by UnDisfellowshipped 23 Replies latest jw friends
Joy2bfree...I edited my reply to you above. If you read it before I edited I am sorry if it offended you. I know your just trying to help us newer ones on the board to be clear as to where information comes from. Thanks again!!
CC
PS: Thanks UD for posting this information. I know it must have took a while to do it. It is very thorough.
Quote from Awake! July 22nd 1996 Issue:
The Historical Development of Freedom of Speech
Freedom-loving people are hard-pressed to understand why some governments and religions would withhold this freedom from their people. It is denial of a basic human right, and many people throughout the world suffer under suppression of this freedom.
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Quotes from The Watchtower March 1st 1966 Issue, Page 132:
Should Falsehood and Corruption Be Exposed?
Therefore, how will you respond when pointed statements are made about false religious teachings and corrupt practices?
Will you immediately condemn the person or organization making the expose'?
Do you feel it is all right to teach lies and misrepresent God's Word, but wrong to expose the error?
Contrary to what some may think, it is not unkind and unloving to lay bare falsehood and corruption.
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Quotes from The Watchtower February 15th 2000 Issue, Pages 26-29:
Cyril Lucaris (born 1572, died 1638) was elected Patriarch of Alexandria in 1602 then as the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople in 1620 -- second in importance to the Roman Catholic Pope in the then Christian world. He sought to make major reforms within the eastern Orthodox Church including a translation of the Bible in the common Greek language of the day so that everyone could read it. Some changes he wanted to make included stomping out the worship of Icons, the Apochryphal books, and the high authority in which the Church Father's writings were viewed and held on par with the Scriptures.
He saw corruption and hate and ignorance and wanted it stopped by reform and education and presenting this information to the people rather than keeping such information suppressed and forbidden. He was determined to "right" the "wrongs" of his church and point a finger at those wrongs. (Ephesians 5:11)
However, not everyone was happy with the changes and improvements he wanted to make to his church -- particularly the church leaders themselves. They especially didn't like the "finger pointing." He was going to "rock the boat" and they would have none of it lest they loose their positions of comfort, security, and authority. (John 11:48) Several conspiracies villified him in the eyes of the people and the authorities in order to have him banished (Disfellowshipped). Eventually he was murdered.
"Once again, the ruling ecclesiastical class suppressed efforts to make God's Word available to their flock. They violently silenced a voice that pointed to some of the errors of their non-Biblical beliefs. They proved to be the worst enemies of religious freedom and truth."
"Sadly, this is a stance that in various ways survives even to our day. It is a sobering reminder of what happens when clergy-instigated intrigues stand in the way of freedom of thought and expression."
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Quotes from The Watchtower June 1st 1982 Issue, Page 20:
At times, some bring to the attention of the "slave" class various doctrinal or organizational matters that they feel ought to be revised. Certainly, suggestions for improvement are proper, as are inquiries for clarification.
An example of this was when Paul, Barnabas and others were sent "to go up to the apostles and older men in Jerusalem" regarding circumcision. When those elders at Jerusalem decided the matter, under the direction of holy spirit, they then sent brothers to various cities to "deliver to those there for observance the decrees that had been decided upon by the apostles and older men who were in Jerusalem." Loyal submission to those decrees brought Jehovahs blessing. Thus, "the congregations continued to be made firm in the faith and to increase in number from day to day."Acts 15:116:5.
The proper spirit after offering suggestions is to be content to leave the matter to the prayerful consideration of the mature brothers directing the work in Jehovahs organization. But if those making the suggestions are not content with that and continue to dispute the subject in the congregations with a view to getting others to support them, what then? That would create divisions, and could subvert the faith of some. So Paul counsels: "Keep your eye on those who cause divisions and occasions for stumbling contrary to the teaching that you have learned, and avoid them." Paul also counseled Titus to "reprove those who contradict," adding: "It is necessary to shut the mouths of these, as these very men keep on subverting entire households by teaching things they ought not . . . For this very cause keep on reproving them with severity."Romans 16:17, 18; Titus 1:9-13.
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Quotes from The Watchtower January 1st 1997 Issue:
JEHOVAH is a holy God. In ancient times he was "the Holy One of Israel," and as such he demanded that Israel be clean, unsullied. (Psalm 89:18) He told his chosen people: "You must prove yourselves holy, because I am holy." (Leviticus 11:45) Anyone who wanted to "ascend into the mountain of Jehovah" had to be "innocent in his hands and clean in heart." (Psalm 24:3, 4) That meant more than merely avoiding sinful acts. It meant "the hating of bad."Proverbs 8:13.
Lovingly, Jehovah laid down detailed laws so that the nation of Israel could identify and avoid wrongdoing. (Romans 7:7, 12) These laws included strict guidelines on morality. Adultery, homosexual acts, incestuous relationships, and bestiality were all identified as unholy spiritual pollutants. (Leviticus 18:23; 20:10-17) Those guilty of such degraded acts were cut off from the nation of Israel.
When the congregation of anointed Christians became "the Israel of God," similar moral standards were laid down for them. (Galatians 6:16) Christians too were to "abhor what is wicked." (Romans 12:9) Jehovah's words to Israel also applied to them: "You must be holy, because I am holy." (1 Peter 1:15, 16) Such unholy practices as fornication, adultery, homosexual acts, bestiality, and incest were not to corrupt the Christian congregation. Those refusing to stop engaging in such things would be excluded from God's Kingdom. (Romans 1:26, 27; 2:22; 1 Corinthians 6:9, 10; Hebrews 13:4) In these "last days," the same standards apply to the "other sheep." (2 Timothy 3:1; John 10:16) As a result, anointed Christians and other sheep make up a clean and wholesome people, able to carry the name of their God as Jehovah's Witnesses.Isaiah 43:10.
