WT Style Pacificism

by Sea Breeze 23 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  FedUpJW

  The Watchtower as far back as the early 1990s got to the point of refusing to state that a person should even attempt to use force in the defense of one's self or an innocent third party.

  Here is my go to reference when any JW tells me that I should never defend myself, and instead rely on God to deliver me from any potential violent attack.

  *** g 6/08 p. 11 When Is Self-Defense Justified? ***
  On the other hand, what if a person’s life is threatened by an assailant? A law that God gave to ancient Israel sheds light on this. However, if an intruder was fatally struck at night, the householder could be exonerated because it would be difficult for him to see what the intruder was doing and to ascertain the intentions of the intruder. The householder could reasonably conclude that his family was under threat of harm and take defensive action.—Exodus 22:2, 3.
  The Bible thus indicates that a person may defend himself or his family if physically assaulted. He may ward off blows, restrain the attacker, or even strike a blow to stun or incapacitate him. The intention would be to neutralize the aggression or stop the attack. This being the case, if the aggressor was seriously harmed or killed in such a situation, his death would be accidental and not deliberate.
  
  
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  Sea Breeze

  The Bible thus indicates that a person may defend himself or his family if physically assaulted. He may ward off blows, restrain the attacker, or even strike a blow to stun or incapacitate him.

  Too bad the WT didn't reverse their spiritual food in time for Chris Chavez to save his own life since this article came out after his murder. Sorry about that Chris.

  The WT advice above, while an improvement is till pretty lame, even dangerous.
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  BluesBrother

  I have always understood the WT advice to be as is stated in that quote above . Christians never should commit violence but if personally threatened Witnesses are perfectly free to fight back , even harm their assailant if they can . Nobody ever said that God would save you, He doesn’t. They are not pacifists, just neutral on national conflicts.

  An old Cong Presiding Overseer of mine disturbed a young lad interfering with his car . He called him out , the lad raised a hand and they struggled…. then another lad joined in and our Overseer came off worse . He had his arm and hand bounced up for a week or more … Nobody criticised him , it seemed rather funny at the time.
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  Vanderhoven7

  Yes, Jehovah's Witnesses won't carry guns, but they will quickly call on those who do to come to their rescue.
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  Sea Breeze

  
  

  "So, what should you do if you see a fight?— If it is at school, you can run and tell a teacher. And if it is away from school, you can call one of your parents or a policeman. Yes, even when other people want to fight, we should be peaceable".

  "True disciples of Jesus do all they can to avoid getting into fights."

  The overall tone of WT rules is very pacifist on this subject. Run and tell a teacher or policeman. Wait! Aren't all the police and the military part of the government and controlled by Satan? Why should we call upon agents of Satan to deliver us from evil?

  These were the kinds of questions that troubled me as a pre-teen. It made no sense. In fact, I found that (in spite of WT pacifist rearing) standing up to bullies is the best way to ensure that they leave you alone.

  But, God forbid that you defend yourself and give the bully something to think about. No, don't do that. He might get mad.

  "But what if you let yourself get into a fight and you win? What could happen then?— The one you beat up could come back with some friends. They might even hurt you with a big stick or a knife."

  
  

  More fear.

  
  
  
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  truth_b_known

  Yes, Jehovah's Witnesses won't carry guns, but they will quickly call on those who do to come to their rescue.

  JWs also cannot hold privileges in the congregation if they hold a job that requires them to be armed to defend against other people (e.g. Police Officer). However, JWs have no problem calling the police out to save them. Rather hypocritical.
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  road to nowhere

  Tough spot. I know a gun store with armed staff that was robbed. A group that has the drop on you is hard to counter. Qweeksdraw dont work.

  An assumption would be being let go after the ride. Too bad it didn't work. How would you have countered? Bern shot sooner?
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  StephaneLaliberte

  I grew up in the JW and my stand on protection has never changed since I was a kid: You don't start fights but you are allowed to finish 'em.

  Concerning the situation in the OP, I would've tried to find an escape route or tried to fight back. But honestly, it's much harder than it sounds. Fighting looks easy in the movies but when you never ever fight and never consider it, it is much more difficult to gather the courage to fight back. So, even if we say: In the same position, I would have done this or that, perhaps we'd have behaved like him: scared frozen like deers in the headlights.

  About the rules for self defense, in Canada, they're very similar to the Watchtower's. If someone walks in your house with a deadly weapon (baseball bat, gun, knife, crossbow, etc), you maybe allowed to harm them with the weapon of your choice. The question that will come up is: Could you flee or were you cornered and have no other choice?

  If they don't carry anything, I'm not even sure you have the right to fight them out of your house. You are basically expected to call the cops and wait for them. The idea is that you are not allowed to protect material possessions. If you think about it, it's basically what the Watchtower teaches.

  Honestly, I don't like that reasoning. If it were to me, it would be like the states: Stand your grounds. Your home is your safe place and you should be able to use maximum force to protect it.
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  Mum

  What about using your own good sense/intuition/logic to assess the situation and your right of self-defense or escape? The Watchtower micromanages to a level of putting lives in danger. We all have the ability to figure out what we can and can't do in a given situation.
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  smiddy3

  when any JW tells me that I should never defend myself, and instead rely on God to deliver me from any potential violent attack.

  You could also say that when Israel were fighting wars backed by GOD against their enemies front-line soldiers were still going to die and not saved by GOD.

  2Sam, 14-18