Comprehensive list of misquotes

by JG 19 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • JG
    JG

    Does anyone have or know of a "Full and Complete list of misquotations of the Watchtower" If not would anyone like to help compile this list. I'm sure that we could find someone who would host an article or paper on this subject. I was thinking of a list or paper without any inflamatory wording or language that we could just hand to a JW and they would read without dismissing it as "Full of hate" or appostate etc. I realize we could probably compile a book on the subject but I think if we had say 100 misquotes on various subjects it might sink through.

    IF YOU HAVE TO LIE TO PROVE YOUR POINT

  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas

    I'm not aware of any such compilation.

    A project like this could easily become a book!

    Where would you begin? Old publications or recent? Would you limit yourself to Watchtower and Awake! articles, or include the WTS books?

    It's a good idea.

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    : Does anyone have or know of a "Full and Complete list of misquotations of the Watchtower"

    Compiling such a list would be a monumental task. The society is notorious for not citing specific references to look up and for vaguely identifying its sources using such expressions as "a noted scientist said," or "a famous author stated."

    It took Alan F. many months just to hunt down the lies and misquotes in the Creation book and he didn't go through the whole thing!

    Since there are so few of them, it would be far easier to find the accurate quotes made by the Society than the inaccurate ones.

    Farkel

  • JG
    JG

    I knew it would be a huge task, that's why I was thinking if we cut and pasted to one thread, it would build quickly because there are so many. If anyone does please credit the web site or poster so noones feelings get hurt.
    Sean

  • JG
    JG

    Credited to Runningman
    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=11299&site=3

    On Tuesday, my wife had a talk in the Ministry School. It was taken from
    the Reasoning book and was on the subject of evolution.

    One of her arguments contained a quote from Carl Sagan that seemed to
    support creation. It said:

    "Carl Sagan, in his book Cosmos, candidly acknowledged 'The fossil evidence could
    be consistent with the idea of a great designer.'" - Reasoning from the Scriptures, 1985, p124

    This didn't make any sense to me, since Carl Sagan is well known as an
    evolutionist and athiest. So I looked up the quote. Here is what it really
    said:

    "The fossil evidence could be consistent with the idea of a great designer;
    perhaps some species are destroyed when the Designer becomes dissatisfied
    with them, and new experiments are attempted on an imperfect design.
    But this notion is a little disconcerting. Each plant and animal is exquisitly
    made; should not a supremely competent Designer have been able to make
    the intended variety from the start? The fossil record implies trial and error,
    an inability to anticipate the future, features inconsistent with an efficient
    Great Designer (although not with a designer of a more remote and indirect
    temperment)." - Cosmos, p29

    As you can see, the Society took 1/2 a sentence out of context and used
    it to imply that Carl Sagan said exactly the opposite of what he actually said.

  • RunningMan
    RunningMan

    Here is an article I put together a while ago on the subject. It's a lot easier to read in MS-word format, so if you would like me to e-mail you a copy, let me know. My thanks to countless places from where this stuff was gleaned from and recorded.

    ------

    QUOTATIONS

    Often, the society will quote from secular authorities to back up its stand and logic on matters. If you take the quotes at face value, they can be quite convincing. However, if you take the time to check the sources, you are sometimes surprised.

    1.Authorities quoted are often unqualified.
    2.At times, quotations are selected in very misleading manners. Sometimes they are taken out of context. Other times phrases are extracted from sentences and misrepresented.
    3.Scientific quotations are sometimes outdated, being 50 to 300 years old, with no reference to the age of the document.
    4.Persons quoted have at times spoken out regarding the twisting of their words.

    1. Qualifications of Authorities

    Francis Hitching:
    He is cited as one of the main sources for the Creation book, and is quoted several times in the Gods Word or Mans book.
    The reference work Contemporary Authors (Vol. 103, page 208) lists him as a member of the Society for Psychical Research, the British Society of Dowsers and the American Society of Dowsers. His writings include: Earth Magic; Dowsing: The Psi Connection; Mysterious World: An Atlas of the Unexplained; Fraud, Mischief, and the Supernatural and Instead of Darwin.
    He is a tabloid TV writer, paranormalist and major figure in the dowsing community. He has written on Mayan pyramid energy and for some In Search Of episodes on BBC television. He has no scientific credentials, not even a degree.

    Johannes Greber:
    "It comes as no surprise that one Johannes Greber, a former Catholic clergyman, has become a spiritualist and has published the book entitled Communication with the Spirit World, Its laws and Its Purpose." - w 55 10/1 p603
    So, if they knew he was a spiritist in 1955, why did they continue to quote from him?

