Democracy ceases to be effective once the people realize they have the keys to the treasury.
Why the left is failing
by jelly 19 Replies latest social current
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bikerchic
My humble appolizies in advance......I am the first to admit I am politicaly ignorant something I am striving to do something about so I won't feel quiet so helpless as an American citizen.
That said......Bush and his admistration sucks! Whew, I feel better already!
Dakoda Red, you posted an article above seems a bit pro Bush? I have recently had this book brought to my attention by my neice, you may want to check it out:
I'm going to check it out from the library, it looks like a good and informative read. I always suspected that Bush rigged the election witht the whole Florida vote count, seems it's worse than that.
Katie (proud to have finally registerd to vote)
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Double Edge
Erm ... did I imagin the whole "let's count them again" shambles with the votes? I believe that Gore got more votes than Bush but he got in thanks to Cousin Jed's results. Whatever the reason, it was a close run thing and hardly "failed miserably". Hardly a massive endorsement for Bush
Hold on. Bush had nearly 50% of the popular vote. Clinton was elected his first time out with 43% of the popular vote. So Clinton became president with 57% voting AGAINST him. .... politics.....
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DakotaRed
I'm going to check it out from the library, it looks like a good and informative read. I always suspected that Bush rigged the election witht the whole Florida vote count, seems it's worse than that.
Katie, I always encourage all to dig and discover just who is the better person for them to choose. Who that may be is a very personal choice. Yes, the article and book is pro-Bush, but many others are anti-Bush, so I guess it works out, none I know of are actually middle of the road. But, in reading the article, please note the recount was initiated at the behest of predominately liberal, or, anti-Bush papers. The results also showed that Bush won, by an extremely narrow margin, but still a win.
If looking back, both sides didn't act very well in Florida and did what they could to win. I can't forget Gore demanding and succeeding in getting thousands of absentee military votes disqualified from even being counted while striving to have every other vote counted for him by any method he could imagine.
In retrospect, the Florida election was a farce and an embarrassment for both parties and the country as a whole. Although not authorized by law, I've always felt that the whole thing should have been thrown out and redone. But, I imagine that would also have caused massive problems.
Congratulations on registering to vote and actually seeking information on the candidates before choosing. Even if we vote for different parties, at least vote by information that agrees with your outlook, not because someone else tells you who to vote for or because they may be popular. You'll make a good voter.
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Preston
The reason the Democratic Party failed so miserably in the last election and will probably in the next is multifaceted.
I think you're talking about the mid-terms elections here, not the last presidential election. I would not say that the democratic party "failed miserably". After all even though the republicans have the house, the senate, the presidency (both America's and Britain's), and the supreme court, like the republican party, the democratic party gained seats, lost seats, gained states, lost states. Here in Arizona, an extremely conservative state, also a state that hasn't had a democratic governor in 20 years, we appointed a democratic woman as governor.
As for America's political landscape, the majority of Americans really don't care either way. The voter turnout for the midterm election was the lowest for any midterm election since 1942. I did vote BTW...
What have the Democrats offered to stimulate the economy?
The economy's cyclical, there's only so much you can do to help in a time like this and many democrats are not unrealistic ito admit this. Democrats do have a better solution and that is a "hands off" approach to taking money out of the Social Security Trust Fund, money that is owed to the American people, and used it to finance tax cuts that make life worse for most Americans. The bulk of those tax cuts went to those in the top 2 percent of income earners - people like Ken Lay and other corporate plunderers of the American economy. The President's tax cuts do little to create demand. If a doctor had a patient bleeding to death, telling the patient to wait a few years for a transfusion, like the Bush plan does, wouldn't do much good.
Education - nothing except more money (not the best solution)
Democrats like Vermont's Howard Dean want to see more control placed on the local level. Vermont, BTW, was several years ahead of the federal government in improving standards and accountability in our classrooms while a new federal law will result in the mis-identification of between 30 and 65 percent of all community schools (depending on your state) as failing. The enormous cost of coming into federal compliance will fall on local property taxpayers.Keep big governmnet out of this.
War on Terror - Splintered from hawks to appeasers
Splintered? The majority of democrats support the war on terror. What's wrong with that? It just so happens that most democrats want to prioritize this issue over Iraq who, BTW, we still have no proof of having any ties to Al Qaeda...
Second, they are being seen as obstructionist for no reason. Case in point is the Latino judge that they are filibustering. They are asking him question that no judge before has been asked, impartial treatment like that will not be forgotten by the electorate.
A lot of Democrats are opposing Mr. Estrada's confirmation primarily for ideological reasons, just as I have no doubt that some of the Republicans promoting him are ideologically motivated. But many of Mr. Estrada's opponents are genuinely troubled by the same lack of information that concerns me. They're not putting blind trust in the Executive Branch's private selection criteria, or information provided by the nominee at confirmation hearings.
