by Vanderhoven7 43 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
slimboyfat: not much different than the claim that most of the 2 billion who currently claim to be Christians are mistaken.
I think that's a fair point. I hadn't ever thought of it that way, and I probably would have had trouble accepting it. It's amazing how our brains compartmentalize stuff.
Questions From Readers
● Large numbers of Christians are said to have been put to death during the Roman persecution in the first few centuries of the Common Era. How, then, is it possible for thousands in this century to have been called to become part of the body of Christ composed of only 144,000 persons?—U.S.A.
I remember now. Bart Erhman specifically referenced the small number of Christians put to death by Nero etc in the first century.
So do they claim all first century Christians were anointed? And some came along the first day and these were chosen to be kings and priests?
it’s a rubbish system, depending on when you were born depends if you live on Earth or be a spiritual king for all eternity
there were definitely more than 144k back then alone. Then we are told that god has been choosing different ones throughout the millenniums, and tens of thousands more in modern times
something doesn’t add up
The whole JW doctrine of the apostasy after the first century is nonsense. In their pitiful Ezekiel book from 2018, they claim that the second century ‘apostasy’ was a ‘spiritual exile’ analogous to the exile to Babylon. But that would mean the ‘apostasy’ was itself a ‘punishment’, but without any actual reason to warrant punishment in the first place.
"For 19 centuries there was only the one calling, the heavenly one, with Jehovah being very selective as to who would serve with his Son to make up the Kingdom government." (The Watchtower, February 15, 1982 p. 30)
w52 1/15 p. 62 Questions From Readers
According to the article “Hated for His Name” in the September 1, 1951, Watchtower, hundreds of thousands of Christians died in the “ten persecutions” starting in Nero’s time, 144,000 dying in Egypt alone during one of the persecutions. How can this be harmonized with the Scriptural limitation of 144,000 placed on the number being in Christ’s body, and which position was the only one open to Christians during those centuries?—J.A., Dominican Republic.
The article did not class with any finality the individuals that died during these persecutions, but spoke of the results in a general way. Note that a key qualification was made in the case referred to in the question: “In the province of Egypt alone, 144,000 such professed Christians died by violence in the course of this persecution, in addition to another 700,000 who died as a result of fatigues encountered in banishment or under enforced public works.” The victims are identified as “professed Christians”, not Christians in fact. Many of those persons might have been caught in the wave of persecution, but may never have actually preached the truth or followed in Jesus’ footsteps, being only professed Christians. They knew the world they lived in was rotten and they were listening to the message of the Christians and willing to die for it even though not in line for the high calling in Christ Jesus. Many professed Christians today might be willing to die for their faith, but still not be Jesus’ footstep followers and meeting the Scriptural requirements for such."
Isn't this GB assumption insulting to those who made the ultimate sacrifice for staying true to their Christian beliefs? Of course the Faithful Slave knows they were not real Christians because they have a number theory that says the 144,000 is a literal number.
The latest teaching is that anointed and other sheep were selected by Jehovah without regard to the time period. Taken as stated this would imply that a Christian in the first century could just as easily have been of the other sheep, and a new convert in 2024 could be anointed. This throws a spanner in the works of any calculation about how many anointed could have lived where and when.
@Slim,
Do you have quotations from Watchtower literature that show this change in their teaching?
I’ve had a look and not found anything yet. Does anyone else remember this?
This comment from July WT 2016 implies that at least some had the “earthly hope” already in 1919. I’ll keep looking for something more explicit.
“Has this promise of unity come true in our time? Yes. Initially, the prophecy began to be fulfilled in 1919 when God’s people were gradually reorganized and reunited. Satan’s attempts to divide them permanently had been thwarted.
At that time, the majority of those reunited had the hope of becoming kings and priests in heaven with Jesus. (Rev 20:6) Symbolically, they were like the stick for Judah. However, as time progressed, more and more of those with an earthly hope started to join themselves to these spiritual Jews.”
w16 July p. 31
@Slim,
We are still dealing with 20th century other sheep.
