Is Jesus the Creator?

Sea Breeze

That's what the word says.

Colossians 1:16

For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.

BelisemDeBelimakom

Here is part of Origen's Epistle to Gregory and his Commentary on the Gospel of John:

https://ccel.org/ccel/origen/epistle_john/anf09.xv.iii.ii.vi.html

In this text, Origen explores the theological implications of John 1:3, "All things were made through Him," reflecting on the relationship between the Father, the Son (Logos), and the Holy Spirit. He discusses the hierarchical nature of the Trinity, suggesting that while the Father is uncreated and the source of all, the Logos acts as the intermediary through whom creation occurs. Origen debates whether the Holy Spirit, as part of "all things," was also made through the Logos or is uncreated. He proposes that the Holy Spirit, while distinct, is created by the Father through the Son and holds a unique role in sanctifying believers. Origen also addresses the Spirit's relationship to Christ and examines scriptural passages suggesting a nuanced, functional hierarchy within the Trinity.

Additional reading: Here, Origen critiques Heracleon's interpretation of John 1:3, "All things were made through Him.", who claims that "all things" exclude the highest spiritual realms and that these existed before the Logos. In this context, Jehovah's Witnesses and Heracleon share a similar subordinationist view of the Logos, where Christ is not equal to the supreme God.

https://ccel.org/ccel/origen/epistle_john/anf09.xv.iii.ii.viii.html

Sea Breeze

John 1:3

"All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being".

This is why he predicted that he would resurrect himself from the dead, while he was dead. He is the Creator and provided the proof as such in person, in front of his rebelious people, facilitated by a politician of the greatest empire in the world - Rome.

God's birthday will be coming up in a few weeks. Can't wait.

Duran

God's birthday will be coming up in a few weeks. Can't wait.

You at least attempt to use Scriptures in regard to being the 'Creator' or not. Can you cite any Scriptures that would show that this so-called birthday is in a few weeks from now?

Sea Breeze

this so-called birthday

Duran, surely you have heard of Christmas? It's the greatest holiday the world has ever known - the birth of our Creator. "God was manifest in the flesh" - 1 Tim. 3: 16 KJV

Duran

Oh, my goodness...can you read or comprehend what you read...I did not ask you to tell me what holiday is coming up in a couple of weeks, my question was for you to cite ANY Scriptures that support his birth taking place when you claim it does, on Dec 25th.

If I said he died in March or April, I could show Scripturally that it shows he died on Nisan 14 (Jewish calendar). Exodus 12:6; Luke 22:14-20

If I said Christians are to keep observing his death until he arrives, I also could show you that Scripturally. 1 Corinthians 11:23-26

So, now I am asking you to show me Scripturally where it shows he was born on Dec 25 (Kislev/Tevet Jewish calendar) and where are Christians told to keep observing his birth?

Sea Breeze

Duran, I do apologize for mis-interpreting your question. In re-reading your post, I can see that you are not questioning the fact that God was born, only questioning scriptural support for the December 25th date.

I found this helpful serveral years ago when I first read it:

The scriptural reference goes like this:

The Gospel of Luke indicates that the announcement of the Archangel Gabriel to Jesus' mother, Mary occurred six months after the conception of St. John the Baptist, with the date of the conception of St. John the Baptist being deduced from the prescribed time that his father, Zechariah, was serving in the temple when he received his own vision of the Archangel Gabriel. (Read the detailed explanation on this from Dr. Taylor Marshall here.)

The date of the Annunciation was celebrated by the Church since ancient times on March 25th, placing Jesus' birth nine months later in December, near the time of the winter solstice - December 25th.

aqwsed12345

@Duran

You should read these:

The objection here hinges on two main points: (1) there is no Scriptural evidence that Jesus was born on December 25, and (2) there is no biblical command for Christians to observe His birth. Let’s address these points systematically:

The Bible does not specify the exact date of Jesus’ birth. However, this absence does not invalidate the celebration of His birth. The early Church selected December 25 to focus on Christ’s incarnation and counteract pagan festivals by redirecting cultural attention toward Christian worship. The celebration is about honoring the incarnation of Christ (John 1:14), not the precision of the date. Christians honor the significance of His coming into the world regardless of the calendar. While December 25 coincides with some pagan festivals, this was intentionally repurposed by the Church to teach the gospel and emphasize Christ as the true "Light of the World" (John 8:12). Historical decisions, such as this, do not detract from the celebration's Christian meaning today.

JWs argue that there’s no command to observe Christ’s birth, but the Bible sets a precedent for commemorating significant salvific events. The angels themselves celebrated Christ's birth in Luke 2:10-14, declaring it "good news of great joy." The announcement of Jesus' birth involved praise and glorification of God, which mirrors the spirit of modern Christmas observances. The Magi honored Jesus' birth by presenting gifts and worshiping Him (Matthew 2:11). While this is not a direct command, it sets an example of celebrating Christ's arrival. Romans 14:5-6 affirms that Christians have the liberty to observe special days in honor of the Lord.

The argument that Jesus’ death is explicitly commanded to be observed (1 Corinthians 11:23-26) while His birth is not ignores the broader purpose of Christian worship. The Incarnation (celebrated at Christmas) is a necessary precursor to His sacrificial death. Without Jesus’ birth, there would be no death or resurrection to commemorate. The incarnation fulfills Old Testament prophecy (Isaiah 7:14, Micah 5:2) and begins the redemptive mission. While Jesus commanded remembrance of His death, this does not exclude celebrating other aspects of His life, including His birth.

While Scripture does not explicitly mention December 25 or command observance of Jesus' birth, Christians commemorate Christmas to reflect on God’s greatest gift: sending His Son for the salvation of the world (John 3:16). The Bible does not command singing hymns or constructing church buildings, yet these are widely accepted as edifying and worshipful. Similarly, celebrating Christ’s birth glorifies God and deepens faith. The essence of Christmas is worshiping Christ, aligning with the angelic announcement and the actions of the Magi. Far from being "pagan," it is a day to proclaim the joy of salvation.

The absence of a specific date in Scripture for Jesus’ birth does not invalidate its celebration. While December 25 is a chosen date, the theological focus is on the incarnation and its significance in salvation history. Christians celebrate Christmas as an act of worship, aligning with biblical themes of praise, joy, and gratitude for the coming of the Savior.

liam

God's birthday will be coming up in a few weeks. Can't wait.

Duran

Jesus' birth nine months later in December, near the time of the winter solstice, i.e. December 25th.

So, you think these Shepards were living/sleeping out in the fields during wintertime? Luke 2:8

Where is the Scripture equivalent that you can cite to support for Christians to keep observing Jesus' birth, in the way that Paul states to keep observing his death, until he arrives?

Is Jesus the Creator?

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