U.N. Question

by miner 18 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • miner

    Can someone tell me if there is a clear statement, preferably from the U.N., that shows the WatchTower's dishonesty in this matter?

    Not long ago, I was discussing the U.N. situation with a JW friend. He decided to call the WT legal department in this country. The lawyer there explained that the rules had changed and so when that happened, WT immediately terminated their relationship. Of course he was unable to provide any details as to the nature of the changes.

    I realize for someone wanting to get to the bottom of the situation, it is possible-with a little work-to prove that there were no changes: for example to compare the obligations for NGOs from year to year. However, if we don't dig so deeply, WT says there were changes and UN says there weren't.

    Is there (or could there be) a statement from UN pointing out the false statements of the WT and challenging them to back up their remarks, or has the UN simply dismissed the whole mess, concentrating on more important matters?

  • Sirona


    There are lots of threads discussing the UN which show such evidence.

    Do a forum search on UN and you'll find all the info.


  • avengers


    Dear Ms. XX,

    The procedure for a library pass is the following: the interested party needs to fill out an

    application form and supply a letter of recommendation in support of the research. If the needed

    material is not available in a UN depository library (the list of depository libraries is posted at:

    http://www.un.org/depts/dhl/deplib/countries/ ), the application is approved and sent to UN

    Security. UN Security checks the application and, if approval is granted, instructs the Pass Office

    to issue a library pass for the applicant.

    The issuance of a library pass is independent of NGO status or any other status. There has been

    no change in the library pass policy in general; however, please be advised that, as a

    consequence of the September 11 attacks, no library passes are being issued for the time being

    while the security situation at the UN is being studied.

    Best regards,
    Dana Loytved

    Senior Reference Librarian-UN/SA Reference Desk-United Nations Library, New York
    E-mail: [email protected]

  • avengers
  • hawkaw

    Okay, it is very very very very important that you read over what I am giving you and "rote it" into your head if necessary before you do anything else.

    First off - go here http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=27169&site=3

    This site talks about a Mad Apostate thread on the Watchtower magazine of June 1, 1991 pages 15-20 Their Refuge-A Lie! and the quote by Robert Muller that is used in paragraph 11 of the this WT article. I have actually taken the time and copied and scanned Muller's stuff out of his book. You might notice at the above link that instead of the scanned pages all you will get a message that states "Remote Linking Forbidden".

    Don't panic here are my locations of the scans (remember to put http:// in front of these) of Robert Muller's book:









    Pull the above up on your computer and print them out or save them to your hard drive.


    Now read carefully -


    What you do is take Muller's paragraph that the 1991 Watchtower magazine used, and quote the entire Muller paragraph including the "excluded" sentence to your friend.


    DO NOT give him the WT article - UNDERSTAND - LET HIM go look it up.

    Here let me demonstate -


    Hey thanks for your information on what your Legal department says.

    I see .... so they did join then.

    Interesting. They talked something about rules changing. Wow that is really strange. You know why? Well I phoned up and talked to Paul Hoeffel who heads up the NGO/DPI section at the UN ( (212) 963-8070 ). He told me that the core rules have not changed since 1968 when Resolutions 1296 and 1297 were adopted by the UN for NGOs like the Watchtower who were "accredited" by the UN. That included article 2 in Res. 1296 which indicates the the aims and purposes of all accredited NGOs must be in conformity with the spirit, purpose and prinicples of the UN charter - which by the way was used for war purposes such as the 1950s Korean War). ("Miner" please note: Go here to down load a scan copy of the rules but do NOT send your friend to this web site - got it!!!! its apostate to him - http://www.geocities.com/plowbitch69/resolutions.html )

    ... But you know what, I have also done some searching and have found a June 1, 1991 Watchtower Magazine article called "Their Refuge - A Lie" .... you should read what it says with regards to "any" involvment with the UN. In paragraph 10 it asks a question about how extensive is her [the "Harlot" or false religion's] involvment with the organization [United Nations].

    Then the WT article in paragraph 11 quotes part of this paragraph from Robert Muller's book "New Genesis, Shaping a Global Spirituality".

    "Prayer, meditation and spirituality at the UN are fascinating subjects. All major world religions are accredited to the United Nations as non-governmental organizations. For example, no less than twenty-four Catholic organizations are represented at the UN. Several of the world's religious leaders have visited the international organization. Most memorable were the visits of His Holiness Pope Paul VI during the General Assembly in 1965 and of Pope John Paul II in 1979. Many religions have special invocations, prayers, hymns and services for the United Nations. The most important examples are those of the Catholic, the Unitarian-Universalist, the Baptist and the Bahai faiths. It is a common practice of the Unitarian-Universalists to display the United Nations flag in their houses of worship. So does the Holy Family Church, the parish church of the UN, with its international reliquary and its many religious services and activities catering to world peace and to the international community."

    (Note to Miner: I have highlighted what the WTS quotes in blue and the main sentence that makes the quote stronger but was not quoted in the WT article in red.)

    (Now Miner ask your friend) .... Does it seem to you that this WTS article is very clear that Jehovah is stating that only a false religion would "accredit" itself as an NGO to the UN for any reason including going to the library. Why would they "associate" when the article indicates only false religion would accedit herself with the beast no matter what the rules are?