Keeping the Congregation Clean
In contrast, the world condones all kinds of immorality. Although true Christians are different, they should not forget that many who now serve Jehovah were once in the world. There are many who, before they knew our holy God, saw no reason not to indulge the desires and fantasies of their fallen flesh, wallowing in a "low sink of debauchery." (1 Peter 4:4) The apostle Paul, after describing the disgusting practices of degraded people of the nations, said: "That is what some of you were." Still, he went on to say: "But you have been washed clean, but you have been sanctified, but you have been declared righteous in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ and with the spirit of our God."1 Corinthians 6:11.
What a comforting statement that is! Whatever a person did earlier in life, he changes when the glorious good news about the Christ has an effect on his heart. He exercises faith and dedicates himself to Jehovah God. From then on he lives a morally pure life, washed clean in God's eyes. (Hebrews 9:14) The sins that he committed previously are pardoned, and he can 'stretch forward to the things ahead.' (See "Questions From Readers" in the May 1, 1996, issue of The Watchtower.) Philippians 3:13, 14; Romans 4:7, 8.
Jehovah forgave repentant David for murder and adultery, and He forgave repentant Manasseh for immoral idolatry and much bloodshed. (2 Samuel 12:9, 13; 2 Chronicles 33:2-6, 10-13) We can be truly grateful that he is prepared to forgive us too if we repent and approach him in sincerity and humility. Still, despite Jehovah's forgiving David and Manasseh, these two menand Israel with themhad to live with the consequences of their sinful acts. (2 Samuel 12:11, 12; Jeremiah 15:3-5) In a similar way, while Jehovah forgives repentant sinners, there may be consequences of their actions that cannot be avoided.
Inevitable Consequences
While Jehovah forgives repentant sinners, there may be consequences of their actions that cannot be avoided
For example, a man who lives a life of immoral debauchery and contracts AIDS may accept the truth and turn his life around to the point of dedication and baptism. Now he is a spiritually clean Christian having a relationship with God and a wonderful hope for the future; but he still has AIDS. He may eventually die of the disease, a sad but inescapable consequence of his former conduct. For some Christians the effects of former gross immorality may persist in other ways. For years after their baptism, perhaps for the rest of their lives in this system of things, they may have to fight urges in their flesh to return to their previous immoral life-style. With the help of Jehovah's spirit, many succeed in resisting. But they have to wage a constant battle.Galatians 5:16, 17.
Such ones do not sin as long as they control their urges. But if they are men, they may wisely decide not to 'reach out' for responsibility in the congregation while still having to struggle with powerful fleshly impulses. (1 Timothy 3:1) Why? Because they know the trust that the congregation puts in the elders. (Isaiah 32:1, 2; Hebrews 13:17) They realize that the elders are consulted on many intimate matters and have to handle sensitive situations. It would be neither loving, wise, nor reasonable for one waging a constant fight with unclean fleshly desires to reach out for such a responsible position.Proverbs 14:16; John 15:12, 13; Romans 12:1.
For a man who was a child molester before he was baptized, there may be another consequence. When he learns the truth, he repents and turns around, not bringing that cruel sin into the congregation. He may thereafter make fine progress, completely overcome his wrong impulses, and even be inclined to 'reach out' for a responsible position in the congregation. What, though, if he still has to live down notoriety in the community as a former child molester? Would he "be irreprehensible, . . . have a fine testimony from people on the outside, ... [be] free from accusation"? (1 Timothy 3:1-7, 10; Titus 1:7) No, he would not. Hence, he would not qualify for congregation privileges.
When a Dedicated Christian Sins
Jehovah understands that we are weak and that even after baptism we may fall into sin. The apostle John wrote to Christians of his day: "I am writing you these things that you may not commit a sin. And yet, if anyone does commit a sin, we have a helper with the Father, Jesus Christ, a righteous one. And he is a propitiatory sacrifice for our sins, yet not for ours only but also for the whole world's." (1 John 2:1, 2) Yes, on the basis of Jesus' sacrifice, Jehovah will forgive baptized Christians who fall into sinif they truly repent and abandon their wrong course.
An example of this was seen in the first-century congregation at Corinth. The apostle Paul heard of a case of incestuous fornication in that young congregation, and he gave instructions that the man involved be disfellowshipped. Later, the sinner repented, and Paul exhorted the congregation to reinstate him. (1 Corinthians 5:1, 13; 2 Corinthians 2:5-9) Thus, by the healing power of Jehovah's loving kindness and the great value of Jesus' ransom sacrifice, the man was cleansed of his sin. Similar things may happen today. Again, though, even if a baptized person who commits a serious sin repents and is forgiven in Jehovah's eyes, there may still be ongoing consequences of his sin.Proverbs 10:16, 17; Galatians 6:7.
For example, if a dedicated girl commits fornication, she may bitterly regret her act and eventually be restored to spiritual health with the help of the congregation. But what if she is pregnant because of her immorality? Then her whole life has been inescapably changed by what she did. A man who commits adultery may repent and not be disfellowshipped. But his innocent mate has Scriptural grounds to divorce him, and she may choose to do so. (Matthew 19:9) If she does, the man, although forgiven by Jehovah, will live the rest of his life with this grave consequence of his sin.1 John 1:9.
