WT gets Grampa to lie for them?

by refiners fire 21 Replies latest jw friends

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  refiners fire

  ...."Truly, it has been a great privilege to walk and talk with my heavenly Father, Jehovah, for 69 years of dedicated life, 67 of which have been spent in full-time service. I have always found Jehovah to be a loving, compassionate God, forgiving human frailties and giving power and strength to those trusting in him. My hope is to maintain my integrity and loyalty to Jehovah and his organization to the finish, trusting in the promise that in due time I will be united with my dear Lord, Jesus Christ, and with many of my faithful brothers and sisters in heavenly glory.-Psalm 84:12".......

  Thats the old boy from the 1990 article. so Hes one of the 144,000.
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  TheOldHippie

  But he could we sort of joining together the two statements, could he not? Jesus had been present since since 1874, but they also believed 1914 would mean the end of the gentile times and the overthrow of Satan's rulership. So he had been present also from 1914, in order to bring forth the final judgment. That he "came" at the end of the 40 years that had begun in 1974.

  The set of beliefs referring to 1914 seems to be very open to differing views when it comes to what was believed between 1914 and the year his presence was stated as having begun in 1914.
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  refiners fire

  Old H:

  ..."But he could we sort of joining together the two statements, could he not? Jesus had been present since since 1874, but they also believed 1914 would mean the end of the gentile times and the overthrow of Satan's rulership.".....

  Well I dont think so H. Because he said it in 1990 and in 1990 they no longer believed that Jesus returned in 1874.

  I think the old boy was a victim of Big Brother. Hes come to believe that in 1920 the org was preaching that Christ returned in 1914. He believes that because hes FORGOTTEN what really happened.
• 

  refiners fire

  ANOTHER- WATCHTOWER. MAY 1. 1988. Article- "Jehovah does not forsake his servants"

  QUOTE....."At the back of our house in Tojo-cho, Osaka, there was a house with a sign: "Osaka Branch of the International Bible Students Association." Assuming it to be a Christian group, I visited the house.

  "Do you believe in the second advent of the Lord?" I asked the young man who came to the door.

  " Christ's second advent was realized in 1914 ," he answered.

  In astonishment, I told him that was impossible. "You should read this book," he said, handing me The Harp of God.".......

  A few lines later:

  QUOTE......"Eventually, my husband found out that I was reading a Christian book. However, when I took a firm stand for my faith, he began wondering whether something very important was involved and so read The Harp of God himself. I was baptized the following year, March 23, 1929,". ...
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  AlanF

  Ok RF, I took a look at my 1924 edition of Harp. In addition to the quotes given by other posters, the 3rd paragraph in the chapter "Our Lord's Return" states:

  In this chapter we hope to prove the fact of the Lord's return, how he will return, when, and for what purpose, and that he has already come.

  The first mention of 1874 that I can find is on page 230, paragraph 398, which states:

  [quote]... 1335 days after 539 C.C. brings us to A.D. 1874, at which time, according to Biblical chronology, the Lord's second presence is due.

  So it it appears that an old man's faulty memory, no doubt encouraged by years of Orwellian forgetfulness and especially by the writers of that 1993 Watchtower you quoted, has been used to propagate one of the Society's standard lies, namely, that the Society has always said that "the Lord's return" was to be future.

  In my tired state last night I thought that perhaps the 1925 date was being referred to. In 1924 that was certainly yet future, but that cannot apply, in view of the above direct statements which define the term "our Lord's return" as being the beginning of "Christ's presence" which the Society argued occurred in 1874. Thus a JW apologist cannot argue that perhaps the old man had in mind Christ's future "coming at Armageddon".

  AlanF
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  refiners fire

  Alan.

  Yes there were lots of very pertinent Quotes written by Russell on The maintenance of infallibility. Usually condemning Papacy, and her tendancy to try and maintain the appearance of never having shifted position on any doctrine. Current doctrine is what has ALWAYS been believed. Thats the key principle. I suppose their compulsion to conceal any shifting goes back to their inner awareness that they do claim to speak for God, and that God shouldnt need to flop about like a wet fish, 'tacking' when the wind of reality changes. Of course, none of this would be necessary if only they wouldnt make absolutist statements about things they actually know nothing about.

  Many thanks.
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  Mulan

  Another thing no one has picked up on, is the date he gave for being in bed with the Spanish flu. He said it was 1920. It was pretty much gone by 1919. I had a great uncle (actualy the husband of my great aunt................not one person in our direct family got it) who died within hours of contracting that flu. October 1918.

  Here is a quote I found: " The influenza pandemic of 1918-1919 killed more people than the Great War, known today as World War I (WWI), at somewhere between 20 and 40 million people. By the end of 1919, no new cases were reported."

  Edited by - mulan on 13 January 2003 15:53:24
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  Scully

  Refiners

  I had to laugh when I saw your reference to TheHarpofGod.

  It made me think of this Harpo:

  

  Love, Scully
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  Stephanus

  Mulan, I must admit I had a question mark in my own mind about the date of the outbreak of the Spanish flu. If he got that date wrong, how many others he that refers to could be wrong, or wrongly remembered? However, it is possible that he was in bed with some other flu strain in 1920, and people thinking the worst, or having the recent epidemic impressed on their minds, were calling it "Spanish flu".
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  refiners fire

  Scully, thank you for lightening my mood. however, Harpo Marx and Groucho Marx aside, it still remains... ( not adressed at scully ) that Recent Watchtowers have published that the "Harp of God" ,1924 version, even 1921 version, says that Christ returned in 1914. Those version of the book never said that.

  ( refiner- obsessed with 'versions' class )

  (refiner- takes it all too seriously class ) etc.....