So a local needs talk was lovingly given at our hall last week that I'm positive targeted me specifically. It had to do with missing meetings for work. They even had a demo on what we should do if our boss asks us to stay overtime on a meeting night (basically say "no" and risk losing your great job which you have no desire whatsoever to lose)... So I'm aware that there's a sort of protocol the elders follow when someone in the hall needs to work on something. First they mention it in the local needs and they go from there. But what happens next if I don't shape up? Will they begin to approach me personally? Would it be good enough for them if I say I go to a different hall to make up the meetings I miss? It doesn't even happen often. Perhaps once or 2x per month on either Thrusdays or Sundays when we have meeting.
Any elders out there? How to Local needs talks work?
by Letts Party 26 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse
-
-
Simon
Local needs is very "passive aggressive". They basically have nothing to charge you with for specifically doing wrong other than "not obeying them enough".
Just shrug it off?
Certainly don't risk rushing back from work in order to meet their meeting deadline.
-
LostGeneration
The topic may be discussed by the whole body or just among the CBOE and the person giving the talk. If it was an actual marking talk then in theory it should have been agreed upon by the whole body.
If the talk was strongly worded, the gist is to get the rest of the congo to informally shun you because of your selfish decision to support yourself and your family instead of attending brainwashing sessions. If its well known that you are the target of the talk, expect your JW social life to drop to near zero, hopefully that won't break your heart!
Sounds to me like the perfect opportunity to "be stumbled" and quit the meetings altogether. If the elders call later, you can say how it really hurt your feelings that they would talk about you like that in front of the whole hall instead of lovingly counseling you in person, privately.
-
OneEyedJoe
Just shrug it off and put a marker in 1 Timothy 5:8 for when they approach you more directly.
-
NVR2L8
Letts Party,
In my congregation an elder would have approached you first to discuss your situation and to provide council. If the situation persisted or if several members were missing meetings because of work, there would be a local needs talk. In my case, I was a MS and missed several meetings due to business trips. When I told the elders I wanted to step down they offered to give me 6 months to settle matters. I told them travel was part of my work and I had no plan to change my career. They were reluctant to accept my resignation as a MS, especially because I was well liked by the brothers and reaching out...I already knew TTATT and this was my first step in fading out. In the past we had a CO who removed any servant who had shift work that would cause them to miss even one meeting a month. He made it clear that your job should never be more important than serving the WT.
-
tornapart
Don't bother about it. What gives them the right to say what you can and can't do with your life? It's YOUR life and you can do with it whatever you choose to do. Why worry about what other people think?
-
Crazyguy
Just have the scripture on hand that says if you don't provide for your family your a piece of shit, then if they push about Jehovah helping you if you put meetings first, remind them that the brothers in the Philippines went to meeting even though a giant cyclone was bearing down on them and Im sure they were told they would be safe in gods house. Yet dispite this counsel from the elders over half of one congregation was killed by the storm that were in the hall. Then walk away.
-
Paralipomenon
Local needs is a "marking talk". They have observed behavior in the congregation that while they can't outright punish them for, but still want to tighten the thumb screws.
Mostly "conscience matters".
So while not saying the person's name directly, they will identify "bad" behavior and give specific examples meant to shame an individual and at that point the elders are to shun the person that was marked. After a local needs talk, the congregation is to look to see who was marked and shun them. When the person falls into place with proper behavior, the elders will make a display of going up and gretting the marked individual and that is a sign for the congregation that they can resume association with them again.
Quote from the super secret elder book 'o death:
Marking Disorderly Ones
1. At times it may be necessary to mark those who display a flagrant disregard for theocratic order though not practicing a grave sin that would result in judicial action. (w99 7/15 pp. 29-31) This could include such things as being grossly lazy or critical or being a profitless talker who is a constant 'meddler with what does not concern him.' (2 Thess. 3:11) It may involve one who schemes to take material advantage of others, indulges in entertainment that is clearly improper, or dates when not legally or Scripturally free.-od p. 150-151.2. If the disorderly conduct is generally unknown to others and poses no threat to their spiritual wellbeing, usually it is best to handle things through admorution and counsel. The elders should not be hasty in giving a warning talk. However! if the individual does not see the error of his way but continues to be an unwholesome influence} a warning talk may be given to the congregation.-2 Thess. 3:6, 14, 15; w99 7/15 pp. 29-31; w85 4/15 pp. 30-31.
• Example-mark for dating an "unbeliever":
The elders should first counsel and try to help a disorderly one. If a person persists in a way that is disturbing and that has the potential
for spreading, they may conclude that there would be reason for a warning talk to be given to the congregation.-2 Cor. 6:14; 2 Thess. 3:11,
14; w99 7/15 p. 3l.• It may be that an individual is dating not an actual (unbeliever' but an unbaptized publisher. In such cases a warning talk may not be needed,
depending on the circumstances, on the attitude of the Christian, on the level of disturbance to the congregation, and other factors. Nonetheless, if he is dating with a view to marrying someone who is unbaptized, he is not obeying the Bible's counsel at 1 Corinthians 7:39 to marry "only in the Lord/' and loving counsel should be given. Elders will use reasonableness and discernment in determining whether a particular situation is suffidently serious and disturbing to require a warning talk. -od pp. IS0-1S1; w04 7/1 pp. 30-31.3. If the disorderly one becomes ashamed of his ways and is moved to change, then as elders of the congregation see the adjustment, they can individually decide to end the limitation they have put on personally sodalizing with him. This will indicate to the congregation that he is no longer marked.
-
Letts Party
NVR2L8
Thank you and everyone else for your answers. I really don't think this local needs talk was a "marking talk" of the kind Paralipomenon mentioned. I'm an MS and someone seemed fazed even one bit by this and everyone, including the elders greeted me warmaly both before and after the meeting as they normally do. I'm not sure that its well known that I was the subject of the talk, but I know it is because the elders had mentioned the issue to me in private in the past.
I wouldn't mind stepping down at all truthfully but I think it might be a little too soon for that.
-
breakfast of champions
When I was a kid/young teen-ish, people were getting DFd left-and-right for "fornication."
How would I know that?
The announcement of the DF was made, and right after - sometimes that very night or a week later -- a "local needs" was given by the PO on fornication.
In fact, this particular PO became known for these guilt-inducing local needs talks. Hell, I hadn't even seen a naked woman or kissed a girl and I felt guilty by the end of these talks.
Funny, though, is that when this PO was eventually DF'd for cheating on his wife, there was no local needs on "adultery."
Local needs exposing your private "sins" if your just a crummy ol' publisher; silence when it's the PO. Funny how that works, eh?
Also funny how the society finds it impossible to warn the congregation that someone was DFd for being a child molester. . . . . We always knew who was fornicating. . .. . .