Are ALL criticisms of the Society justified? (page 2)

Francois

Well, actually, I feel that some pedophiles I know hold down responsible jobs, have good credit ratings, love their wives, take care of their children, wouldn't jaywalk for money, actually tithe their tenth to the Tower. In short, they're pillars of the community except for that one little flaw that they like screwing little girls.

Now, you can say what you want about cults. If JWs actually performed public services of various kinds. If they visited old people in nursing homes; if they helped old folks in the upkeep of their houses; if they participated in neighborhood crime watches; if they did a number of good and decent things in the community, they would still be a CULT.

They would still destroy families.

They would continue to ruin lives.

They would continue to shelter, protect, and hide pedophiles.

They would continue to kill innocents via their indefensible blood policy.

The GB would continue to play out the role of modern-day Pharisees.

The elders would continue to be modern-day scribes.

And the entire organization and its beliefs would stink to high heaven.

I believe the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses should be attacked with the very truth about itself, and God knows there's enough of that so no one needs to make up anything with which to attack them. But frankly, I have nothing good to say about them. I don't think there IS anything good to say about them. I want to see them gone. For good. For ever.

The world will be a much better place without Jehovah's Witnesses in it.

francois

ISP

In the words of the "Prominent Bethelite":
The Watchtower Society and the Jehovah's Witnesses Cult is an embodiment of SPIRITUAL PORNOGRAPHY, a WOLFISH TRICK, a MOST FILTHY LIE, a CHEAT, a SCAM, a DISGUSTING ABOMINATION, a BLASPHEMOUS INSULT, a WICKED FRAUD, a DISGRACE, a SCANDAL, a PEDOPHILE PARADISE - and a DAMNED OUTRAGE from start to finish.
Whatever bad and cruel and nasty and insulting things that the Farkel Class says about the Watchtower and its Daughter Harlots the Enabling Class - the Watchtower is FAR WORSE - and it, and those who knowingly participate in its fiendish plan, deserve FAR WORSE than even the AlanF Class seems to want for them.
Russell, Joe Rutherford, Knorr, F.Franz and their modern-day antitypes and shameless enablers to me are akin to Hitler, Joe Goebbels, Himmler, Goering and their jackbooted S.S. murderers. Little wonder that S.S. Reichsfuehrer Himmler unambiguously expressed his admiration for Watchtower-inspired and Brooklyn-controlled fanaticism - after all, they ran parallel organizations, and Himmler explicitly stated he wanted his stormtroopers to mimic the blind, insane obedience showed by j-Goober's Witlesses.
The same fate that met these sorts of Nazis should meet these Spiritually-Criminal members of Satan's visible Organization.
I hope (though I do not at all believe) that there is a Hell. For it is Hell where the Swine Class of hypocrites, cheats, blasphemers and filthy, disgusting liars and Spiritual Criminals and Spiritual Rapists and Spiritual Sodomizers and Spiritual Pornographers and Spiritual Murderers who run (at every level) the False Prophet Borg deserve to be sent, and deserve to stay forever, roasting in agony.
Evil must be hated and must be fought and nothing, not even love, is more important than this. Oh, sure. I know how to HATE, you do not need to remind me. It is pretty evident. I was taught how to, by the professionals at hatred. The Wicked Jehovah's Witnesses Whoreganization. One bit of Cultic training I choose not to discard...
I don't hate people, though, just the wickedness that lies within people and things.
--
Focus
(Death to the Disgusting Watchtower Thing! Class)

ISP

Anything missed out?

ISP

Warrigal

I see your point, logansrun, but you must remember that for many of us the local elders represented the WTS. If an elder was one who opposed men wearing jeans, that was the impression one got of the entire organization. Each KH was its own little world and those inhabiting it were told that this is what Jehovah said.

If you had no way of getting the 'big picture', you went by what you experienced. I was a member of a congregation where the presiding elder hated cats....and I owned cats. I was counselled for wearing cat earrings. Nothing I said made any difference.....cats were not to be kept by a true witness of Jehovah.

Then when I got the bigger picture....the Dateline expose for one thing....it all seemed to blow up at once. All the lies, the deceptions, the petty power struggles. So for me...yes it was easy to justify all the criticisms heaped upon the society. Now I'm slowly learning to separate the wheat from the chaff and viewing the org. with a critical eye.