What of a man who unlovingly divorces his wife in order to marry another woman? Perhaps he will eventually repent and be reinstated in the congregation. Over the years he may make progress and "press on to maturity." (Hebrews 6:1) But as long as his first wife lives without a mate, he will not qualify to serve in a responsible position in the congregation. He is not "a husband of one wife" because he had no Scriptural right to divorce his first wife.1 Timothy 3:2, 12.
Are these not powerful reasons why a Christian should cultivate an abhorrence of what is wicked?
What of a Child Molester?
What if a baptized adult Christian sexually molests a child? Is the sinner so wicked that Jehovah will never forgive him? Not necessarily so. Jesus said that 'blasphemy against the holy spirit' was unforgivable. And Paul said that there is no sacrifice for sins left for one who practices sin willfully despite knowing the truth. (Luke 12:10; Hebrews 10:26, 27) But nowhere does the Bible say that an adult Christian who sexually abuses a childwhether incestuously or otherwisecannot be forgiven. Indeed, his sins can be washed clean if he repents sincerely from the heart and turns his conduct around. However, he may still have to struggle with the wrong fleshly impulses he cultivated. (Ephesians 1:7) And there may be consequences that he cannot avoid.
Depending on the law of the land where he lives, the molester may well have to serve a prison term or face other sanctions from the State. The congregation will not protect him from this. Moreover, the man has revealed a serious weakness that henceforth will have to be taken into account. If he seems to be repentant, he will be encouraged to make spiritual progress, share in the field service, even have parts in the Theocratic Ministry School and nonteaching parts in the Service Meeting. This does not mean, though, that he will qualify to serve in a position of responsibility in the congregation. What are the Scriptural reasons for this?
For one thing, an elder must be "self-controlled." (Titus 1:8) True, none of us have perfect self-control. (Romans 7:21-25) But a dedicated adult Christian who falls into the sin of child sexual abuse reveals an unnatural fleshly weakness. Experience has shown that such an adult may well molest other children. True, not every child molester repeats the sin, but many do. And the congregation cannot read hearts to tell who is and who is not liable to molest children again. (Jeremiah 17:9) Hence, Paul's counsel to Timothy applies with special force in the case of baptized adults who have molested children: "Never lay your hands hastily upon any man; neither be a sharer in the sins of others." (1 Timothy 5:22) For the protection of our children, a man known to have been a child molester does not qualify for a responsible position in the congregation. Moreover, he cannot be a pioneer or serve in any other special, full-time service.Compare the principle at Exodus 21:28, 29.
Some may ask, 'Have not some committed other types of sin and apparently repented, only to repeat their sin later?' Yes, that has happened, but there are other factors to consider. If, for example, an individual makes immoral advances to another adult, the adult should be able to resist his or her advances. Children are much easier to deceive, confuse, or terrorize. The Bible speaks of a child's lack of wisdom. (Proverbs 22:15; 1 Corinthians 13:11) Jesus used children as an example of humble innocence. (Matthew 18:4; Luke 18:16, 17) The innocence of a child includes a complete lack of experience. Most children are open, eager to please, and thus vulnerable to abuse by a scheming adult whom they know and trust. Therefore, the congregation has a responsibility before Jehovah to protect its children.
Well-trained children learn to obey and honor their parents, the elders, and other adults. (Ephesians 6:1, 2; 1 Timothy 5:1, 2; Hebrews 13:7) It would be a shocking perversion if one of these authority figures were to misuse that child's innocent trust so as to seduce or force him or her to submit to sexual acts. Those who have been sexually molested in this way often struggle for years to overcome the resulting emotional trauma. Hence, a child molester is subject to severe congregational discipline and restrictions. It is not his status as an authority figure that should be of concern but, rather, the unblemished purity of the congregation.1 Corinthians 5:6; 2 Peter 3:14.
If a child molester sincerely repents, he will recognize the wisdom of applying Bible principles. If he truly learns to abhor what is wicked, he will despise what he did and struggle to avoid repeating his sin. (Proverbs 8:13; Romans 12:9) Further, he will surely thank Jehovah for the greatness of His love, as a result of which a repentant sinner, such as he is, can still worship our holy God and hope to be among "the upright" who will reside on earth forever.Proverbs 2:21.
Edited by - UnDisfellowshipped on 1 September 2002 3:42:22
Edited by - UnDisfellowshipped on 1 September 2002 3:43:19
CC,
: I'll be more clearer in the future.=:-)>
Like maybe mentioning the YEAR, too? I've quoted it many times, but don't have the exact year handy. It was early 1950's, about 1951 or 1952.
Joy,
I'll get the exact year for you if you want.
Farkel
'...we are forbidden to kill them EVEN THO they be members of our flesh and blood family...'!?
I now have visions of Big Bird speaking 'educationally' to a group of JWs...
'Now, here are the people and here is the P-R-O-P-E-R-T-Y.
Are they the same? N-o-o-o-o. They are not the same.
They are D-I-F-F-E-R-E-N-T.
Can you say, 'different' boys and girls?
Different.'
Here are some more Scriptures showing how TRUE FOLLOWERS OF CHRIST are supposed to treat their ENEMIES:
Romans 12:17: Repay no one evil for evil. Respect what is honorable in the sight of all men.
