Not On Simon's Board--The Forbidden File!

by Atlantis 12 Replies latest jw friends

  • Atlantis

    Hi Mike:

    The file you have requested, is a file I will not provide a link for out here on Simon's board. I will be happy to give you a link for that "Forbidden" file in private. ( Send me a pm for the link.)

    Please consider that when we come here we are coming into Simon's living room, and there are some subjects and content that Simon would rather not have discussed here. A little respect is appreciated.

    You are not the only person who has requested that file, so that is why I include these details out here.

    Please realize that we are talking about the 1920's, and that file shows what Rutherford "paid" to see at the Winter Garden Theater around 1926 in detail. Rutherford took a young female Bible Student with him to these nude and semi-nude performances.

    The President of the Watchtower Bible And Tract Society, or what some people would call "the governing body", was seen by many Bible Students, and charges of immoral conduct were brought against Rutherford concerning his blatant disregard for Bible principles.
    (See Edmond Gruss, The Four Presidents Of The Watchtower)

    Some of the highest and most respected members of the Society saw Rutherford going to these "nude" performances, and especially when he was out of the country. ( According to A.H. Macmillan, Rutherford frequently attended nude and semi-nude burlesque shows, especially when he was out of the country. (The accusation was made in a

    letter dated April 27, 1926 by one of the most respected members of the organization, George H. Fisher, Edmond Gruss, The Four Presidents Of The Watchtower, pg 28)

    Even the "doorman" at the "Winter Garden Theater" was one of the Bible Students who opened the door for Rutherford and his young lady to enter the building. Certainly, conduct unbecoming of a christian, would have been just the beginning of the charges brought against Rutherford and his young female companion.

    Rutherford was a "regular" at these nude performances and seen going to them on several occasions. Everything included in that book came from eye-witness accounts, or people who spoke to the eye-witnesses. In a court of law there is no better evidence than an eye-witness.

    A "Madam" prostitute who attended meetings gave account of Rutherford being treated for syphilis, and she had nothing to hide. She was "proud" of her profession and the ability to financially support herself. This was just before the great depression and it was difficult for females to find work. (Unless they were willing to, shall we say, provide services of a "questionable" nature!) ( Great depression 1929-1933)

    That book contains nearly every advertisement a person could find, concerning the "nude" book covers, nude women, nude men, "nude art", "nude dancers", and the list goes on and on.

    Gertrude Hoffman was a "regular" at many of these theaters of that time period. Gertrude Hoffman was one of the most celebrated dancers of all time.

    Gertrude was arrested for immoral dancing practices, including laying on the floor "semi-nude" with the severed head of John The Baptist at her feet.

    Officials "banned" her dancing in several states. If it was controversial, bending the line of morality, or displaying "total-nudity", then Gertrude Hoffman jumped in head first and was all for it.

    Gertrude's opinion was: "Why go to a museum and "pay" to see naked paintings and statues, when you can pay to see the real thing over here!

    Back then, Gertrude and the "Gertrude Dancing Girls" performances were called the greatest show on earth, and Rutherford wanted to get his eyes full. The young lady on Rutherford's arm could view all the "semi-nude" men she could handle.

    What do you think was running through the mind of Rutherford and his young lady after viewing shows of that content? I can guarantee you they weren't leaving the theater to go and get ice cream!


    Credit: Leolaia:

    Rutherford was staying at a hotel, the person who straightened up his room found a lady's hairpin in his bed. According to AlanF, this occurred in 1928 and the incident led to the stumbling of a number of Bible Students in the Buffalo, New York, area. Both claim that Mr. James Penton has been doing research on this incident. Moreover another poster, cyberguy, was friends with an elder from Long Beach, CA who knew Berta. He related that Berta had a bedroom adjoining Rutherford's in the train car they used in their travels, with a directly connecting door between the two rooms. He learned this when Berta met with the elders before she died and gave them a full confession, showing them home movies of the two of them together.

  • luckynedpepper
    Did Rutherford prefer VHS or Betamax for his "home movies"?
  • vienne


    Very interesting. I respect you immensely. But without documentary proof, isn't this all speculative. A bit like fan fiction in reverse? Why are files from the 1920s damaging to Simon and this board?

  • GrreatTeacher

    Luckynedpepper, silly, everyone knows it was Super8.

  • Beth Sarim
    Beth Sarim

    ''Did Rutherford prefer VHS or Betamax for his "home movies"?''

    Actually it was blu-ray

  • Atlantis



    vienne: The file shows a lot of nudity of what was being displayed in the 1920's at the Winter Garden Theater. (Some people would consider the file pornographic and not suitable here.) We still love you vienne!




    Beth Sarim:

    Thank you! VHS, Beta, Super8, Blu-ray, reel-to-reel, 8mm, slide-projector, ( had to be one of them somewhere along the line.)

    Hot coffee in the break-room with strawberry treats. Just pop the treat in the toaster and you are all set!


  • resolute Bandicoot
    resolute Bandicoot

    16mm film format would have been well within his reach at the time, and if so it may well be quite good quality.


  • vienne

    I would very much like the file, Atlantis

  • Atlantis

    resolute Bandicoot:

    So true! Glad RB knows his gadgets from that time period. Back in the 1970's they use to have VHS and Super Betamax wars. Remember that? People would argue back and forth which one was better.

    VHS finally won only because a person could record 3 movies on a blank tape instead of 2 movies like Betamax. The blank Betamax tapes were smaller than the VHS blank tapes. But to this day a lot of people still claim that Super Betamax is better quality.



    You are welcome to the file my friend! Just send me a pm, and don't forget to grab some coffee and chocolate chip cookies!


  • BluesBrother

    Oh boy, when I was a lad growing up we had old bros and sis who would speak lovingly of the days of “ The Judge” as they called him . They had carried his sermons door to door, lugged phonographs playing recordings of his booming voice gone to the Albert Hall to see him in person . He was a hero to them.

    What would they make of this ? I am sure they would refuse to believe it .

    When I first heard such allegations I doubted it too. I was thing of the Society as it is now with a structure that would investigate such things. Back then though the President was God , there was no one to reign him in , he could do what he liked. I have seen too much smoke not to believe that their must be fire ……. 🤔

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