Third, both parties have extreme elements. The Democrats are not controlling their extreme elements they are instead being controlled by them. Too many extremely left Democrats are anti-military, blame America, and blame Jews types that are getting to much airtime creating an image for the entire party that will be a death sentence in the next election.
Are you talking about the voters or the politicans. You're always going o have extremist views in both parties...but then again, you do state that in your first sentence.
The crazy Dem from Washington the talked about the wonderful things Osama did for Arabs.
You are going to have to give me names and specifications here, although the democrat who made the coments about the Jews did resign he day he made that comment. All of these guys have put both of their feet in their mouths on time or another. The same with republicans like....oh, I don't know...Trent Lott, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Donald Rumsfeld (I'm amazed at his ease at putting down allies with name-calling, particularly in light of the years it took to build those relationships) Oh well, check out this link too: http://www.democraticunderground.com/top10/03/103.html and come back when you have a better explanation as to why the republicans want you to pay more for health care than the democrats do....
The crazy Dem from the midwest that compared Alquada to American reveloutionary fighters
The crazy Dem from the east coast that blamed the Jews
Al Gores switch from a Hawk to a dove, completly contradicting himself
Clinton's comments
Carter's comments -
jelly
Simon
I was talking about the midterm election, not the last presidential one
Preston
- The Republican gains in the last election were extrorodinay
- I also do not agree with Bush's tax cut but for valid reasons not mindless class warfare BS.
- Bush's tax cut (my criticisms)
- incrase the stockmarket value by 10% - not really necessary will help some pensioners but not a huge gain for economy
- enable companies to offer IPOs for more money - with interest rates low access to money is not a problem, this is not an issue that needs to be solved
- make money more readily available for capitol investment - see above
- increase a limited amount of cash flow into the economy - the group that will have significant increases is the same group that tends to invest and not spend so not as much will be pumped into economy as estimated
- Most Americans have 401k's they are already tax deductible so no benefit (other than a 10% gain in value of the portfolio)
- The economy is cyclical but the government does influnce it in one direction or another. Your take on the economy is not the same as the democrats, the 'hands off approach' is my closly tied to extreme right republicans. At the risk of sounding rude, you are completly wrong here. Read up on president Hoover, and the business cycles of the late 1800's and tell me if you still feel the government should just leave its hands off business. Don't get me wrong there is a balancing act here. Too much government will destroy and economy, too little regulation do almost as much damage.
- Dean sounds good, I would also like to see alternatives like vouchers and charter schools. This is why in my first post I said it was not good that the Dems were crippling themselves; good ideas come from the left sometimes.
- Joe Liberman was booed last weekend during the California democratic party convention. You might not want to admit it but that says alot.
- I was talking about both voters and politicians. For a party to be effective the extreme elements must be controlled, the reps do the dems do not (at least at this moment in time)
- All those dems I mentioned were recently in the news, I did not memorize their names but if you want to find out search google.
Terry -
gsx1138
I agree with Dakota in that if the Republicans would steer themselves away from the Christian Coalition I would vote for them. As far as I'm concerned the CC is only different from the Taliban in methods. Otherwise, both want a country ruled by religion.
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Preston
At the risk of sounding rude, you are completly wrong here. Read up on president Hoover, and the business cycles of the late 1800's and tell me if you still feel the government should just leave its hands off business.
You are not rude at all. Read my last statement again....
Democrats do have a better solution and that is a "hands off" approach to taking money out of the Social Security Trust Fund
The "hands off" approach that I mentioned was not directed to the economy in general.
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funkyderek
you dont think 170,000 disallowed votes (mostly of black and hispanic voters) could have made a difference do you?
I thought voting was done by secret ballot. How do you know those whose votes were disallowed were mostly black and hispanic? Or are you just trying to make black and hispanic people look stupid by implying they can't follow simple instructions?
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jelly
Preston,
Sorry, I guess I misread your post. For the record, the Democrats have offered no economic stimulus packages in DC. You imply that they have a strong economic plan, well what is it. And why haven’t they advertised it. Details and facts not propaganda and generalizations please.
I don’t like Pat Robertson or Jerry Falwell either, they are not elected officials and have no bearing to the discussion.
Donald Rumsfeld I have no problem with. There is an argument that our ’allies’ are the ones that hurt our relationship, not by not siding with us, but by comparing Bush to Hitler and things like that.Oh well, check out this link too: http://www.democraticunderground.com/top10/03/103.html and come back when you have a better explanation as to why the republicans want you to pay more for health care than the democrats do....
This statement proves exactly my point.- democratic underground - not a news source, its a spin source its like getting infomation from the RNC's web page.
- You criticize repulicans on healthcare; where are the democratic alternatives (not planned but actual current bills they are pushing, there are none, they used to have alternative bills for this but not anymore)
- You criticize Rumsfeld - whats the democratic alternatives, to the present course of action, i have heard of none
Terry