Romans 12:18: If it is possible, as much as it is up to you, be at peace with all men.
Romans 12:19: Don't seek revenge yourselves, beloved, but give place to God's wrath. For it is written, "Vengeance belongs to me; I will repay, says the Lord."
Romans 12:20: Therefore "If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him a drink. For in doing so, you will heap coals of fire on his head."
Romans 12:21: Don't be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.
1st Thessalonians 5:15: See that no one returns evil for evil to anyone, but always follow after that which is good, for one another, and for all.
1st Peter 3:9: not rendering evil for evil, or reviling for reviling; but instead blessing; knowing that to this were you called, that you may inherit a blessing.
Galatians 6:10: So then, as we have opportunity, let's do what is good toward all men, and especially toward those who are of the household of the Faith.
Here are QUOTES about ELDERS JUDICIAL HEARINGS (from http://quotes.jehovahswitnesses.com ):
*** Insight on the Scriptures Book Volume 1, Page 475 ***
"City"
On entering the gates, one found himself in a large open place, the citys marketplace, the public square, where all kinds of selling and buying were carried on, and where contracts were made and sealed before witnesses. (Ge 23:10-18; 2Ki 7:1; Na 2:4) Here was the public forum where news was received and passed on (Ne 8:1, 3; Jer 17:19), where the elders held court (Ru 4:1-10), and where the traveler might spend the night if perchance private hospitality was not extended to him.
*** Insight on the Scriptures Book Volume 1, Page 198 ***
"Assembly"
At times, the people of Israel were represented in gatherings by chieftains of the assembly (Ex 16:22; Nu 4:34; 31:13; 32:2; Jos 9:15, 18; 22:30), or older men. (Ex 12:21; 17:5; 24:1) When judicial matters required attention, a number of persons might assemble at the city gate. However, whether gathered there or elsewhere, they would not all vote on the case under consideration in a democratic fashion. Instead, theocratically, respected older men would weigh matters in the light of Gods law and then announce their decision. (De 16:18; 17:8-13) Similarly, the early Christian congregation was represented in such matters by those placed in positions of responsibility by the holy spirit. (Ac 20:28) In Israel, if the wrongdoing required the death sentence, the whole assembly might execute it.Le 24:14; Nu 15:32-36; De 21:18-21.
*** The Watchtower December 1st 1976 Issue, Page 732 ***
Giving Reproof "Before All Onlookers"
The Bible regulations and accounts indicate that cases of wrongdoing came before the city elders at the gates primarily when controversies were involved, as in cases where an offender would not acknowledge having wronged another, and also when the community as a whole was seriously affected or endangered by the wrongdoing.
*** The Watchtower November 15th 1995 Issue, Page 13 ***
Cities of Refuge - God's Merciful Provision
Though you were received hospitably, you would have to state your case to the elders at the gate of the refuge city. After entering the city, you would be sent back to stand trial before the elders representing the congregation of Israel at the gates of the city having jurisdiction over the area where the killing occurred. There you would have an opportunity to prove your innocence.
*** The Watchtower March 15th 1980 Issue, Page 30 ***
Why Look to Jehovah in All You Undertake?
Since the city elders judged in the open area near the gates, it would be there that the sons would speak with opponents in a legal case, successfully putting to silence baseless accusations and false testimony.
*** New World Translation Reference Bible ***
John 3:19-21:
19: Now this is the basis for judgment, that the light has come into the world but men have loved the darkness rather than the light, for their works were wicked. 20: For he that practices vile things hates the light and does not come to the light, in order that his works may not be reproved. 21: But he that does what is true comes to the light, in order that his works may be made manifest as having been worked in harmony with God.
*** Pay Attention to Yourselves and to All the Flock (Secret Elders' Rule Book) Unit 5(b) Page 110 ***
If the accused wishes to bring witnesses who can speak in his defense regarding the matter, he may do so.
However, observers are not permitted.
No tape-recording devices are allowed.
Here's another WEIRD QUOTE:
*** Watchtower January 1st 1972 Issue, Pages 31-32 ***
Questions from Readers
Do homosexual acts on the part of a married person constitute a Scriptural ground for divorce, freeing the innocent mate to remarry?-U.S.A.
Homosexuality is definitely condemned in the Bible as something that will prevent individuals from gaining God's approval. (1 Cor. 6:9, 10) However, whether an innocent mate would Scripturally be able to remarry after procuring a legal divorce from a mate guilty of homosexual acts must be determined on the basis of what the Bible says respecting divorce and remarriage...
...While both homosexuality and bestiality are disgusting perversions, in the case of neither one is the marriage tie broken. It is broken only by acts that make an individual "one flesh" with a person of the opposite sex other than his or her legal marriage mate.
Edited by - UnDisfellowshipped on 1 September 2002 3:56:52
Quote from The Watchtower January 1st 1986 Issue, Page 14:
"Shocking as it is, even some who have been PROMINENT in Jehovah's organization have succumbed to immoral practices, including homosexuality, wife swapping, and CHILD MOLESTING. It is to be noted, also, that during the past year, 36,638 individuals had to be disfellowshipped from the Christian congregation, the greater number of them for practicing immorality. Jehovah's organization must be kept clean!... This is a time for congregation elders, ministerial servants, and indeed all our brothers and sisters to avoid any circumstances that could lead to immorality."