    (The Miner tell him) I also checked out the Watchtower Dec 1, 1976, page 711 article -"Can an Image Bring Peace and Security"

    These key portions from this 1976 article seem to be:

    ... Do they act like the harlot, "Babylon the Great"?....

    ... Sixteen Catholic international organizations contribute formally to the work of ECOSOC and various Specialized Agencies through the medium of consultative status with these bodies, and Catholic groups and individuals in various countries contribute to the formation of national policy and action with regard to the UN.Vol. 14, p. 423.

    Will all such friendliness with the world be of real benefit to any religious system? No, the Bible declares that Babylon the Great, the harlotrous religious empire, will experience a great shock. Revelation 17:16 says: The ten horns that you saw, and the wild beast, these will hate the harlot and will make her devastated and naked, and will eat up her fleshy parts and will completely burn her with fire.

    So there is real danger in becoming involved with the scarlet-colored wild beast. Never will it bring real peace and security ....

    ... For that reason those who join in any U.N. cry of Peace and security! face disaster, even if they are not in sympathy with Babylon the Great.

    Are you acting in harmony with this advance knowledge? Have you separated yourself from the worlds ways, attitudes and actions?...

    Does this suggest that "becoming involved" for any reason like one of the above 16 Catholic NGOs would be considered by the 1976 Watchtower as acting like the Great Harlot?

    Now Miner, your friend WILL play theocratic war strategy with you and give you the party line. Don't worry about it. AND WHATEVER YOU DO DON"T TELL HIM just ask questions and play real dumb. Remember his mind has got to come to the conclusion not your mind for him and he ahs to start thinking for himself.

    Now he may come back and say Hey!!! the "All major world religions are accredited to the United Nations as non-governmental organizations." is missing from the 1991 WT article and he may make a fuss about that.

    So Miner, your come back is - why is that sentence missing in the WT article. Would not the "inclusion" of the "exclused" sentence make paragraph 11 stronger for us to understand and better answer the question form paragraph 10? I also noticed this article came out the same year as the year the WTS applied for "association". Why would this sentence be missing?

    Finally Miner, besides Randy's site also go here - http://www.geocities.com/plowbitch69 for information. Take a few weeks and learn all about it. Mad Apostate, I and many others (such as Dino) took a lot of time to get this stuff set up for people like you. Use it.

    Now I will be giving you something on the 1998 Awake! magazine shortly. So hold on.


    p.s - the major mistake most people make is that the Watchtower is no longer an NGO. They are wrong. An nongovernmental organization (NGO) is basically a bunch of people who created a not for profit corporation. Thus, the Watchtower becuase it is still a corporation and it is still not for profit was and still is a NGO. What the Watchtower did, as a NGO, was to apply for "acceditation" to the United Nations Department of Public Information (DPI) for an "association" with the UN's DPI in 1991. In February, 1992 a DPI committee "accreditted" the NGO called the Watchtower to have an "assciated" status with the UN's DPI. In October, 2001 the DPI under the request of the Watchtower, "disassociated" the Watchtower from the UN's DPI but the Watchtower, to this day still remains a NGO.


    p.p.s - A major thank you to Mad Apostate (aka Angry XJW)

    Edited by - hawkaw on 9 August 2002 10:52:43

    Edited by - hawkaw on 9 August 2002 11:2:4

    Edited by - hawkaw on 9 August 2002 11:29:15

    Edited by - hawkaw on 9 August 2002 11:35:26

  • hawkaw

    Now Miner, and just as important is the November 22, 1998 Awake! magazine.


    Part of the UN obligation as an "asociated NGO" with DPI was to provide the flock with information that promoted the UN (or the beast). In fact proof is shown by the fact that one of the articles ended up as part of a UN Human Rights collection. My main man Dino found it on the web and I managed to get the article copied from the the library in Switzerland for you guys.

    But more importantly is your presentation of this to your friend.

    Now go to Mad Apostate's thread here:


    What he is telling you is not so much about what articles are in the November 22, 1998 Awake! magazine but what the responses were in the "feedback" in the From our Readers" sections in future Awake! magazines that were published by the Watchtower. You will note there is tons of feedback on all the articles in other publications of the Awake! But when it came to this November 22, 1998 magazine dealing with UN issues and making the UN look good - there are none.

    So the question begs asking - was the November 22, 1998 Awake! magazine put together for UN consumption or for Jehovah's Witnesses consumption.


    p.s. - again thank you to Dino and Mad Apostate

  • Dino

    Hey ole' bud.

    Check your email ASAP.



  • miner

    Thanks to each one of you for your help, esp. Hawkaw for taking time to point out the finer points. And Hawkaw, I understand that you played a quiet, behind-the-scenes role in the Times article. That's HUGE!!! Many thanks for your ongoing efforts to bring a little justice to the boys in Brooklyn...you are an inspiration to us!

  • Farkel


    : DO NOT give him the WT article - UNDERSTAND - LET HIM go look it up.

    LOL! If dubs can't "look it up" in their own literature which hasn't been "altered" by "apostates", but which is in its pristine bullshit condition of lies and deception, it MUST be another lie about them from them dang, pesky apostates!.

    Boy, have you got THEM figured out!


  • plmkrzy

    I haven't been following all the UN threads, There are SOOOOOO many. SO Not sure if anyone has already posted this or not. But Here it is again incase someone has.


    Edited by - plmkrzy on 11 August 2002 23:27:41

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