Jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the Gentile Times are Fulfilled. — Luke 21:24

by Fisherman 36 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Fisherman

    Jerusalem will be trampled by the nations until the Gentile Times are Fulfilled. — Luke 21:24

    The Bible book of Luke records Jesus prophecy of the last day with his Parousia including the verse about the Gentile Times. Therefore, the Gentile Times end during Jesus’s Parousia.

    King Zedekiah was prophesied to be overthrown and Jerusalem would be without a king until the one having the legal right came, Jesus. The angel Gabriel told Mary that God would give Jesus the throne of David. How long would it take for the rightful king of God’s kingdom to receive the kingdom and begin ruling? Ans: Seven times will pass over you. Those 7X end during the Parousia.

  • Jeffro

    🤦‍♂️ Entirely wrong. The ‘gentle times’ when Jerusalem was ‘trampled’ (corresponding to the ‘great tribulation’) was the 3.5 years (42 weeks, 1260 days) from 66-70CE. The grammar in Luke indicates a period that hadn’t started yet in Jesus’ time. Jesus’ presence was explicitly expected to happen after that. Poor wrong JWs. 😂

  • Vanderhoven7



  • Fisherman
    The grammar in Luke indicates a period that hadn’t started yet in Jesus’ time.

    I disagree. The wording even in English describes an action already started that has not been completed. The wording can also be used to describe action with a future beginning but that is not the case here as I explained in my OP.

  • Jeffro


    I disagree.

    So? You’re just wrong. ἔσονται means ‘will be’. The wording ‘even in English’ hardly matters.

    Kingdom Interlinear Translation:

    and they will fall to mouth of sword and they will be led captive into the nations all, and Jerusalem will be being trampled by nations, until what should be fulfilled and will be appointed times of nations.
  • peacefulpete

    It's not a simple knot to untie. Many factors complicate it. The first century reinterpretation of Dan 9 as referring to Rome, like the contemporary work 4 Ezra. The author of Luke's own personal amendments of Matt and Mark including his reinterpretation of Tobit 14:5: “But God will have mercy on them again. God will bring them back to the land of Israel, and they will rebuild the house, though not like the first one, until the appointed time has been fulfilled. Afterward, they will all return from the places where they are captives and build Jerusalem in grandeur.

    So.... what we have is a revision of reinterpretations of an apocryphal and a pseudographical work that failed being made to apply to a world 1900 years later.

  • ozziepost

    Here we go again !


  • Vidqun

    Fisherman, here's my five cents worth. I do not view the "seven times" and the "times of the Gentiles" as the same or mutually inclusive. The first has to do with kingship (Nebuchadnezzar vs. Jesus) and the latter with the trampling of Jerusalem.

    Seven times: The “seven times” has to do with kingship and theocracy (Dan. 4:17; cf. 7:13, 14). This is a follow-up dream of Dan. 2. There Nebuchadnezzar is the head of gold (cf. 2:38, 44, 45). In Dan. 4 he is depicted as a luxuriant “world tree,” which is chopped down. The remaining stump is bound with bands of copper and iron until “seven times” pass over it (4:13-16). As a primary fulfillment, “seven times” point to seven days, months or years. Nebuchadnezzar would be out of action for seven times (Dan. 4:23-25).

    If seven times = 7 years, it will allow for a secondary fulfillment. And this is a big "if." Seven years is a long time to leave your kingship unattended. Nothing in history to indicate such a long gap in his reign. If seven times = seven years, then a prophetic year is 360 days (3½ times = 42 months = 1,260 days: Rev. 11:2, 3; 12:6, 14). The “seven times” (7 times x 360 = 2,520 days > 2,520 years), would then have started in 607 BCE with the subjugation of Judahite king Jehoiakim by Nebuchadnezzar (2 Kings 24:1; 2 Chron. 36:5-8; Jer. 25:11; Dan. 1:1, 2).

    Here it might be noted that an interesting similarity exists between Nebuchadnezzar and Jesus. At that stage in his life, Nebuchadnezzar was the crown prince and king in waiting. His father Nabopolassar only died in 605 BCE.

    Thus, counting from 607/606 BCE, the “seven times” end in the year 1914 CE when the principle “a day for a year” applies (cf. Num. 14:34; Ezek. 4:6). The fact that God uses a heathen king as a type of His son is not unusual. In Isaiah, Daniel and Revelation the victorious Cyrus is presented as a type of God’s son and heir (Is. 44:28-45:5; cf. Dan. 9:25; 11:44; Rev. 16:12).

    Times of the Gentiles: Has to do with trampling of Jerusalem. Daniel, a contemporary of Ezekiel, would predict a second destruction of Jerusalem and its temple, this time by the Romans: “And the city and the holy place the people of a leader that is coming will bring to their ruin. And the end of it will be by the flood. And until [the] end there will be war; what is decided upon is desolations. And upon the wing of disgusting things there will be the one causing desolation; and until an extermination, the very thing decided upon will go pouring out also upon the one lying desolate (Dan. 9:26b, 27b). This fact Jesus would reiterate in his Olivet discourse: “and they will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive into all the nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled on by the nations, until the appointed times of the nations [times of the Gentiles, ESV, NET] are fulfilled” (Luke 21:24). So, the "times of the Gentiles" start in 70 CE. The “appointed times of the nations are to be fulfilled when Jesus, who has the legal right, receives his kingship, this time in a heavenly setting (cf. Dan. 7:13, 14; cf. Rev. 11:2, 15, 18).

  • waton

    Acts 1:7 proven to be the truth.

  • Fisherman

    So, the "times of the Gentiles" start in 70 CE

    How could that be since Jerusalem had been under Gentile rule since the destruction of the first Temple. So therefore the Gentle times had to begin when Jerusalem lost its sovereignty and the Jews were subjugated. Even after the restoration, Gentiles ruled Jerusalem, from Babylon to Rome and beyond so the trampling must have begun in the past and Jesus must have been referring to the completion. The nature of grammar is that another meaning is possible, but trampling beginning in the future doesn’t make sense for the reasons I explained.

    Interestimgly, Jehoiakim was appoimted king of Judah by Nebuchanezzar in Babylon during the deportation so technically he was the last king of Judah but purely a mockery and totally insignificant and meaningless . A king over nobody.

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