Here are MORE Quotes from The Watchtower September 15th 1981 Issue (You can see the other Quotes at the top of this Web Page):
AFTER Adam had been alone for some time, God said: It is not good for the man to continue by himself. Then He created Eve and instituted human marriage. (Gen. 2:18, 21, 22) Thereafter, earth's population was to grow. So each person would come to have many relatives. Even if some family members, such as children, did not live nearby, they could be visited and pleasant times shared. (Gen. 1:28; Job 1:1-5) God had purposed that families should be united in true worship, so religious beliefs would not create any divisions. But incidents occurred in which religion became a family issue. One of these was when Korah, Dathan and Abiram rebelled. Jehovah confirmed that he was dealing through Moses and Aaron, not through these religious rebels. Then Moses told the people to get away from the rebels tents. What would the children and households of Korah, Dathan and Abiram do? Would they put loyalty to family ahead of loyalty to Jehovah and his congregation? Most of those closely related to the rebels put family before God. Jehovah executed these relatives along with the rebels. (Num. 16:16-33) However, some of Korah s sons remained loyal to God and His people. They were not executed along with the rest of Korah s household and the families of Dathan and Abiram. (Num. 26:9-11) In fact, descendants of these surviving Korahites were later blessed with special service at the temple and mentioned with honor in the Bible. Chron. 20:14-19; Ps. 42, 44-49, 84, 85, 87.
A similar decision between loyalty to family and loyalty to God was faced when an Israelite became an apostate. Would his family, moved by human emotion or blood ties, try to shield him from being cut off? Or would even his brother, son or daughter realize that loyalty to God and the congregation was the right and wise course? (See Deuteronomy 13:6-11.)
In the Christian arrangement today a sinner is not cut off by execution, but Christians may face tests because of a relative s being disciplined.
RELATIVES MAY CAUSE PROBLEMS
Family connections and affection can be very strong. This is natural and is in accord with God s arrangement. (John 16:21) But these strong ties can also bring a difficult test on Christians. Jesus explained that one effect of a person s becoming a Christian would be that relatives might oppose. Jesus said: I came to put, not peace, but a sword. For I came to cause division, with a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a young wife against her mother-in-law. Indeed, a man s enemies will be persons of his own household. He that has greater affection for father or mother than for me is not worthy of me. Matt. 10:34-38.
Christians do not want such enmity to exist. And there is no reason why relatives should oppose or hate them for having become clean, moral, honest servants of God.
Yet true Christians realize that they cannot put family before God.
In the long run, what is in everyone s best interest is for Christians to continue faithful to God. In time they may be able to influence their relatives to walk on the way leading to salvation. Rom. 9:1-3; 1 Cor. 7:12-16. Relatives may also cause problems for true Christians in another way. This may develop when a relative is disfellowshiped. As discussed in the preceding articles, if a person in the congregation unrepentantly practices gross sin, God requires that he be disfellowshiped. (1 Cor. 5:11-13)
The conduct of the wrongdoer has changed his relationship with Jehovah and therefore with family members who are Jehovah's Witnesses.
Nor does the fault rest with the faithful Christian relatives. It is the disfellowshiped person who has made problems for himself and for his relatives, as did Korah, Dathan and Abiram.
We need to examine two distinct situations. The first is where a Christian lives in the same household with a disfellowshiped or disassociated family member. The second is where such a relative is not in the immediate family circle.
IN THE IMMEDIATE FAMILY CIRCLE
A person might become a Christian without others in that one's family circle accepting the faith. For instance, a wife might be serving Jehovah, but her husband not.
Despite that, she is still one flesh with her husband and is obliged to love and respect him. (Gen. 2:24; 1 Pet. 3:1-6) Or she might be married to a man who was a dedicated Christian but was later expelled from the congregation. Yet that would not end their marital ties ; only death or a Scriptural divorce would do that. 1 Cor. 7:39; Matt. 19:9. Similarly, if a relative, such as a parent, son or daughter, is disfellowshiped or has disassociated himself, blood and family ties remain. Does that mean, then, that in the family circle everything remains the same when one member is disfellowshiped? Definitely not. A disfellowshiped person has been spiritually cut off from the congregation; the former spiritual ties have been completely severed. This is true even with respect to his relatives, including those within his immediate family circle. Thus, family members while acknowledging family ties will no longer have any spiritual fellowship with him. 1 Sam. 28:6; Prov. 15:8, 9.
That will mean changes in the spiritual fellowship that may have existed in the home. For example, if the husband is disfellowshiped, his wife and children will not be comfortable with him conducting a family Bible study or leading in Bible reading and prayer. If he wants to say a prayer, such as at mealtime, he has a right to do so in his own home. But they can silently offer their own prayers to God. (Prov. 28:9;Ps. 119:145, 146 )
What if a disfellowshiped person in the home wants to be present when the family reads the Bible together or has a Bible study? The others might let him be present to listen if he will not try to teach them or share his religious ideas.
