Manipulative language

by Hendrixgrip 19 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Hendrixgrip

    Someone recently included the phrase from a talk, “cherished errors”, which made me think about something I wanted to get off my chest. The societies use of manipulative language has been discussed on this site many time and I hope this adds to the ammunition to fight back against them.

    Periodically , i’ll Run into someone and they’ll say “Hendrixgrip, why don’t you come to the meetings anymore.” I’ll give them some not too specific reason like, “I’m struggling with the overlapping doctrine”. Inevitably, they’ll say something like, “you haven’t let that impact your faith in the organization/bible/GB have you?”

    My response is to say, “no, faith is not the problem, it never has been. I’ve never had faith in the GB. Then I paraphrase Hebrews 11:1 and say, “Faith isn’t the problem. Faith is the assured expectations of things hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities that are not yet seen. I don’t hope there’s a GB, I know there’s one. I’ve seen them, I don’t hope to see them. If you mean my confidence in the GB, then yeah, I guess I’m struggling with that.”

    Faith is something that should be reserved for things we can’t see, like God or Jesus or according to them, gravity and wind. By asking JW’s to have faith in them, they’ve subliminally elevated themselves to the position of God. At best, JW’s should have confidence in the GB, like they might a politician.

  • Phizzy

    I don't know your story Jimmygrip, but if you wish not to be DF'd of DA'd then you are treading a fine line. The " Loyalty Question" , beloved of Elders everywhere, including the two who twice tried to trap me on it, simply asks if you accept that the G.B is what it claims to be, if you don't, then out you go.

    Now, the danger is that the Elders you are dealing with probably don't know that the G.B has reduced its wild claims about itself in front of the Royal Commission in Australia. They will pose the question how they like, and will twist your answer so that it works against you, they will lie about your actual words, and their own, if they want to.

    Steer clear of any discussion about the G.B if you wish to stay a fader.

  • Gorbatchov

    It’s all dubbele speech. When i got aware of that, it was not possible to attend meetings anymore, without hurting myself. So I had to fade for health reasons. For 10 years now, feeling better then ever 👍👍👍.


  • Hendrixgrip

    Thank you Phizzy. I agree, I’m just indifferent. My wife would like to DA and I pull us back so that I can try to make people think just a little. I’m sure it will catch up to me, but until it does I’m going to plant as many seeds as possible.

    I think the reason I posted that is because I shared those feelings with my wife when she was PIMI and it seemed to make her think.

    Gorbatchov, it is all double speak. How did we miss it for so long? That’s why I posted. If we still have loved ones in, pointing out the double talk can speed the process. With my family that has come out with me, I would say “We learned A last week, right? And we learned B this week, right? A and B seem to be in conflict with each other. Do you have any thoughts how I should explain this to the kids?”

  • blondie

    As to manipulative language, I don't know if this addresses this directly, but I have noticed that the WTS often puts a qualifier before many nouns, etc., such as:

    (from today's (1/13/2019) WT study)

    Lucrative career (not just career)

    willingly AND promptly

    sad mistake (aren't most mistakes sad?)

    Sadly, some (meaning how many?)

    adjusted understanding (who is doing the adjusting, God or the GB; why did not god tell the correct info first)

    prominent brother (elders?, CO?, GB?) are jws supposed to be prominent?

    misrepresented our beliefs (by providing their own statements in context in their own publications)

    kept confidence in Jesus = confidence in GB?

    left the truth gradually = faders?

    drifts away not same as do so deliberately hmmm apostates?

    strains his relationship with Jehovah or GB

    accept and obey all of Jehovah's sayings (or rather GB sayings)

    we cannot pick what truths to accept and which to ignore (only the GB can do that)

    spend excessive amounts of time on recreation (what is excessive, 1 hour a day, 5 hours a week, so many jws just try to make it easy and tell others that no time)

    not wrong in themselves...encroach on time previously spent in personal study, etc.

    keep material things in their proper place (and the GB and their enforcers will tell you what that is)

    we may see others (in the congregation including elders and MS) buying the latest electronic devices or enjoying other material advantages (expensive cruises and vacations, large, new homes, expensive clothes)

