Ray Franz

by pbrow 13 Replies latest jw experiences

  • sparky1

    "They were a lovely, caring couple"

    And faithful to each other 'til the end.

  • BereanThinker7

    This is a bit different subject and maybe I should make a topic on it, but has anyody ever wondered what couldve happened if Ray, and the other long timers that left, never gave up their shares??

  • blondie

    There is no official reason. Everything is by word of mouth by others, unless you talked directly to those involved at that time. I talked to Ray and Cynthia and at least 4 others. It was a real witch hunt. The WTS was worried that these private pre-studies of the WT and other bible topics were a hotbed of apostates. Shortly after that, pre-study of the WT in small groups was not allowed in any congregations unless it was 2 families or 2 individuals. That caused a lot of sadness since these events were small, about 10 in my area, made up of single people, always a proper chaperone, adults that had raised children and were reliable. Afterwards, refreshments and some card games, puzzles, and some tv watching. No pairing off allowed and everyone had to leave at 11 pm unless you lived at the host location. So all were forbidden. Really cut down on what could be wholesome association. It was one of those rules to determine what was too large a group even for receptions, informal events like private roller skating parties, going out for pizza, etc.

    Amazingly, if 2 families got together with 2 families of 4 each, that was 8 people, but if 8 single people, including appropriate chaperones, that was nixed. WTS unofficial rules don't have to make sense.

  • blondie

    Here are some reasons that really mean, large groups (more than 2 families, one person living on their own was considered a family) were dangerous and the host was responsibility for any sins committed by guests at their event.

    Comments found using WT Online Library (WOL) with words, large gatherings. While not specifically mentioning private informal groups studying together, the WTS rather tried to limit the size of groups without naming the upper limit allowed. They danced around it.


    At times, several families may be invited to a home for Christian fellowship. Or brothers and sisters may be invited to attend a wedding reception or a similar social occasion. (John 2:2) The hosts should feel personally responsible for what takes place. Clearly, there is need for caution when large groups get together. The relaxed atmosphere at such gatherings has led some to go beyond the limits of proper Christian conduct, becoming involved in excessive eating and drinking and even other serious wrongdoing. With this in mind, discerning Christians have seen the wisdom of limiting the size and duration of such gatherings. If alcoholic beverages are served, they should be used in moderation. (Phil. 4:5) If every effort is made to ensure that get-togethers are wholesome and spiritually refreshing, food and drink will not be the most important consideration.


    Young Witnesses are especially exposed to danger, since many things they may find attractive are packaged with sex. To make matters worse, they have to resist the influence of other young ones urging them on. (Compare Proverbs 1:10-15.) Not a few have got into trouble, for example, at large gatherings. As in Baal worship in ancient times, music, dancing, and sexual allure make a heady mix.​—2 Timothy 2:22.


    2 Organized Social Affairs: Whether we are “eating or drinking or doing anything else,” we should “do all things for God’s glory.” (1 Cor. 10:31-33) This counsel is not observed by some, and problems continue to develop because of social gatherings too large to be properly supervised. In some instances, hundreds of people are invited to elaborate functions where worldly entertainment is featured. Sometimes those attending are asked to pay admission or other fees. Such gatherings closely resemble worldly affairs, the spirit of which is out of harmony with decency and Bible principles.​—Rom. 13:13, 14; Eph. 5:15-20.


    Surely Paul did not have in mind being with these fellow workers in large, late evening parties where partaking of food and drink immoderately would be easy and supervision difficult. Getting together with a few others, possibly in the home with family members present, usually produces superior results in upbuilding discussions and interchanges of encouragement. In such an atmosphere, wholesome conversation and experiences replace loud, distasteful music. Children can be included and Christian personalities molded. This can contribute to effective and zealous field service the next morning, whereas late partying in large groups usually discourages it.

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