If a minor child is disfellowshiped, the parents will still care for his physical needs and provide moral training and discipline. They would not conduct a Bible study directly with the child, with him participating. Yet this does not mean that he would not be required to sit in on the family study. And they might direct attention to parts of the Bible or Christian publications that contain counsel he needs. (Prov. 1:8-19; 6:20-22; 29:17; Eph. 6:4)
They can have him accompany them to and sit with them at Christian meetings, hoping that he will take to heart Biblical counsel. But what if a close relative, such as a son or a parent who does not live in the home, is disfellowshiped and subsequently wants to move back there? The family could decide what to do depending on the situation. For example, a disfellowshiped parent may be sick or no longer able to care for himself financially or physically. The Christian children have a Scriptural and moral obligation to assist. (1 Tim. 5:8) Perhaps it seems necessary to bring the parent into the home, temporarily or permanently. Or it may appear advisable to arrange for care where there is medical personnel but where the parent would have to be visited. What is done may depend on factors such as the parent s true needs, his attitude and the regard the head of the household has for the spiritual welfare of the household. This could be true also with regard to a child who had left home but is now disfellowshiped or disassociated. Sometimes Christian parents have accepted back into the home for a time a disfellowshiped child who has become physically or emotionally ill. But in each case the parents can weigh the individual circumstances. Has a disfellowshiped son lived on his own, and is he now unable to do so? Or does he want to move back primarily because it would be an easier life? What about his morals and attitude? Will he bring leaven into the home? Gal. 5:9.
In Jesus parable of the prodigal son, the father ran to meet and then accepted his returning son. The father, seeing the lad s pitiful condition, responded with natural parental concern. We can note, though, that the son did not bring home harlots or come with a disposition to continue his sinful life in his father s home. No, he expressed heartfelt repentance and evidently was determined to return to living a clean life. Luke 15:11-32.
DISFELLOWSHIPED RELATIVES NOT LIVING AT HOME
18. The second situation that we need to consider is that involving a disfellowshiped or disassociated relative who is not in the immediate family circle or living at one s home. Such a person is still related by blood or marriage, and so there may be some limited need to care for necessary family matters. Nonetheless, it is not as if he were living in the same home where contact and conversation could not be avoided. We should keep clearly in mind the Bible s inspired direction: Quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person... , not even eating with such a man. 1 Cor. 5:11.
Consequently, Christians related to such a disfellowshiped person living outside the home should strive to avoid needless association, even keeping business dealings to a minimum. The reasonableness of this course becomes apparent from reports of what has occurred where relatives have taken the mistaken view,
Though he is disfellowshiped, we are related and so can treat him the same as before. From one area comes this: One person who was disfellowshiped was related to about one third of the congregation. All of his relations continued to associate with him. And a highly respected Christian elder writes: In our area some disfellowshiped ones with large families have been met, as they enter the lobby of the Kingdom Hall, with a fanfare of backslapping and handshaking (even though the disfellowshiped one was known by them to be still living immorally). I feel a deep concern that those who have been disfellowshiped need to see that their course is hated by Jehovah and by his people and that they should feel a real need to become genuinely repentant. What will help these disfellowshiped ones to change when they are continually greeted by all in their large families who know of their practices? There must have been congregations in the first century where many were related. But when someone was disfellowshiped, were all the relatives to carry on as normal as long as they did not discuss Scriptural matters with the disfellowshiped person? No. Otherwise the congregation would not really be applying the command: Remove the wicked man from among yourselves. 1 Cor. 5:13.
Great care needs to be exercised that a person s situation as a disfellowshiped sinner is neither overlooked nor minimized. As the sons of Korah well demonstrated, our chief loyalty must be to Jehovah and his theocratic arrangement. We can be sure that when we uphold his standards and prefer association with his organized people, rather than with wrongdoers, we will have his protection and blessing. Ps. 84:10-12.
Normally, relatives are often together at meals, picnics, family reunions or other social gatherings. But when someone has unrepentantly pursued sin and has had to be disfellowshiped, he may cause difficulties for his Christian relatives in regard to such gatherings. While they realize that they are still related to him, they do not want to ignore Paul's advice that faithful Christians should quit mixing in company with an expelled sinner. There is no point in looking for some rule as to family members being at gatherings where a disfellowshiped relative might be present. This would be something for those concerned to resolve, in keeping with Paul s counsel. (1 Cor. 5:11) And yet it should be appreciated that if a disfellowshiped person is going to be at a gathering to which nonrelative Witnesses are invited, that may well affect what others do. For example, a Christian couple might be getting married at a Kingdom Hall. If a disfellowshiped relative comes to the Kingdom Hall for the wedding, obviously he could not be in the bridal party there or give away the bride. What, though, if there is a wedding feast or reception? This can be a happy social occasion, as it was in Cana when Jesus attended. (John 2:1, 2) But will the disfellowshiped relative be allowed to come or even be invited? If he was going to attend, many Christians, relatives or not, might conclude that they should not be there, to eat and associate with him, in view of Paul's directions at 1 Corinthians 5:11.
Thus, sometimes Christians may not feel able to have a disfellowshiped or disassociated relative present for a gathering that normally would include family members. Still, the Christians can enjoy the association of the loyal members of the congregation, having in mind Jesus words: Whoever does the will of God, this one is my brother and sister and mother. Mark 3:35.
The fact is that when a Christian gives himself over to sin and has to be disfellowshiped, he forfeits much: his approved standing with God; membership in the happy congregation of Christians; sweet fellowship with the brothers, including much of the association he had with Christian relatives. (1 Pet. 2:17) The pain he has caused may even survive him. Should he die while disfellowshiped, arrangements for his funeral may be a problem. His Christian relatives may like to have had a talk at the Kingdom Hall, if that is the local custom. But that would not be fitting for a person expelled from the congregation. If he had been giving evidence of repentance and wanting God's forgiveness, such as by ceasing to practice sin and by attending Christian meetings, some brother s conscience might allow him to give a Bible talk at the funeral home or grave site. Such Biblical comments about the condition of the dead provide a witness to unbelievers or comfort to the relatives. However, if the disfellowshiped person had still been advocating false teachings or ungodly conduct, even such a talk would not be appropriate. 2 John 9-11.
