Whatever happened to Paula Combs AKA Sue Pamela Carne?

by OrphanCrow 11 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • OrphanCrow

    In May 1983, a Jehovah's Witness woman worked as a governess for William Plunkert who worked at the US embassy in Moscow.

    Moscow charges CIA link to religious activist

    William Plunkert was a CIA operative during his time in Moscow:

    How the CIA ran a ‘billion dollar spy’ in Moscow

    Sue Pamela Carne went by the alias "Paula Combs" while she was posing as a language student at Moscow's Pushkin Institute.


    The U.S. Embassy confirmed that Miss Carne had been detained and had left the country. But a spokesman said because of the privacy law, he could not discuss the case. , , . '.' Her employer, William G. Plunkert, a diplomat in the embassy's political section, could not be reached for comment immediately. Tass said she was known to the Jehovah's Witnesses in Kalinin as Paula Combs, a Russian-language student at the Pushkin Institute in Moscow, but her identity papers established her true identity.
  • darkspilver

    This was in the early 1980's?

    I think at that time the Soviet's thought every American was a CIA operative!

  • OrphanCrow
    dsp: I think at that time the Soviet's thought every American was a CIA operative!

    They still do. There is nothing that compares to the suspicious Russian mind.

    As it turned out, they were right to be suspicious of Plunkert and his staff. Plunkert was CIA.

  • darkspilver

    She's mentioned in the article below, with a number of other Americans, all being kicked out of the USSR


  • OrphanCrow
    dsp: This was in the early 1980's?
    I think at that time the Soviet's thought every American was a CIA operative!

    ...to continue with that thought. As I said, the Russians still think that way. The Sue Carne/Paula Combs incident would have only reinforced the Russian suspicions.

    In October of this year, a Russian television channel broadcast a documentary about "sects" that cast Scientologists and Jehovah's Witnesses as "closely associated with US special services".

    TV channel "Zvezda" "exposed" Scientologists and Jehovah's Witnesses

    October 17, 2017 on the TV channel "Zvezda" in the program "Conspiracy Theory" was shown the film "Espionage under the guise of religion". The authors of the film, using the example of Scientologists and Jehovah's Witnesses, cited "evidence" that "many representatives of religious minorities, and in fact, sects, are closely associated with US special services."
    The film is replete with "anti-sectarian" cliches about "psychotechnics that allow you to completely take control and will, and the mind of a person, and, as a consequence, his soul" , seizures of "adepts", "recruitment", etc.
    As experts, "sectologist" Alexander Dvorkin, adviser to the rector of the Moscow State Pedagogical University Yevgeny Spitsyn and head of the department of religious studies of the Kazan Federal University Larissa Astakhova were invited."Had the courage to conduct an honest and objective examination of the stormy activities of Scientologists" , and those "in revenge" organized surveillance of it.
    Like in other similar films, Ukraine is a negative example of the intervention of "sects", only according to the authors of this film, Jehovah's Witnesses actively participated in "events on the Maidan".
    The creators of the film give recommendations on how to distinguish "sect" and "how to understand that your preacher can be a man with shoulder straps of another state" .
    The film ends with a message that the new US ambassador to Russia is a Mormon, from which it is concluded that "the round-up of our souls continues" .

  • Moster

    Just love this sleuthing stuff you do OrphanCrow

  • zeb

    No wonder Putin shakes his head at the west..

  • OrphanCrow

    Thanks Moster

    zeb: No wonder Putin shakes his head at the west.

    I think most of Russia is shaking their head at the Mormon being chosen for US ambassador. Not a good choice if the goal is to foster Russian trust. If that is even possible. Probably not. Russians will never trust foreigners. Nyet to the Mormon

  • jeffory1

    My wife and I worked at a number of Embassies from 2001 to 2006 and there were civilian american workers who were engaged in covert religious activity, Mormons, JW's and Baptist were all doing this, The Mormons had connections with old KGB personnell to try to establish their beachhead there but JW's Catholic's and Baptist were all public enemy number 1 with Russians. I could tell stories about the JW underground using Dip. channels to get things in and out but am a little paranoid to do so on any forum.