    * w61 1/1 30 Was There a Resurrection?
    * "The Word" -- Who Is He? According to John (1962) p.5 [Not available on 1993/1995 CD-ROMs]
    * w62 9/15 p.554
    * Make Sure of All Things: Hold Fast to What is Fine (1965) p. 489 [Not available on 1993/1995 CD-ROMs]
    * Aid to Bible Understanding (1969) p. 1134 [Not available on 1993/1995 CD-ROMs]
    * Aid to Bible Understanding (1969) p. 1669 [Not available on 1993/1995 CD-ROMs]
    * w75 10/15 640 Questions from Readers
    * w76 4/15 231 Insight on the News

    Questions From Readers
     Why, in recent years, has The Watchtower not made use of the translation by the former Catholic priest, Johannes Greber?
    This translator relied on "God's Spirit World" to clarify for him how he should translate difficult passages. It is stated: "His wife, a medium of God's Spirit world was often instrumental in conveying the correct answers from God's Messengers to Pastor Greber." The Watchtower has deemed it improper to make use of a translation that has such a close rapport with spiritism. (Deuteronomy 18:10-12) - w83 4/1 31 Questions From Readers

    John S. Thompson:
    In the 1985 edition of the NWT Interlinear Bible, John S. Thompson is cited as an authority for the translation of John 1:1.
    According to The American Quarterly Review, Sept 1830, Vol 8, p 227, he held many different faiths and experienced spirit voices which bade him to write and translate.

    C. Piazzi Smyth
    He is quoted as a reference in the book Survival into a New Earth, 1984, p 49. The Guide to Edinburghs Popular Observatory describes him like this:
    "Piazzi Smyth had a major obsession with the pseudo-science of pyramidology, which is founded in the belief that the measurements of the Great Pyramid contain a mystical significance. Indeed he was the only person ever to have resigned his fellowship of the Royal Society, following their refusal to publish his pyramid papers."

    Zoologist Coffin:
    "Clearly, the impartial inquirer would be led to conclude that fossils do not support the theory of evolution. On the other hand, fossil evidence does lend strong weight to the arguments for creation. As zoologist Coffin stated: ..." - Creation p70
    Coffin is really a young-earth creationist, and the quote is from an Adventist paper. He has no scientific credentials.

    2. Misleading quotations
    The Quote:
    "Fossil hunter Donald Johanson acknowledged: No one can be sure just what any extinct hominid looked like." - Creation p 89
    What it really said:
    "No one can be sure what any extinct hominid looked like with its skin and hair on. Sizes here are to scale, with afarensis about two feet shorter than the average human being." - Donald C. Johanson and Maitland A. Edey, Lucy - the Beginnings of Humankind, New York: Warner Books, Inc, 1981, p. 286

    The Quote:
    "At this point a reader may begin to understand Dawkins comment in the preface to his book: This book should be read almost as though it were science fiction." - Creation p39
    What it really said:
    "This book should be read almost as though it were science fiction. It is designed to appeal to the imagination. But it is not science fiction: it is science. Cliche or not, stranger than fiction expresses exactly how I feel about the truth." - Richard Dawkins, The Selfish Gene, 1976, p. 9

    The Quote:
    "Zoologist Richard Lewontin said that organisms appear to have been carefully and artfully designed. He views them as the chief evidence of a Supreme Designer." - Creation p 143
    What it really said:
    "The manifest fit between organisms and their environment is a major outcome of evolution.... Life forms are more than simply multiple and diverse, however. Organisms fit remarkably well into the external world in which they live. They have morphologies, physiologies and behaviors that appear to have been carefully and artfully designed to enable each organism to appropriate the world around it for its own life. It was the marvelous fit of organisms to the environment, much more than the great diversity of forms, that was the chief evidence of a Supreme Designer. Darwin realized that if a naturalistic theory of evolution was to be successful, it would have to explain the apparent perfection of organisms and not simply their variation." -Richard C. Lewontin, Adaptation, Scientific American, vol. 239, September 1978, p. 213

    The Quote:
    "Carl Sagan, in his book Cosmos, candidly acknowledged The fossil evidence could be consistent with the idea of a great designer." - Reasoning from the Scriptures, 1985, p124
    What it really said:
    "The fossil evidence sould be consistent with the idea of a great designer; perhaps some species are destroyed when the Designer becomes dissatisfied with them, and new experiments are attempted on an imperfect design. But this notion is a little disconcerting. Each plant and animal is exquisitly made; should not a supremely competent Designer have been able to make the intended variety from the start? The fossil record implies trial and error, an inability to anticipate the future, features inconsistent with an efficient Great Designer (although not with a designer of a more remote and indirect temperment)." - Cosmos, p29

    3. Out of date information presented as current
    Wallace Platt:
    "This geologist, Wallace Platt, also noted that the order of events from the origin of the oceans, to the emergence of land, to the appearance of marine life, and then to birds and mammals is essentially the sequence of the principal divisions of geologic time." - Creation p 36
    Wallace Platt said this in a lecture in 1928. He was a young-earth creationist who discounted all scientific evidence.

    W Sullivan:
    "The hypothesis that life has developed from inorganic matter is, at present, still an article of faith." - Creation p. 52
    The present time is, of course, 1933.

    Jean Baptiste Denys
    "It is of no consequence that the blood is taken into the body through the veins instead of the mouth. Nor does the claim by some that it is not the same as intravenous feeding carry weight. The fact is that it nourishes or sustains the life of the body. In harmony with this is a statement in the book Hemorrhage and Transfusion, by George W. Crile, A.M., M.D., who quotes a letter from Denys, French physician and early researcher in the field of transfusions. It says: In performing transfusion it is nothing else than nourishing by a shorter road than ordinary - that is to say, placing in the veins blood all made in place of taking food which only turns to blood after several changes." (The Watchtower, Sept. 15, 1961, p. 558)
    Jean Baptiste Denys lived in the 1600s.