LESSONS FOR ALL OF US
All of us need to appreciate that it is Jehovah's judgment that counts. (Prov. 29:26)
That is true as to hateful practices, for the Bible shows that these are things that God detests. (Prov. 6:16-19) But it is also true as to his judgment of individuals. Jehovah's Word plainly says that unrighteous persons, those carrying on the works of the flesh, will not inherit his kingdom. (1 Cor. 6:9, 10; Gal. 5:19-21) Such persons have no place in heaven, nor will they fit in the earthly realm of the Kingdom. Accordingly, anyone who wants to remain in the clean congregation of God today must meet His standards. God simply will not permit leaven to remain as a corrupting influence among his holy people. 1 Cor. 5:6-13.
Naturally, if a close relative is disfellowshiped, human emotions can pose a major test for us. Sentiment and family ties are particularly strong between parents and their children, and they are also powerful when a marriage mate is disfellowshiped.
Still, we must recognize that, in the final analysis, we will not benefit anyone or please God if we allow emotion to lead us into ignoring His wise counsel and guidance. We need to display our complete confidence in the perfect righteousness of God's ways, including his provision to disfellowship unrepentant wrongdoers. If we remain loyal to God and to the congregation, the wrongdoer may in time take a lesson from that, repent and be reinstated in the congregation. Yet, whether that occurs or not, we can draw comfort and strength from what David said late in life: All [God's] judicial decisions are in front of me; . . . And let Jehovah repay me according to my righteousness, according to my cleanness in front of his eyes. With someone loyal you will act in loyalty; with the faultless, mighty one you will deal faultlessly; with the one keeping clean you will show yourself clean... And the humble people you will save. 2 Sam. 22:23-28.
Quote from The Watchtower June 15th 1997 Issue, Pages 21-22:
"A family cannot be completely happy if even one of its members lacks natural affection or is disloyal. How peaceful can family life be if someone in the household is fierce and not open to any agreement? Worse still, how can there be peace and happiness when family members are lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God? These are the traits of people in this world ruled by Satan. No wonder family happiness is elusive in these last days!"
Quote from Awake! March 8th 1988 Issue, Page 19:
"I have discovered that there is only one religious organization on earth capable of clearly defining the boundaries of relative freedom. What particularly convinced me during my study with Jehovah's Witnesses is that this organization has the strength to require of its members that they stay within these boundaries."
Quote from Reasoning From The Scriptures Book, (1985 and 1989 Editions), Pages 328 and 329:
"How can a person know which religion is right?... (5) Do its members truly love one another? Jesus said: "By this all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love among yourselves." (John 13:35) Such love reaches across racial, social, and national boundaries, drawing people together in genuine brotherhood. So strong is this love that it sets them apart as being truly different. When the nations go to war, who have enough love for their Christian brothers in other lands that they refuse to take up arms and kill them? That is what early Christians did."
Quote from The Watchtower March 15th 1996 Issue, Page 16:
"Loyalty to Jehovah's Organization....We now come to the matter of being loyal to Jehovah's visible organization. Certainly, we owe loyalty to it, including "the faithful and discreet slave," through which the Christian congregation is fed spiritually."
Pages 17-18:
"Loyalty to Loyal Elders....When something is said or done in the congregation that we have difficulty understanding, loyalty will keep us from judging motives and will help us to take the position that perhaps it is a matter of judgment. Is it not far better to dwell on the good qualities of the appointed elders and other fellow believers rather than on their shortcomings? Yes, we want to guard against all such negative thinking, for it is related to being disloyal!"
Page 19:
"Loyalty to the congregation also calls on us to support all five weekly meetings to the extent of our circumstances and ability. Loyalty requires that we not only attend them regularly but also prepare for them and make upbuilding comments as opportunity affords."
Pages 19-20:
"Aids to Keeping Loyal...What will help us to meet the challenge of loyalty in these four areas: loyalty to Jehovah, to his organization, to the congregation, and to our marriage mate? One aid is appreciating that meeting the challenge of loyalty is bound up with the vindication of Jehovah's sovereignty....Strong faith in Jehovah God and fear of displeasing him will help us to meet the challenge of loyalty. We strengthen our faith in and fear of Jehovah by diligently studying God's Word and by engaging in the Christian ministry. This will help us to act in harmony [unity] with Paul's counsel recorded at Ephesians.."
Quote from The Watchtower October 1st 1967 Issue, Page 587:
"THE BIBLE IS AN ORGANIZATIONAL BOOK...The Bible itself is an organizational book...Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible. For this reason the Bible cannot be properly understood without Jehovah's visible organization in mind."
Quote from The Watchtower May 1st 1957 Issue, Pages 273-274:
"My son, keep your father's commandment, and forsake not your mother's teaching. For the commandment is a lamp and the teaching a light, and the reproofs of discipline are the way of life....If we are to walk in the light of truth we must recognize not only Jehovah God as our Father but his organization as our mother."
Quotes from Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry Book (1983 Edition):
"HANDING OTHER JUDICIAL MATTERS... Some wrongdoing may be brought to the attention of the overseers by individual brothers or sisters who report unresolved personal grievances... On the other hand, the elders may be approached by individuals who either confess their own sins or report [spy] what they know regarding the wrongdoing of others."