  • Corney

    According to Soviet sources, Sue Pamela Carne was a member of the Unification Church (aka "United Christian Organization") who tried to convert Jehovists-Il'inists (Iyegovisty-il'intsy) [1 - 3]. The latter are a religious group of Russian origin and they have no connection with Jehovah's Witnesses but both Il'inists and JWs were often called 'Jehovists' by officials and press [4, 5]. And probably for this reason US news media mixed up one sect for another.

    Sorry for my poor English.

    [1] Kornilov Yu., Chekhonin B. Guvernantka iz TsRU [Governess from CIA], 1984. URL: http://www.litmir.me/br/?b=191366&p=6 http://www.litmir.me/br/?b=191366&p=7 http://www.litmir.me/br/?b=191366&p=8 (in Russian).

    [2] Yu. A. Panov, in 1972-1991 a KGB officer in Kalinin (now Tver), wrote, citing declassified and published (in book Ot CheKa do FSB: Documenty i materialy po istoriyi organov gosbezopasnosti Tverskogo kraya. 1918-1998 [From Cheka to FSB: Documents and materials on the history of State security services in Tver region. 1918-1998]. Tver, 1998. ISBN 5-85457-122-6) KGB documents:

    The successful operation of the Kalinin Chekists was the identification of the so-called "United Christian Organization", the detention in the city of Kalinin and expulsion from the USSR of its members: Carne Pamelasue, a US citizen and a governess of one of the secretaries of the US Embassy in Moscow; Hiltunen Irm, Finnish citizen and governess of the ambassador of Lebanon to the USSR, and others; during their detention in the city of Kalinin, a large number of anti-Soviet literature, sound-recording devices, copying equipment, and special equipment were confiscated.

    http://www.moremhod.info/index.php/laulink/161?start=15 alternative link: http://flot.com/blog/historyofNVMU/?%25253BPAGEN_1=48&%25253Bprint=Y&print=Y&PAGEN_1=382 (in Russian; translated via Google with some corrections).

    [3] JPRS. USSR Report. Political and Sociological Affairs. No. 1443. P. 52. URL: http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a348886.pdf

    [Editorial Report] Moscow IZVESTIYA in Russian 7 July 1983 on page 6 carries an 1100-word article titled "The Junior Captain and the Governess" by V. Kassis and L. Kolosov. The article discusses the appearance of an adherent of the Unification Church in Moscow and her attempts to convert members of a small pre-existing religious cult in the USSR known as the "Jehovists-Il'inists" [Iyegovisty-il'intsy]. The authors characterize the Unification Church and its founder, Sun-Myon Moon, as a front organization for the Korean Intelligence Services. Moon is accused of planning an "anticommunist crusade" together with the Korean CIA, the members of which — according to the authors — may be distinguished from members of the American CIA "only in that the Koreans speak English a bit less fluently than their American counterparts." The authors identify an employee of the American Embassy as the main conduit of illegal "Moonist" literature. Her attempts to organize the Soviet sect into a "conspiratorial cell" are unsuccessful. In addition, the authors raise the question of the direct complicity of American Embassy officials and characterize the employee's activities as "more in the nature of espionage" than religious evangelism.
    CSO: 1800/1490

    [4] Yehowists, article from Wikipedia. URL: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yehowists

    [5] Emily Baran. Dissent on the Margins: How Soviet Jehovah’s Witnesses Defied Communism and Lived to Preach about It. Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2014. P. 16, 260 (note 14).

    The Russian religious climate also presented a unique challenge for Russell and his ideas because the Russian Empire already had a religious movement known colloquially as the “Jehovists” (Iegovisty), based on the writings of Nikolai Sazontovich Il’in from the mid-1800s. Both Russell and Il’in’s followers championed the use of “Jehovah” as God’s proper name, predicted an imminent Armageddon, rejected all other established Christian denominations, and mistrusted worldly government, although they differed greatly in other beliefs and practices. Despite state persecution of Il’in and his followers, Il’in’s writings gained traction in parts of the Russian Empire, including Ukraine and the Russian heartland, and his movement survived into the Soviet era. While the two faiths emerged separately and had no connection to one another, officials struggled to distinguish between them.
    14. Soviet officials sometimes distinguished between Il’inists (Il’intsy) and what they dubbed Rutherfordists (Ruterfordisty) or Russelites (Russelisty), but in other instances they lumped them together as “Jehovists.”

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