Elders and search warrants.....

by hillary_step 20 Replies latest jw friends

  • hillary_step

    Offered without comment........


  • outnfree


    This burned my a$$ some time ago when I first read it. After watching Panorama, I was reminded of it and I think I referenced it in one of my letters to the editor. To me, the Watchtower is advocating obstruction of justice by the local elders, or, at the very least, interfering with a police investigation.

    Notice that a search warrant is issued "to locate evidence in a criminal investigation." How is refusing to turn over such evidence being respectful of the 'superior authorities'? WHY would the local elders wish to keep such evidence to themselves? Why would the Watchtower be afraid to let the trained professionals search for said evidence? Shouldn't Christians want criminals caught and prosecuted? Shouldn't the Witnesses wish their congregations to be "without spot", thus not harboring any criminals?

    Acts 5:29b says: "We must obey God as ruler rather than men."

    WHERE does God say that the elders should even KEEP confidential files? But since they do,

    WHERE does God say that those confidential files should be withheld from peace officers who "stand placed in their relative positions by God." -- Romans 13:1

    AFTER ALL, "those ruling are an object of fear, not to the good deed, but to the bad." -- Romans 13:3

    WHAT BAD DEEDS are the Society and, by extension, the local elders, hiding? "if you are doing what is bad, be in fear: for it is not without purpose that it [God's minister = the superior authorities] bears the sword; for it is God's minister, an avenger to express wrath upon the one practicing what is bad." -- Romans 13:4

    It would seem that the Society IS "in fear"; thus this terribly hypocritical advice to impede the police from doing their jobs while phoning the WT Legal Department for advice.

    Oh, and PLEASE TELL ME, WATCHTOWER, where in the Bible, it tells the elders that withholding records is obeying God? I think you will not find it. I think YOU might be the "men" spoken of at Acts 5:29. All God-fearing elders would do well to OBEY GOD by respecting the superior authorities.

    Vehemently (LOL),


  • hillary_step

    Exactly my feeling,

    The WTS seems to view the State as its enemy, not a 'minister' allowed by God, yet it expects the State to protect and grant it all the rights that were won with the spilt blood of people it views as 'worldlings'. Blatant selfishness, if not hypocrisy unbecoming of the 'only true Christians on earth'.

    Another reason that I posted this was to show that elders are basically set up as soft targets and have very little freedom to use their own initiative or common-sense. The WTS has ordained them as unpaid messenger boys, marionettes that do the bidding of the string-pullers. Many of the problems that exist within congregations are due entirely to the fact that elders cannot act within the confines of their own congregation, but regardless of what they feel about a particular situation they must obey the directives, or face sanctions. The congregation then views the elders as the target, not comprehending that many have made decisions that they may disagree with, borne along by the belief in the WTS bottom line: " We speak for God".

    When something works out well the WTS takes credit, when it works badly, it is the 'untrained clergy', the elders at fault.

    These cunning stunts pile up like compost.


  • metatron

    amen and amen

    Here you see the Watchtower subculture of arrogance nakedly. I'll bet they give
    oral instructions on shredding and perjury - just so nothing gets recorded
    or written down.

    What would blow the roof off this nonsense is if an elder could be prosecuted,
    thrown in jail and lose his home.

    THEN, we could send letters to every elder in the U.S. and warn them

    "This could happen to you"


  • Pathofthorns

    What amazes me is the great lengths they go to protect confidentiality in what might incriminate them legally, while local elders tend to have loose lips and you can find out pretty much whatever you like if you chummy them up enough.

    And they sure don't seem to care about "confidentiality" when the "crime" is potential apostasy and feel the need to warn others in the congregation about associating with you.


  • Simon

    The policeman form the UK in the panorama programme commented that no only were they not helpful but they were obstructive even to the point where he had to threaten that he would arrest them for interfering with justice because of what they were doing!

    They think they are above the law ... it's what can happen when people think they only have to answer to 'god'.

  • blondie

    Hezekiah 34:1: The end justifies the means.

    Is this the scriptural backing for the elders actions?

    I can't think of any elders that would throw their bodies in front of the police trying to get into the KH. Their wives and children maybe.


    WBTS instructions to elders,for keeping the police away from evidence against the WBTS?..Wow!..More and more info comes out about the WBTS every day,and it`s only getting worse...OUTLAW

  • IslandWoman


    The WTS seems to view the State as its enemy,

    The Watchtower has viewed the "State" as its enemy for decades! What you posted was consistent with I have been taught since the early sixties. Nothing new.


  • hillary_step


    Yes, I think we all know this, I was using a figure of speech and not an appeal to grammatical accuracy. For example I could say, "It seems like the Nazi's had no time for the Jews' - something which is quite obvious. I have been around the WTS most of my life also.

    Best - HS

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