Help! Spouse thinks JW religion the most logical

by bittersweet 33 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • bittersweet

    My husband and I were discussing what makes some people become jw's last night. I was saying that if I hadn't grown up in it, I would have never been drawn to it at all. I'm not a very spiritual person. He told me he wasn't a spiritual person either. He said the only reason he became a witness was because it was the only religion tha made perfect sense. He said, and I quote, " this is the only religion that is logical, and makes sense ". This kind of surprised me. I don't find much that is logical at all. Then I thought that maybe, if I could gather up some info that could show him how illogical this religion is, then maybe I could show it to him ( though he probably won't read it ).

    So what does anybody think the best thing to show him would be? Any help would be appreciated.

    Thanks in advance for any help.

  • Hamas

    Your best bet is to attack the doctrine of the Faithful and Discreet slave. They say that they are the Faithful and Discreet slave Jesus spoke of in Matthew and once you challenge that doctrine just about everything else crumbles. Without the FADS the authority of the religion is taken away from them, so you could just worship God in the way you want, not them.

    Ask him if he thinks it is logical to believe in a few dirty old men sitting around a table in Brooklyn that have had no knowladge of living in the real world and listen to them rulling the lives of millions of people.

    Is it logical to believe Jesus really selected a group of spiritualistic miracle wheat eating young and naive men to be his spokesmen on earth? ( )

    Is it logical to believe that God would change his 'unmistakable truth' so many times to fit in with what they say?

    If its logic he is after, tell him to convert to Islam and bow several times to the east whilst worshipping God, as surely God would prefer this method of worship other than a hundred plus braindead pupils muttering the thoughts of 12 dirty old men repetitively in polyester suits.

  • bittersweet

    Thanks hamas. That is a good idea to bring up the faithful and discreet slave. I've used the changing light tactic before, but because he believes the FDS, he just spews what they say ( such as they give us food at the proper time, god said the his light would reveal things when needed, blah, blah ). If I can make him see that they aren't god's chosen channel, then all that logic goes out the window.

    The problem I find with most active jw's is that they won't even listen to anything contrary to what the FDS says. They think that if they listen even for a second they are apostate. It drives me mad!

    Thanks again!

  • Analysis

    Since he thinks it is so logical get him to explain some of the following.

    What did sharks, lions and other predators eat in the beginning before Eve sinned? Why did God design them with the abilities that they have to hunt?

    Have him reconcile the Ice Ages with their belief of the flood?

    How does he explain how Kangaroos survived the flood? How did they get to Noah in the Middle East? How did they return to Australia?

  • ashitaka
    He said the only reason he became a witness was because it was the only religion tha made perfect sense.

    -not too much on critical thinking, is he?

    The thing is, he's been robbed of his critical thinking abilities, and really believes there's nothing to question. All bad news about the JWs are Satan's lies, all wrong teachings can be corrected by new light, and inconsistencies in doctrine are normal for a religion (they think), and so they are no different from the world, but of course, so completely separated from it! LOL


  • Hamas

    Analysis :

    Can you please expand on some of the things that you wrote? Why is all that important ?

    Im not having a go at you, im just doing research into all this myself and am curious to find out what you meant by all that. Maybe im a bit slow ! I can see where you are going with that Kangaroo business, but what about the other comments ?

    Cheers bud.

  • wednesday

    My husband says the same thing. he says it is logical to believe that man would live here on this earth. Why should he be in heaven? The only thing that has rattled my husband IS how the supposed org of jehovah has treated people and IE how unloving they really are. He says if jws do not have it right-then no one does. On that i agree. I am afraid of all organized religion now. That all have an agenda.

  • Sentinel

    Reasonable and rational behavior should produce good and logical results. Unfortunately, humans all have their different needs and perceptions of how to fulfill them. Some do very well within the confines of the borg. Their life is all laid out in a neat little contractual package, with every rule and regulation outlined. As long as they fulfil the contract (baptism) then they will remain fairly stable within that lifestyle.

    But, usually, as life progresses, and the human experiences a variety of things, if the person is really thinking about the whole picture, he will see how cult-like the borg is. Just let a family member suffer the wrath of punnishment for being "human" in the form of disassociation or disfellowshipping, and see what happens. Also instances where rules apply to one and not another, and when real hypocracy exists from the platform. A whole new thinking pattern comes into play, that never affected them before. Unless something rocks your boat, then you are no doubt happy in your little boat. The borg protects you, gives you purpose and hope for a better future. The price you pay is losing your own "self". Does that matter? Yes indeed it does!

    In reality, the borg takes you out of reality and plops you into a mix-mash of ever-changing doctrine and rules, whereby the serious sometimes don't know which end is up. And,,,,,,,the sad thing is, they can't even make a decision on their own, without consulting the all-wise borg. Everything they do is related to the "organization". My reason says "where is god in all of this"? Where is the love and compassion that the enlightened being, Jesus taught while on earth? Why do we get involved in the first place? Well, many of us were "born" into it, or were "raised" in it by well-meaning parents, who were at a place in their life, where "something entirely different" sounded so good, so right. They bought the fairy tale. It depends on your needs. By the time your eyes are opened, you are trapped big time.

    You won't be able to change your spouse; you can only change yourself. He has to want to make a change, and each little question that he has, you can make the best of the opportunity by being able to introduce just simple logic into play. For example, just the topic of cults alone should rouse him a bit to at least "think". Buy a book that you believe to be good and just leave it lying around. Mention a few points, then let it go. Even if you don't SEE him checking it out, believe me, he will. Gradually work other things into conversation. Never attack the borg directly, or he will become instantly defensive. After all, it is his life-line right now.

    Keep us posted as to what happens. Remember, as the JW's are so well known for saying "that they may be won over without a word", your husband may come to really SEE what is so obvious to us.

  • worldlygirl

    I feel your pain and I wish I knew how to help. My husband says the same things - verbatim! Trying to reason with him is like talking to a rock. I'm watching this thread with great anticipation - - HELP ME TOO!!!!!

  • acsot

    Bittersweet said:

    The problem I find with most active jw's is that they won't even listen to anything contrary to what the FDS says. They think that if they listen even for a second they are apostate. It drives me mad!

    Yes, it drives me mad also, even though I was one of those people who wouldn't dare listen to a negative word about the FDS. However, at the same time, I had this nagging doubt that if it was the truth, and so logical, then it could stand up to any amount of scrutiny, any type of criticism levelled at it. If a belief system is so fragile that it crumbles under even the tiniest criticism, then, logically, it can't be truth.

    These type of doubts, along with the horrendous lack of love in the WTS, eventually led to such cognitive dissonance that I figured that if JWs did have the "truth", I'd rather die at Armageddon than worship such a petty, nit-picking, changeable god as the one described by the FDS.

    Maybe if you suggest to your spouse that the truth can stand up to any type of assault, he'll listen. On the other hand, if just by listening to or reading something which they feel comes from Satan can overthrow Jehovah's truth (i.e. criticism of their confidence in 607 b.c. as being the destruction of Jerusalem), in a sense it's like saying that Satan is stronger than Jehovah.

    Don't know if the above makes sense, but the boss asked me to do something so wanted to finish this off in a hurry.

    Keep us posted.

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