I know many like myself have had alot of different experiances and have met many different people since leaving the jw's.My question is do you think you knew or found people to be more intelligent in the organization or have you found people to be more stimulating and intelligent outside the organization, setting aside the fact that the people in the organization are apart of it? I'm just curious as to peoples experiances.
What do you think ?
I think there are intelligent people inside the organization... but those intelligent people are the ones having a lot of trouble trying to stay in... trying to convince themselves that it IS "God's Organization here on earth"... Some eventually will come out... the rest will constantly live in fear and depression.
I have met some intelligent people both in and out. Some have had to put blinders on whether they realize it or not.
I disagree with Email. Intelligents has nothing to do with if you stay in or get out. I't has to do with are you willing to leave a family and a life you knew behind.
Edited by - LuckyLucy on 7 February 2003 15:30:11
Stupid people run amuck everywhere.
As the two previous posters have said, I have known smart people in and out of the oraganization. I don't find it very benificial to think of the organization as special or different, but just a microcosim of the larger world...with some very strange rules for membership. Heh.
I have to agree with email and LuckyLucy, with the exeption of the disagreeing with email.
I consider myself to be a very intelligent person and that is why I decided to leave. The first wall I hit on my way out though was trying to convince myself that, yes, dubs are the true religion. That alone kept me there for another 2 years. I had trouble with many issued but looked the other way.
After I decided that the dubs dont have it right, the next wall I hit was how my leaving would affect my family. This kept me in for another year until I decided that they will have to just deal with my leaving.
There are many intelligent people, but even smart people can be fooled.
Outside for sure.
Intelligence isn't all it's cracked up to be. I know a lot of intelligent people inside the organization, who know every detail of the Society's doctrine on every little insignificant prophecy, every doctrine, every detail of the Watchtower's history, and know exactly where to find it in the Watchtower. To use the term that one who became apostate long before I did applied to his brother, the elder, they are "walking Watchtowers".
Unfortunately, these very intelligent people are not able to think. Because of the Society's mind control, they are unable to see the flaws in their own teaching, and they use a form of doublethink to rationalize any discrepancies that are brought to their attention.
So it's not a question of raw intelligence, but of the ability to apply that intelligence to useful tasks. Kind of like the kid who can't grasp elementary math, but knows the batting averages of every major league baseball player. It all depends on where you focus your attention.
This is based on my experience as a Witness, and observations made while I was still a loyal Witness.
There are dumb people everywhere, but there are more smart people outside of the Witnesses than inside. I found that when conversation strayed from Witness topics, most JWs were intellectually lost.
I noticed a general dumbing down of people the longer they stayed as Witnesses. Even while I was a Witness, I attributed this to the amount of time spent studying WT literature, attending meetings and generally not taking in any non-WT information and having few non-JW interests. I was dismayed to find that when the topic was not about a meeting or literature, most JWs floundered.
It really bothered me to see this difference in my ex's sister. Before baptism, she was able to talk on a variety of topics and was a really interesting person to have a conversation with. Several years after baptism, she didn't have much to say outside of the latest WT meeting or literature. It was so sad to see such a mind decline, and such an interesting lady turn so boring.
I found most JWs were just plain boring to talk to. My non-JW friends tended to have a wide variety of interests and were very stimulating to be around.
Now, part of this may be certain biases. The JWs tend to attract the lower educated classes, and not those who think for themselves. Then the JW religion discourages outside sources of information and "independent thinking". In my career, the situation was quite the opposite. Hi-tech tends to attract very intelligent, sharp people. People who are creative and like finding out new things and attacking problems in new ways.
I also found a difference between those born in North America and those from other parts of the world. North Americans seemed to focus only on their own countries and to talk about sex almost continually. Those from other countries, such as Europeans and those from the Middle East tended to have a broad view of the world and were more aware of what was happening inside and outside of North America.
Now, I am not saying that all JWs are dumb or that all North Americans are not aware of what is happening in the world. There are intelligent and non-intelligent in any group. We are all human, and groups of people will include the whole range of intelligence.
Also, in my life, the difference between the boxed-in JW why of thinking and the generally free-thinking hi-tech world would be dramatic.
Edited by - Skeptic on 7 February 2003 16:10:9
There are many intelligent people within the org.
Problem is, they aren't really allowed to use their intelligence for anything that's not WTS related.
They can't really carry on much of a conversation that isn't tied into WT teachings.
They can't discuss things hapening in the world without saying that soon, any time now, the world will be wiped out.
Sure they can recite WT lingo, words, phrases and rules.
But can they or will they be able to discuss issues not pertaining to the WTS?
They've been so ingrained with the WT outlook on things that even thos with intelligence aren't able to expand far beyond the barriers the WTS put in place for them.
Their intelligence isn't allowed to expand to its full potential.