On respect for the belief of others. Sorry for the long post

by StarTrekAngel 372 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Viviane
    Viviane

    LUHE, it's a shame that your having difficulties. I hope things get better for you soon. If your difficultis are preventing you from debating without outburst, I suggest a break. I say that because, difficulties or not, you just had an outburst at someone that has been conversing and engaging politely with you that simply asked what an unfamilar term meant.

    If you can't handle that without an outburst, that's your problem, not mine. Your mood doesn't mean anything to me. It's up to you to control and not have an episode and converse.

  • LoveUniHateExams
    LoveUniHateExams

    None of them, LUHE

    Viv, 2 hours ago you went through my list of Islamic beliefs and declared the above. Now, you want to know what a "home truth" is.

    It seems I was right. You are playing silly buggers.

  • Viviane
    Viviane

    I've no idea what a home truth is, your tantrum and wrong assertions not withstanding.

    On a side note, you've now spent more time complaining about me and pretending I know what it is than it would have taken you to write two sentences and explain it.

  • Oubliette
    Oubliette

    Hi all, just perused the last few pages while on my lunch break.

    I have to say, I'm curious to see how this thread has progressed. Several posters have really tried to elucidate the issue while the remaining ones seem entrenched in confusing the basic ideas involved.

    People are not their beliefs!

    It is possible to respect an individual and yet disagree with their beliefs, even to think those beliefs are wrong, possibly harmful.

    It is also possible to not respect an individual but still share certain beliefs with them.

    The two are not inseparably entwined.

    Although it may vary from culture to culture, respect is general something someone earns due to their achievements, qualities or position. A certain amount of respect may even be granted to complete strangers; whether that level of respect increases or decreases depends on their continued actions and behaviors.

    When we consider the meaning of the verb respect, I'm not sure it is even appropriate to use it in connection with any set of beliefs:

    • admire (someone or something) deeply, as a result of their abilities, qualities, or achievements.

    -

    Frankly, the meaning of the word belief is itself somewhat problematic:

    Definition of BELIEF

    1. a state or habit of mind in which trust or confidence is placed in some person or thing
    2. something believed; especially : a tenet or body of tenets held by a group
    3. conviction of the truth of some statement or the reality of some being or phenomenon especially when based on examination of evidence

    -

    Depending on our own particular background, education, training and disposition, we may find that one of these definitions seems more right than another. Context does matter.

    I'd like to end this post with a short excerpt from an interview with Bertrand Russell.

    He was asked by the interviewer, "Do you think there’s a practical reason for having a religious belief, for many people?

    Russell: Well, there can’t be a practical reason for believing what isn’t true. That’s quite... at least, I rule it out as impossible. Either the thing is true, or it isn’t. If it is true, you should believe it, and if it isn’t, you shouldn’t. And if you can’t find out whether it’s true or whether it isn’t, you should suspend judgment. But you can’t... it seems to me a fundamental dishonesty and a fundamental treachery to intellectual integrity to hold a belief because you think it’s useful, and not because you think it’s true.

  • LoveUniHateExams
    LoveUniHateExams

    Strictly speaking, it seems I was wrong to use the phrase "home truths" re Islamic beliefs. Home truths apparently means unpleasant facts about oneself, not about a religion (http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/home-truth).

    Although, given how much religious peoples' belief often means to them, maybe my use of the phrase is very close to acceptable use.

    However, you're an intelligent person, Viv, and you know what I'm driving at.

    Some honest answers would be appreciated, rather than muddying the waters.

    Thank you.

  • LoveUniHateExams
    LoveUniHateExams

    Not knowing what "home truth" means and asking is me muddying the waters? Take a debate class and come back when you're done. I've no time for this nonsense - 'telling home truths' means revealing some unpleasant facts.

    I'll honestly answer my own question for you, Viv, then you can have a go. Sound good?

    I would NOT tell a Muslim some 'home truths' about Allah, Muhammad & the Qur'an. It could be very dangerous. I've read about Hirsi Ali, Majid Nawaz, etc.

  • cappytan
    cappytan

    That must be an expression from our friends across the pond.

    Ive never heard the expression "home truth" before.

  • cofty
    cofty
    I would NOT tell a Muslim some 'home truths' about Allah, Muhammad & the Qur'an

    I sat in the Metro Centre reading one of Hirsi Ali's books while Mrs C was shopping. I deliberately held the book so the cover was visible. Got some very angry looks from Muslim men but nobody had the courage to say anything.

  • cofty
    cofty
    That must be an expression from our friends across the pond.

    Yes I think it is. It means telling people things they would rather not hear. Usually it would suggest something they have had coming for a while.

  • LoveUniHateExams
    LoveUniHateExams

    That must be an expression from our friends across the pond.

    Ive never heard the expression "home truth" before

    Viv's no doubt intelligent enough to guess from the context of my post and the way the thread is developing.

    I can't quite believe that she's read my posts, seen the phrase "home truths", and had no idea what I'm driving at.

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