Are there any full preterists here? (page 2)

Vanderhoven7

@NBD

Verse 34 of Matthew 24 is the time text.

The Greek word “genea” (pronounced ghen-eh-ah') appears thirteen times in Matthew's gospel. Four times it is used to delineate “one set of parents to the next”. Every time the definite article “this” (houtos) is found before “generation”, i.e.“this generation” (houtos genea), in every gospel on the lips of Jesus, in context, clearly covers the same group of people -i.e. “Christ's faithless contemporaries”

So everything before Matthew 24:34 applied to Christ's generation and in fulfillment of Matthew 23:36 Scripturally speaking, there is no other possibility.

Looking at the other generational applications.

Could Jesus have meant that:

a. "all these things" were to happen to the 20th century
generation exclusively.

- Impossible: conversation centers on "these stones"
which were knocked down in 70 AD.

- Impossible Lu.21:23-24 states that subsequent to great
distress, Jews were to be led captive to all nations which
occurred immediately after the 70 AD destruction.

b. "all these things" were to happen to both Christ's
generation and our generation. (dual fulfillment theory)

- Impossible: -these buildings and are already destroyed.

- Impossible -Jews are not to be led captive into all
nations again at Christ's second coming.

- Impossible -Matt.24:21 precludes dual fulfillment.

This leaves only one scriptural option i.e. that

c. "all these things" were to happen to Christ's generation
exclusively.

I don't believe we can apply things after verse 35 to "this generation". The material is incompatible with just about everything that appears before it.

neat blue dog

Ok, here's my thoughts:

I think verses 36 onward CAN be applied to Christ's generation, and logically should, because they immediately follow without any change or introduction. He says no one knows the 'day or hour', not the year or decade. Also later in verse 44 he says to those listening, alive during that generation, to prove THEMSELVES ready, so he was obviously still talking about the same time period.

Fred Franztone

The gospels were written after 70, trying to make it look like Jesus prophesied it. They had no interest in the future at the time they were written. Would anyone writing such texts today care about a specific generation living in the year 4000?

Vanderhoven7

There are differing opinions on the date of the gospels. Conservative scholars date Mark's gospel late 30s to early 40s.

Vanderhoven7

@NBD

Let's look at verse 36 on down to verse 44

36. BUT OF THAT DAY AND HOUR KNOWETH NO MAN,
NO, NOT THE ANGELS OF HEAVEN, BUT MY FATHER ONLY.

37. BUT AS THE DAYS OF NOE WERE, SO SHALL ALSO
THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN BE.

38. FOR AS IN THE DAYS THAT WERE BEFORE THE
FLOOD THEY WERE EATING AND DRINKING,
MARRYING AND GIVING IN MARRIAGE, UNTIL THE DAY
NOE ENTERED INTO THE ARK,

39. AND KNEW NOT UNTIL THE FLOOD CAME, AND
TOOK THEM ALL AWAY; SO SHALL ALSO THE COMING
OF THE SON OF MAN BE.

40. THEN SHALL TWO BE IN THE FIELD; THE ONE SHALL
BE TAKEN, AND THE OTHER LEFT.

41. TWO WOMEN SHALL BE GRINDING AT THE MILL;
THE ONE SHALL BE TAKEN, AND THE OTHER LEFT.
Elaboration - Lu. 17:20 -

42. WATCH THEREFORE: FOR YE KNOW NOT WHAT
HOUR YOUR LORD DOTH COME.

43. BUT KNOW THIS, THAT IF THE GOODMAN OF THE
HOUSE HAD KNOWN IN WHATWATCH THE THEIF
WOULD COME, HE WOULD HAVE WATCHED, AND
WOULD NOT HAVE SUFFERED HIS HOUSE TO BE
BROKEN UP.

44. THEREFORE BE YE ALSO READY: FOR IN SUCH AN
HOUR AS YE THINK NOT THE SON OF MAN COMETH.
Lu.12:42-48

I believe that this verse and "THAT DAY" signal a change in topic
to the second coming (parousia) of Christ. Mt.7: 20-22, Mt.11:22, Jn.5:25,29

36. BUT OF THAT DAY AND HOUR KNOWETH NO MAN,
NO, NOT THE ANGELS OF HEAVEN, BUT MY FATHER
ONLY.

Jesus has already explained what would happen to His own
generation. Now He contrasts that which would relate to His
second coming (parousia) or presence on earth. Notice the
contrasts:

Matt 24:1-35 ..............................................................Matt 24: 36 - end
__________ ..............................................................__________________

Local, Jerusalem,Judea,Temple........................... Worldwide: Lu.21:35

Abnormal Times: calamities .......................................Normal Times: Marrying etc.

Specific signs precede............................................. No Signs Given

Timing Anticipated Lu.24:33 .......................................Anticipation Impossible 24:44

These Days Mt.24:22.............................................. That Day Mt.24:36
Saints to flee ............................................................. No Running; Saints taken

quincemyles

neat blue dog, I second your take.

Vanderhoven7

THE GREAT TRIBULATION GENERATION

All these things, including the great tribulation were to happen to the generation contemporary with Christ.

The synoptics support that the tribulation Jesus spoke about would be a local event.

Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

Mark 13:14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:

Luke 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

In the holy place.

Albert Barnes comments: "Standing in the holy place - Mark says, standing where it ought not,” meaning the same thing. All Jerusalem was esteemed “holy,” Mat_4:5. The meaning of this is, when you see the Roman armies standing in the holy city or encamped around the temple, or the Roman ensigns or standards in the temple."

Very little is ascribed the word holy in the gospels. God, Jesus, the city and it's temple uniquely qualify. God's holy presence in the temple remained until the death of Christ, when the temple veil was ripped from top to bottom (i.e. from above) exposing the fact that God's holy presence was removed and the temple desolate as Jesus ominous prophetic pronouncement indicated. (see Matthew 23:38)This act of God symbolized the permanent removal of God's presence accompanying the nations rejection of their messiah; Israel's greatest loss made this the worst unrepeatabe disaster possible for Israel. The complete physical destruction of the holy temple (as a witness to the nations) ratified this divine rejection for the entire world to see for all time... to which the Dome of the Rock and the wailing wall continue to attest.

The great tribulation being a one-time,non-repeatable event in hisory; a fairly local event affecting the Jews in and around Jerusalem and leading to their death or dispersion among the nations.

The Sign to Flee Jerusalem’s Tribulation & Destruction:

18 “When therefore you see the abomination of desolation, which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not in the holy place (let him who reads understand), that is to say, when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that her desolation is at hand.”

19 “Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let him who is on the housetop not go down to take out things that are in his house, and let him who is in the field (countryside) not return back to take his cloak.”

20 “For these are days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.”

21 “But woe to those who are with child and to those who are breast feeding in those days!”

22 And pray that your flight be not in the winter, neither on a Sabbath,”

23 “For then will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the creation which God created, until now, no, nor ever shall be, for there will be great distress on the land, and wrath to this people.”

Are there any full preterists here?

Vanderhoven7

neat blue dog

Fred Franztone

Vanderhoven7

Vanderhoven7

quincemyles

neat blue dog, I second your take.

Vanderhoven7

Moster

neat blue dog

neat blue dog

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