Elder "D": Catholics No Longer Believe in a Trinity

by Saename 15 Replies latest social current

  • Saename

    So in this topic, I mentioned I had a conversation with an elder "D." This elder said that the Catholic church admitted the Trinity is unscriptural. I'm pretty sure this is not true. The doctrine of Trinity is the most fundamental belief in the Catholic church. It doesn't seem plausible to me that they would denounce this doctrine. So I think that either someone (some JW) made this up and then spread the false news, or someone (some JW) misquoted, either intentionally or not, a Catholic source to prove that the Trinity doesn't exist. It seems to me like someone misquoted some Catholic source to show that the Catholic church no longer believes in the Trinity. If that's the case, does anyone know how that happened? Was it published in some publication or something? I'm really confused...

  • lancelink

    Not true, another elder believing his thoughts are real.

  • Saename

    As I said, I'm pretty sure that's not true. I've had conversations with Catholics not so long ago (debating philosophy), and they definitely believed in the Trinity. I'm just wondering how this elder got his information.

  • lancelink
  • Anders Andersen
    Anders Andersen

    The elder probably used his kindergarten reading and comprehension skills on something like this: https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102005282?q=trinity+catholic+encyclopedia&p=par#h=22

    Then superimposed his own magic thinking.

    The Trinity is not a teaching of Jesus or of the early Christians. As noted previously, it is “a teaching of the church.” In its 1999 issue on the Trinity, The Living Pulpit observed: “Sometimes, it seems that everyone assumes that the doctrine of the trinity is standard Christian theological fare,” but it added that it is not “a biblical idea.”
    The New Catholic Encyclopedia (1967) discusses the Trinity at length and admits: “The Trinitarian dogma is in the last analysis a late 4th-century invention. . . . The formulation ‘one God in three Persons’ was not solidly established, certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of faith, prior to the end of the 4th century.”
  • GLTirebiter

    According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church, the doctrine of the trinity remains "the central mystery of Christian faith and life." For those who prefer to not click links to the Vatican web site:

    232 Christians are baptized "in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit." Before receiving the sacrament, they respond to a three-part question when asked to confess the Father, the Son and the Spirit: "I do." "The faith of all Christians rests on the Trinity."

    233 Christians are baptized in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit: not in their names, for there is only one God, the almighty Father, his only Son and the Holy Spirit: the Most Holy Trinity.

    234 The mystery of the Most Holy Trinity is the central mystery of Christian faith and life. It is the mystery of God in himself. It is therefore the source of all the other mysteries of faith, the light that enlightens them. It is the most fundamental and essential teaching in the "hierarchy of the truths of faith". The whole history of salvation is identical with the history of the way and the means by which the one true God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, reveals himself to men "and reconciles and unites with himself those who turn away from sin".

  • shepherdless

    Most Catholics would agree that there is no express reference to the trinity in the bible. (A typical knowledgable Catholic would probably say it is inferred from Matthew 28:19, etc.)

    My guess is that Elder D views a Catholic admission of no express biblical reference to trinity, as the same as an admission of it being unscriptural.

    Why did Elder D raise this anyway? It is fallacious reasoning to try and support one theology by finding fault in another.

  • Anders Andersen
    Anders Andersen

    Btw ask the elder to show the bible verse where it says 'governing body exists and is apppointed by Jehovah'.

    Can't be found anywhere either.

  • smiddy

    If the Catholics dont believe in a trinity ,then neither do the JW`s believe in a Paradise earth .!

    Where is it explicitly stated in the Bible the words God is a Trinity. {catholics }

    Where is it explicitly stated in the Bible the words Paradise Earth .{ Jehovahs Witnesses}

  • sir82

    He's just exposing his ignorance.

    Any Catholic with a rudimentary understanding of their own religion will readily admit there is no strictly-Biblical basis for the trinity belief. At best there are "allusions" to it.

    As noted in the Catholic Encyclopedia and many other sources, the explicit doctrine of the trinity took many centuries to finally crystallize.

    For Catholics, the Bible is a significant, but by far not the only, source of doctrine. At least equal in importance is "continued revelation", the idea that God continues to inspire his "one true church" to understanding new things even though the time for writing scripture has ended.

    JWs should be familiar with the concept. Most JWs readily accept the teaching that God is somehow "spirit-directing" the WTS, and that JWs should accept the writings of the WT, even on extra-Bilical matters as "Jehovah feeding his sheep".

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