Quote from The Watchtower June 15th 1961 Issue, Page 371:
"It is a serious thing to disfellowship a person, because it means that the person is cut off from God's organization, from life. On the other hand, it is just as serious to fail to disfellowship when it should be done. Why? Because it manifests insubordination on the part of the servants, a failure to respond to the divine decisions recorded in the Bible. It permits further corruption of the organization, endangering the faith of the brothers and vitiating the work of the congregation."
Quote from The Watchtower October 15th 1964 Issue, Page 639:
"So today, if wickedness is practiced by anyone in the Christian congregation, the congregation's judicial committee has the responsibility to investigate and disfellowship, to clear away what is bad. But each one in the congregation should be just as zealous for the congregation's cleanness and good standing before Jehovah, even though the guilty one may be as close as a son or a daughter. Each one should be zealous to bear witness to what he knows in the case, not withholding information or evidence because of close ties of family or friendship."
Quote from Organization Book (1972 Edition), Page 172:
"In faithfulness to God, none in the congregation should greet such persons when meeting them in public nor should they welcome these into their homes."
Quote from The Watchtower December 1st 1972 Issue, Pages 734, 735, 736:
"Nevertheless, if future cases of gross unnatural conduct, such as the practice of oral or anal copulation, are brought to their attention, the elders should act to try to correct the situation before further harm results, as they would do with any other serious wrong. Their concern is, of course, to try to help those who go astray and are 'caught in the snare of the Devil.' ... But if persons willfully show disrespect for Jehovah God's marital arrangements, then it becomes necessary to remove them from the congregation as dangerous "leaven" that could contaminate others.."
Quote from The Watchtower March 15th 1983 Issue, Pages 30-31:
"Married Christians... How about sexual activity between married couples within the marriage bond? It is not for the elders to pry into the intimate lives of married Christians. However, the Bible certainly enters into their lives. Those who would "keep walking by spirit" should not ignore the Scriptural indications of God's thinking. And they will do well to cultivate a hatred for everything that is unclean before Jehovah, including what are clearly perverted sexual practices. Married couples should act in a way that will leave them with a clean conscience, as they give unimpeded attention to developing "the fruitage of the spirit... What, though, if one mate wants or even demands to share with his or her partner in what is clearly a perverted sex practice? The above-presented facts show that porneia involves unlawful sexual conduct outside the marital arrangement. Thus, a mate's enforcing perverted acts, such as oral or anal sex, within the marriage would not constitute a Scriptural basis for a divorce that would free either for remarriage. Even though a believing mate is distressed by the situation, yet that one's endeavor to hold to Scriptural principles will result in a blessing from Jehovah. In such cases it may be helpful for the couple to discuss the problem frankly, bearing in mind especially that sexual relations should be honorable, wholesome, an expression of tender love. This certainly should exclude anything that might distress or harm one's mate... As already stated, it is not for elders to "police" the private marital matters of couples in the congregation. However, if it becomes known that a member of the congregation is practicing or openly advocating perverted sex relations within the marriage bond, that one certainly would not be irreprehensible, and so would not be acceptable for special privileges, such as serving as an elder, a ministerial servant or a pioneer. Such practice and advocacy could even lead to expulsion from the congregation... Like porneia, these vices, when they become gross, can be grounds for disfellowshipping from the Christian congregation, but not for obtaining a Scriptural divorce. A person who brazenly advocates shocking and repulsive sexual activities would be guilty of loose conduct. Of course, a person with that attitude might even sink to committing porneia; then there would be a basis for a Scriptural divorce."
Check out this Thread for a Recording of the August Kingdom Ministry Disfellowshipping Talks at the Kingdom Hall (Recorded and Posted on the Internet by zev):
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=35808&page=1&site=3
I like the way they alienate the disfellowshipped person by quoting 'offenses' with a stigma, adultery, drunkeness and so on:
THOSE WHO SIMPLY LEAVE THE FAITH ARE NOT SHUNNED. If, however, someone unrepentantly practices serious sins, such as drunkenness, stealing, or adultery, he will be disfellowshipped and such an individual is avoided by former fellow-worshipers. Every effort is made to help wrongdoers. But if they are unrepentant, the congregation needs to be protected from their influence. The Bible clearly directs: "Remove the wicked man from among yourselves."
How would the public at large feel if this read:
THOSE WHO SIMPLY LEAVE THE FAITH ARE NOT SHUNNED. If, however, someone unrepentantly practices serious sins, such as a young engaged couple having sexual encounters before their marriage night, they will be disfellowshipped and such an individual is avoided by former fellow-worshipers. Every effort is made to help wrongdoers. But if they are unrepentant, the congregation needs to be protected from their influence. The Bible clearly directs: "Remove the wicked man from among yourselves."
The statement "if they are unrepentant" should also be qualified by saying "if they are judged as unrepentant by a commitee of elder brothers".
This thread has brought much closure too me.I have recently been shunned and I can only feel empathy for my dear mama.She has been pulled once more through the mire of what the GB says...in retrospect I am thankful for the almost 10 years we had as almost REAL blood mama and daughter.She showed me love and shared meals with me,we shopped together.I stayed in her home on yearly visits.This is after being totally shunned from 81-93.She must be so confused and so afraid she has displeased her Jehovah.My heart actually aches for her.
sOOner
