended Unitarian services for a few months. The people were friendly and the sermons were informative. However, it was only a brief stop on my spiritual Aeneid.
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  gaiagirl

  Hi Gumby, you asked "So who decides which part of the bible is truth or bunk......you or the minister?"

  As I stated, everyone in the congregation is not expected to share the same perspective. The minister might or might not view a particular passage as historically true, but feel that it still is useful to make a particular point. If so, he may include this passage in a talk. Individual members of the congregation are free to view that passage any way they choose. In general, the bible is not seen as 'more' inspired than the sacred writings of any other culture. Individual members may choose to give it more, or less importance.

  It is kind of a difficult concept to wrap ones mind around at first, accustomed as most of us are to being told in absolute terms what to believe and how to think. UU's have a regular series of classes which some choose to attend called 'Building Your Theology'. Whether or not one attends these classes, this is what most UU's do in practice: Expose oneself to many different perspectives of spirituality, then select those particular applications which are most meaningful to oneself.

  If churches were restaurants, the WT society might be something like McDonalds, a very 'corporate' atmosphere, in which all the employees dress alike, all the different locations are decorated the same way, and everything on the menu pretty much tastes the same. The UU organization is more like a multi-cultural buffet, perhaps even an open air market, where there are foods from all over the world, prepared according to varying local customs, from which one selects those which appear most savory.

  I hope this clarifies their position somewhat.

  gaiagirl
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  gumby

  Gaiagirl ,

  Thanks for taking the time to explain their position. I liked the illustration you used of resteraunts and compared it to the witnesses...good illustration!

  What is the ultimate goal a UU hopes to attain?

  Gumby
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  Mum

  I took that online test and came out most strongly as a UU. However, I have never attended a UU service, though I would like to do so out of curiosity. When I was leaving the JW's, a friend of mine (also a lapsing JW) told me to avoid the Unitarians because they're "too cerebral." I have a sense of what she meant. If I feel the need to go to church, I usually attend the Episcopal Church because there is nothing like a high mass to make me feel renewed and ready to take on the world. The glory of God (whomever and whatever that may be), awe and grandeur appeal to me.

  I was reading a novel recently about a lawyer who is about to take a job in another town. His significant other does not want to go with him because there's no Unitarian Church in the town. The lawyer's answer to her objection is that there is an Episcopal Church, and that's about the same thing. I feel certain that Episcopalians are the most liberal Christians.

  Once on "A Prairie Home Companion," Garrison Keillor told a joke about a JW who became a Unitarian. The punch line was that this person began "going door to door for no particular reason."

  Regards,

  Mum/SandraC
• 

  GentlyFeral

  gumby,

  So who decides which part of the bible is truth or bunk......you or the minister?

  The short answer is "yes."

  The longer answer -- here, let me just cut & paste from the website:

  With its historical roots in the Jewish and Christian traditions, Unitarian Universalism is a liberal religion -- that is, a religion that keeps an open mind to the religious questions people have struggled with in all times and places. We believe that personal experience, conscience and reason should be the final authorities in religion, and that in the end religious authority lies not in a book or person or institution, but in ourselves. We are a "non-creedal" religion: we do not ask anyone to subscribe to a creed.

  We are heretics because we want to choose our faith, not because we desire to be rebellious. “Heresy” in Greek means “choice.”

  The living tradition which we share draws from many sources:

  • Direct experience of that transcending mystery and wonder, affirmed in all cultures, which moves us to a renewal of the spirit and an openness to the forces which create and uphold life;
  • Words and deeds of prophetic women and men which challenge us to confront powers and structures of evil with justice, compassion, and the transforming power of love;
    Wisdom from the world's religions which inspires us in our ethical and spiritual life;
  • Jewish and Christian teachings which call us to respond to God's love by loving our neighbors as ourselves;
  • Humanist teachings which counsel us to heed the guidance of reason and the results of science, and warn us against idolatries of the mind and spirit.
  • Spiritual teachings of earth-centered traditions which celebrate the sacred circle of life and instruct us to live in harmony with the rhythms of nature.

  GentlyFeral
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  crownboy

  Once on "A Prairie Home Companion," Garrison Keillor told a joke about a JW who became a Unitarian. The punch line was that this person began "going door to door for no particular reason."

  LOL, Mum.

  I've been to a couple of UU services myself (I scored 100% UU on the religious test and hence was curious). The experience was pretty good there. The people I spoke to were friendly, and the minister was a very nice person as well (he came up to me to welcome me after the service). I was also impressed with the community activism aspect of the group. If I felt a real need for some sort of "spirituality" in my life, I'd probably attend a place like that, but I much rather sleep late on Sundays and wake up just in time to see the start of the early football game than to be up early to go to church . It's certainly a 100% improvement over the JW's; the importance of making your own decisions on matters of spirituality is quite important there.