    4. MISQUOTED PERSONS SPEAK OUT

    Richard Lewontin:
    "But the point of my article, 'Adaptation' in Scientific American, from which these snippets were lifted, was precisely that the 'perfection of organisms' is often illusory and that any attempt to describe organisms as perfectly adapted is destined for serious contradictions. Moreover, the appearance of careful and artful design was taken in the nineteenth century before Darwin as 'the chief evidence of a Supreme Designer.' The past tense of my article ('It was the marvelous fit of organisms to the environment ... that was the chief evidence of Supreme Designer') has been conveniently dropped by creationist [Gary] Parker in his attempt to pass off this ancient doctrine as modern science."
    Lewontin, "Misquoted Scientists Respond," Creation/Evolution, VI, Fall 1981, p. 35.
    Note: Gary Parker is the author of a Seventh Day Adventist book on evolution from which most of the Societys Creation book was copied.

    George Howard:
    "If Kims dating is correct, it would show that in a Pauline MS of the first century, the Tetragram was not used as I suggested. This weakens my theory, at least in regard to the Pauline letters. Whether or not first century manuscripts of the gospels and other writings would follow the pattern of P46 would still be a matter of conjecture... The Jehovahs Witnesses have made too much out of my articles. I do not support their theories." - George Howard, Department of Religion, University of Georgia, July 8, 1988
    Note: Not only has this person been misquoted, but subsequent developments that change his theory are never reported.

    Keiiti Aki:
    "I feel strongly that the seismicity has been stationary for thousands of years. I was trying to convince Jehovahs Witnesses about the stationarity of seismicity, using the data obtained in China for the period 1500 through 1700, but they put only weak emphasis in the published statement... It is clear that they quoted the part they wanted, eliminating my main message." - Professor Keiiti Aki, June 16, 1986, after reading a Watchtower article based on an interview with him.

    Torben Lund:
    What the Watchtower said: "Denmarks minister of health also disagreed with the bad publicity Dans doctors received. He stated that the doctors had done the right thing in respecting Dans mature decision and well-founded faith." (WT 02/01/96 p 15)
    His response: "'I absolutely do not agree with Jehovahs Witnesses brainwashing their young members to get them to refuse blood. On the contrary I find their methods bordering on the criminal, so you can safely say that I have been misquoted.' says Torben Lund." (Ekstra Bladet, Danish newspaper, Jan 25, 1996)

    Edited by - RunningMan on 29 August 2002 15:32:19

    Edited by - RunningMan on 29 August 2002 15:34:41

  • JG
    JG

    From Should You Believe in the Trinity
    Credit to http://www.bible.ca/trinity/trinity-JW-SYBTT-Watchtower-BOOKLET-Should-You-Believe-the-Trinity-EXPOSED-REFUTED-pagan-section.htm

    Critics of the doctrine say that it is not a Bible teaching, one history source even declaring: "The origin of the [Trinity] is entirely pagan."-The Paganism in Our Christianity.

    This source trashes all of Christianity, not just trinity and is a satanic quote! It is the Watchtower "Star Witness" to prove trinity is pagan used several times in this booklet. Click on link for a real eye opener!

    -----------------

    "Beyond the Grasp of Human Reason"

    THIS confusion is widespread. The Encyclopedia Americana notes that the doctrine of the Trinity is considered to be "beyond the grasp of human reason."

    The disciples of Jesus were the humble common people, not the religious leaders

    The full quote is: ""It is held that although the doctrine is beyond the grasp of human reason, it is, like many of the formulations of physical science, not contrary to reason, and may be apprehended (though it may not be comprehended) by the human mind."

    Further, Paul, who wrote 1/2 the New Testament said that the trinity and the incarnation of Jesus "great is the mystery of godliness" 1 Tim 3:1. Peter said of the same Paul, "our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, 16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction" 2 Peter 3:15f.

    ---------------

    Thus, A Dictionary of Religious Knowledge says: "Precisely what that doctrine is, or rather precisely how it is to be explained, Trinitarians are not agreed among themselves."

    A few sentences later, "It is not possible for the human intellect to comprehend fully the divine nature." Lyman is not only talking about the Trinity, but the nature of God in general! Do JW's understand the nature of God? No! But what is worse, Lyman trashes the whole of Christianity, not just the Trinity!

    -------------

    more to come
    sean

  • Quotes
    Quotes

    This has given me an idea for an entirely new section of my Quotes website: Painful WT mis-quotes!

    *Sigh* Yet another item on my To-Do list.

  • JG
    JG

    Quotes,
    I would love it if you did. I love your site and can spend hours on it just looking. If we started submiting them to your E-mail would you put them up?
    Sean

  • Quotes
    Quotes

    JG, I am ALWAYS open to input and suggestions. I am always behind on my To Do list, but I still want those suggestions.

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