Warrigal

heathen

I can't always tell for certain who has the legitimate right to bitch , There certainly have been some who endeavored to deliberately distort the facts in an attempt to defame the WT at any cost . I think they do leave themselves wide open to this . I think they should put a sign out front , warning the light is hazardous to your health . lol

Gizmo

In my experience the WTS genuinely feels it is doing the right thing.

Now Logan, a psychopathic killer could believe they are genuinely doing the right thing too, and even believe it's for the good of mankind.

You know who first comes to mind? Er...Hitler, Idi Amin, Saddam Hussein, just to name 3. Granted they used a different tactic, to get attention, (it is said the pen is mightier than the sword) obviously they didn't think so. So they used the more direct approach let's say. They each, in their own mind were doing the right thing, and were able to sway millions upon millions to believe it too. Did that make them right?.

As far as your personal experience with the society, I dare say it's not necessarily more enlightened than any others here that have been involved within the (b)org in some capacity or other.

I understand what you're getting at, outright lies and sensationalism is counter productive, however I don't believe there is anything genuine in the (b)orgs intent.

The cult brainwashing is still deep in you Young Luke

Welcome to the dark side

William Penwell

The district overseer at the assembly said that we (the Jdubs) are right and all those other worldly people are controled by the liar the Devil. Oh yeah .01% of the worlds population is right and all you other 99.99% are all wrong... I guess thats the WT damage control over the Pedophile issue. He also said, The apostates are always attacking us but what do they have to offer in return? Do they have a hope for the future? I thought this was a clever way to keep the rank and file under control to the cult.

Will

mustang

Logan: Bingo!!! Bingo!!! Bingo!!!

I almost can't say it enough!!! You are right "on the money"!!!

There are some on this board who likely believe that I am a JW "apologist". This is because I feel as you do and dont believe in going overboard with criticisms. Criticisms, where warranted, are certainly to be applied.

But, where something that WTS says MAY HAVE BASIS, I let it slide. You can certainly find some OBVIOUSLY GLARING ERROR to put in place of the questionable matter. I prefer to be both accurate and fair, rather than to be "rabid", as WTS followers are.

The main thing here is not that I would be an apologist for the WTS:

I DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO BE AN APOLOGIST FOR "THE APOSTATES"!!!!

Personally, I've spent 50 years getting out of the clutches of a sociopathic JW. He is (IMO) the most obsessed person on the planet; he is totally without social conscience or skills and totally lacking compunction. Long after I left the Borg, he dogged me around the country in attempts to drag me back to the KH, enlisting aid from the network of "brothers".

(I pioneered, was a Servant [before MS & Elder arrangements], was groomed for "better things", saw the "back-room dirt" and then reversed out into a slowwwww fade.) While I feel that many JW's would let me go my own way, there are plenty of JWs like him that wouldn't. After all, it is important to "save those souls", especially from themselves!!!!

For speaking moderately, and for speaking out "against the current" at times, and for trying to save what family relations I have left, I know that I have been cursed on this Web community a few times

I would like to see WTS gone and forgotten. However, while WTS uses "means both fair or foul", I prefer to stick to the use of "means most fair".

Mustang

Edited by - mustang on 2 February 2003 13:33:35

Edited by - mustang on 2 February 2003 13:34:22

link

logansrun,

Congratulations on what is, in general, a well thought out and reasoned post. I would however like to point out one error.

You have managed to do what the Society do so well and attach a fact to a fallacy before calling them both facts. You said :

The general idea floated around that the JW organization is collecting millions from the public and it's members and is engaged in the most duplicitous of financial practices. All of this is utter hogwash.

You have made two statements (a) "the organisation are collecting millions from the public and its members" and (b) "is engaged in the most duplicitous of financial practices"

Having linked these two statements together you then proceed to say:"All of this is utter hogwash".

Statement (a) is not utter hogwash and the proof of this is given on very recent posts to this board.

I hope you will agree that this example is not in keeping with the general idea given in your opening post on this thread regarding reasonableness.

link

logansrun

ISP,

Thank you for providing an excellent example of what I am trying to speak out against.

Your fellow apostate,

Bradley

Are ALL criticisms of the Society justified?

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