The Christian Message - inspired of fear?

by Mandybp 37 Replies latest jw friends

  • Jayson
    if you don't love Christ you won't go to heaven you'll go to hell.

    Has anyone ever been told this story:

    Everyone had finally made it into heaven and there was a great celibration going on. But Jesus just stood at the gates looking out upon the horizion. And I asked him, "lord what are you doing?" And with a tear in his eyes he replied "I'm waiting for Judus."

    If one goes we all go. If one does not go then none of us will. To me, it is that simple.

    When someone tells you that you are not good enough for God please, just shrug it off. That person is an idiot.

  • gumby
    both are ruled by fear aren't they? If you don't love Jehovah you will die at Armageddon, if you don't love Christ you won't go to heaven you'll go to hell.

    IMO those statements are not the Christian message

    Brummie......I believe that is a Christian message.Everywhere I have read in the N.T., that is one of the messages. Jesus is the 'door, the 'way, the 'light, there is no LIFE in anyone else or another NAME under heaven in which men MUST get saved.

    How do you see the message as different than that?


  • kes152

    The 'truth' is...

    "We did not recieve a spirit of slavery causing fear again (as those who call themselves "anointed" did in the JW Organization), but we received a spirit of adoption as sons, by which spirit we cry out "Abbi-Jah." (Abba-yah) (Romans 8:15).

    The good news of the kingdom is, "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord, and his Christ has come into the world to give himself as a ransom in behalf of many and to offer to ANYONE asking, ANYONE seeking, ANYONE knocking to recieve the free gift of holy spirit to be poured out upon them to give them everlasting life so that they will not be judged on the last day, but they will have passed over from death to life."

    This good news of the kingdom will be preached throughout the inhabited to a witness to all the nations. This holy spirit is still offered to anyone at all. No fear, no coercion. It is a free gift and if one does not want it, one does not receive it.

    May you have peace!


  • Brummie

    gee I just got one of those rollback errors and lost the life changing message I wrote, I mean it really would have changed the world...too bad I guess.

    Gumby, you'll have to settle for the edited version.

    I see it like this. We all die and go to hell/sheol/hades, this is an international fact not only a Chritian teaching, why do Christians get condemned for speaking it out? ....However Christ offers to redeem us from this cycle, we just have to accept that he can do it.

    eg, Say a person goes to an orphanage to adopt a child, when that person gets there none of the children want to go with the adopter except for 1 . So the parent takes the one that wants to be adopted. Do we them condemn the parent for not taking them all or do we say thank you for at least redeeming one?

    This, I believe, is the Christian veiwpoint, doesnt sound so bad to me.


    As for a flaming hell, well that was created for the Devil and his angels according to Scripture. I think some Churches relate hell more to Dantes inferno that to Scripture.

  • gumby

    see it like this. We all die and go to hell/sheol/hades, this is an international fact not only a Chritian teaching, why do Christians get condemned for speaking it out? ....However Christ offers to redeem us from this cycle, we just have to accept that he can do it.

    Well I don't want to argue with my buddy but I am anyway

    Yes we all die.....but that's not what Chrisianity teaches is it? The soul continues on whether good or bad according to Chrisianity.... wheras others simply feel your dead.

    You just said we HAVE to accept Christ. If I had good reason to I would, but I don't, so I won't.......yet he will kill me if I don't.

    Your adoption illustration. You said what if only one wanted to go. Does that make the others evil for not accepting the offer? Why didn't they WANT to go? Because they are selfish.....or because they do not know the "new people".

    Many are not convinced to put their hopes and trust in christ because of other evidence to the contrary in their hearts and minds...........but Jesus is going to kill them for not accepting him.

    I don't see the reasoning as sound.


    Edited to tell brummie that next time you lose a post to an error message.......simply hit your refresh button and that should submit your post. (Your not mad at me now are ya?)

  • Mandybp

    I still go with Gumby sorry, at the end of the day if you don't 'want' the free gift of Holy Spirit you're undeserving of anything good at all.

    I'd also question this statement:

    "We all die and go to hell/sheol/hades, this is an international fact not only a Chritian teaching"

    Is it a fact? I'm not aware of non-Christian religions that proclaim there is a hell. If you know of any could you let me know so I can do some research?

    Hmmm, this also brings up the point of what exactly is hell? Is it a fiery grave for eternal torment or just a place of 'nothingness' as the JW's teach?

    Presuming hell is as the Christians teach (a place of fiery eternal torment) it's not a great option is it? And according to the Bible the *only* way to salvation is through Jesus and that's the only other choice. Perhaps I'm missing the point entirely (no doubt someone will let me know :)

  • Jayson

    Mandy it might be worth your time to take some college classes on the philosophy of religion.

    Also there is the book "Why won't God go away?" I haven't read it yet but it will twist your question in a whole new way.

    There is a difference between Christian values and Christian doctrine/dogmas. But that's a whole different thing.

    Truth is you are good enough for God. But you have to accept it.

  • DJ


    I would like to offer you some advice. You said that you want to believe but.... I would ask you to start with prayer and yes, pour your heart out. Tell God that you are confused and seek to find him. Tell him all of your cares for he cares for you. I know that you don't feel worthy of his love but the cold truth is that you aren't worthy. None of us are. He gives love to those who seek him. Ask him your questions and read the bible if you are led to. There is your peace. Inner peace is a spiritual blessing and a journey. He is fully aware of your longing and he knows all that you have been through. You can read books that the other posters mentioned but I would ask you to first, seek His face not man's. Those books are man's wisdom which is a folly. Religions are man's. God is not manmade. He doesn't live in a temple anymore, therefore he is not in a building but he wants to be within you. Ask and you shall receive. Yes, and be persistent! I wish you all the best and I hope you find your peace in truth, which is Jesus. love to you, dj

  • Mandybp

    Jason :) I'd love to do some philosophy classes - it might help me come to grips with all this stuff :) Thanks for the heads up about the book - is the author's surname Yancey by an chance? Sounds like one of his.

    DJ :) Thanks for your post, I really appreciate it. I guess the issue for me is that I'm just getting some self esteem after a while in therapy and it's so hard to turn round and say "I'm not worthy" after trying so hard for so long. It just doesn't jell if you know what I mean.

    *sighs* One day I'll get this :)

  • Jayson

    Why God Won't Go Away: Brain Science and the Biology of Belief
    Andrew Newberg, Eugene D'Aquili, Vince Rause

    Mandy you are good enough as you are. Believe in yourself. One thing that we alway worry about is has GAWD forgivin us for our sins. Well, I don't know that I have forgiven him. I suppose no one is perfect so I can forgive him for his sins if he can forgive me. Have you ever thought that we are Gods hands and Gods eyes and Gods ears.......God/Christ/Allah/...Is inside of you and all around you. It is not in a building of wood or stone. (I read that somewhere)

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