    Demas...why did Demas leave Paul?...the bible does not say (but the GB fills in the blank by saying "whether he loved material things more than spiritual activities")

    non-Witness (note capitalization) rather than not PC worldly

    good relations with family members and treat them kindly BUT we will have close friendships only with those who love Jehovah (and that can be some baptized and attending the meetings)

    immoral filth of this world = as if that is not found in the JW congregations (hiding child sexual abuse for example)

    precious truths - phrase from the bible but overused, aren't just truths precious?

    truth disciplines us, showing where we need to make changes - rather the GB and its administrators do

    full share - an ambiguous term that allows other individual jws to judge whether it is full or not

    we use the bible to help others - ever notice any bibles offered on the cart or when a question is asked the jw directs them not to the bible but

    most intimate relationship with our heavenly Father - who we cannot reach except through Jesus (or the GB says through them then Jesus). Where is Jesus in this?

    Blondie (excuse me I have to go vomit)

  • User99

    I caught some of those cognitive dissonance- inducing manipulations that you highlighted, Blondie, but you found some that I had missed. But I do catch more of these remarks from the Society as I regain the ability to think for myself, instead of turning my thinking ability over to the WTBTS.

    It’s funny how the Society states to trust in Jehovah, that he knows what’s best for us, when they lay off Bethelites, for example. Otherwise referred to as “reassignment to the field”. They conveniently use Governing Body and Jehovah almost interchangeably, selecting the appropriate term when they want to reinforce their authority.

  • Hendrixgrip

    Thank you Blondie and User 99. That’s exactly what I mean. The more we educate ourselves on the methods the society uses to influence people, the more likely we will be able to help people. JW’s spend an inordinate amount of time having these phrases with subltle submeanings reinforced in their conscience. To the extent that we can help them appreciate the lunacy, it’s beneficial.

    phizzy I thought more about what you said and I’d like to clarify something. Elders are not emotionally invested with us and therefore can move to DFing quickly. People that love us are less likely to immediately go down that path. My comments were intended more for those we are emotionally invested with. Having said that, I have shared those thoughts with two elders and emerged unscathed. I think I drove them crazy answering their questions with my own questions asking them to clarify their questions. Them:”Brother Hendrixgrip, do you believe the GB blah blah blah?” Me: “I’m not sure I understand your question. Are you asking me do I believe Jehovah puts his thoughts in the governing body like he did the Bible writers?” Them: “no, no, no , do you think they generally represent his will...”. Me: “again, I’m not sure I understand. Can you give me a scriptural example?” Of course they couldn’t. There is no scriptural example of a “true uninspired prophet.”

  • WTWizard

    They are not going to get anything they can understand out of me. Not only do I believe the whole bible (the quran as well) is full of lies that are intended to ruin mankind, but I don't think they deserve anything. You might as well be speaking Greek to them if you want to get anywhere with them, so Greek it shall be. (Actually, German--I don't think any of the congregation can understand that language, either.) And if they don't like that, I might try something they will not only struggle with but is toxic to their souls: Sanskrit.

  • TexWiller

    Hello everyone,

    a very interesting post. I do find Blondie comments really spot on ex. :

    Demas...why did Demas leave Paul?...the bible does not say ...

    immoral filth of this world = as if that is not found in the JW congregations (hiding child sexual abuse for example...

    Worst of all allowing the child abusers to remain inside for years,

    MS or elders included.


  • Giordano
    My wife would like to DA and I pull us back so that I can try to make people think just a little. I’m sure it will catch up to me, but until it does I’m going to plant as many seeds as possible.
    I think the reason I posted that is because I shared those feelings with my wife when she was PIMI and it seemed to make her think.

    Sharing with your mate and her request to DA is one issue. Staying in place to help others out is not a similar situation. In the one you were trusted by your wife....knowing you gave her a level of confidence in your judgement.

    This will not be so with others.

    To DA is quick and clean but you are joined together with those who were DFed. 'So and So is no longer one of JW's.' You are then disparaged the same way they are and of course shunned.

    Your other options are to fade, disconnect yourself or explain to any who ask that you were seriously stumbled by the WTBTS on going pedophile issue that has come to light.

    When the Society treats this issue as the crime it really is and not just a sin that can be prayed away you'll reconsider rejoining.

    Anyway......... something to consider.

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