Question about JW finance

by Gorbatchov 22 Replies latest jw friends

  • Gorbatchov

    Watched the JW finance video's.

    They have sold all Brooklyn landmarks. Bilions.

    They are selling other property maybe up to 3000 units worldwide.

    So, there is going something wrong...

    There must be a giant money leak.

    Otherwise they had funds now with Bilions in it.

    I don't get it.


  • days of future passed
    days of future passed

    Maybe some of the funds are disappearing into the hidden accounts of those that belong to the "incorporated" part of the society. So that when the rainy day comes and the organization is going to have to pay out for hiding pedophiles, they won't have a worry. It will all be on the "religious" part.

  • Anders Andersen
    Anders Andersen

    I think the giant leak is diminished donations since literature became free, an economic crisis, plus financial mismanagement by uneducated, inexperienced, Jehovah-will-bless-us top managers (gb).

    That lead to a huge cash flow and liquidity issue. They're not poor, but most of their money is/was tied up in real estate.

    So over the last decade they have tried to fix the cash flow issue by reducing costs. They tried to solve the liquidity issue by selling off real estate, but you can only eat up your assets until they are gone. I think more important is thay less real estate means less cost, and that helps their cash flow issue.

    What they are doing now is trying to make their financial situation sustainable. Cost are to match the income, which apparently it didn't (for a long time even?)

    They're not poor, but bleeding. They're stopping the bleeding now to prevent themselves from becoming poor.

  • joe134cd

    Sure they have never had so much cash on hand in its history. The focus is on long term sustainability. No doubt the cost of child abuse law suites must be of concern to their long term survival as well.

  • jookbeard

    I wonder how much they really lost in the GFC and subsequent gambling on hedge funds? although its a terrible record on their history I dont see child abuse lawsuit payouts any where close to what the possible losses have been as I mentioned

  • cofty
  • snare&racket

    I’ve been out 13 years now (wow that’s gone quickly), my basic summary of where the finance issues are...

    1. It’s cult not supported by any deity, but by donation

    2. Literature and printing is financially no longer viable, even for businesses that charge for their product. Printed literature and global distribution is far too expensive now. Everything is goingg and will go online.

    3. The Watchtower had invested heavily in the stock market, the 2008 crash hurt them and they halted expansion/projects soon after and started selling property.

    4. Court cases for child rape have become costly, with courts finding that the Watchtower itself is guilty of endangering children to known abusers after hearing of incidents and not acting.

    5. Events such as Russia’s government seizing all JW property.

    6. JW’s have become financially challenged, largely due to WT doctrine on education and careers. Unlike previous JW generations, they clearly don’t donate as they used to. Assemblies were once moneymakers, with J.w’s forced to buy WT meals with WT tokens/credit. They would pay a fortune for WT approved car parks, despite the huge arena venues already having ‘free’ car parking as part of their venue hire cost.

    7. Watchtower tried to scam congregations into borrowing and paying back credit on interest. My family worked on the RBC purchasing team. Everything ordered was SO expensive for a new hall or refurbishment. You couldn’t just go and buy a mic cable, it had to be from a JW catalogue from specific suppliers with a marked up price in the WT price list. The sound equipment and furniture was ridiculously expensive and for no reason......seemingly. The money was borrowed from HQ and paid back with interest. This became a mo they giving scheme from every congregation, with all finances handed over to WT. It was decades of KH savings taken overnight. Amounts of money that would go a long way in local finances, but no distance in international publishing.

    Teh WT decided to sell the KH’s and squash several congs back into one hall, selling off the new halls of the 90’s, 00’s. This pissed off JW’s a lot. All of this was short term thinking, because once you take all the local assets, sell the halls and make the congs share like they did in the 80’s..... it’s hard to argue you NEED money or that ?God is blessing your activity.

    8. The WT doctrine promises, still appeal. But not to western developed ‘lands’. JW expansion is limited and minimal growth is taking place in impoverished lands. The WT invests little time, attention or finance in these regions of the world, because they get little back.

    9. If you had to propose a business/financial strategy for the future of WT, what would you do? What could you do? They are boxed in by doctrine and decades old arguments such as “we will know when we lose gods approval as we will need to beg for money...”

    They have justified making literature free by lying. They said it was to fulfill scripture “come take life’s water free...” but in reality it was for tax and charity status reasons. They can’t reverse that.

    i see maybe a minimal monthly financial donation ....aka....subscription for online access coming. The printing presses will scream to a halt soon enough.

    But will the WT financially survive?....... let’s see. I think not.

  • The Fall Guy
    The Fall Guy

    Over the past few years the org has eliminated the vast majority of its printed literature output - thus saving countless mi££ion$ (tens or hundreds?) in production, distribution, and personnel costs.

    The WTBTS is like a bucket being filled with water from a tap/faucet, but the bucket is leaking badly, according to Mr. Lett!

    QUESTION: If donations were previously so abundant to pay for all the printing costs, why & where is the org seriously haemorrhaging all the money which has been pouring in, when running costs have been so dramatically slashed?

    Its revenues and windfalls cannot explain/justify claims of cash problems.

  • nowwhat?

    I wish we had documents stating they lost their shirt in the stock market in 2008 when they have been telling the r&f not to invest in this system!

  • ToesUp

    Gorbatchov - You make a great point! What happened to the billions made from the NY sales?

    Did the have equity loans against these assets that had to be paid back to the investors upon sale?

    They could have been using up the equity as a piggy bank for decades to supplement less donations?

    This could be one reason they did not have a large windfall of cash after the sales. They used up their equity over the years?

    Remember, the end was need to pay it back!

    i hope soon, a Bethel insider in the know will reveal the real facts.

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