How to wake up and reverse the trance???

by J-DUBBED 59 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  OneEyedJoe

  Just nice if there was some magic word to say and he'd open his eyes.

  If there where, I suspect this forum would not exist. It sounds like you have a lot of work to do in order to repair your relationship with your son. You telling him that you'd rather he be a drunk/druggy instead of a JW will sound to his ears that you'd rather he be a drunk vs "serving the true god." That's almost certainly a large factor in why you've been shut out. JWs don't normally completely shun non-believing family once they're indoctrinated (though there's usually a significant withdraw). For him to completely shut you out of his life he has decided that you hate him and are persecuting him for his stance to (as he sees it) serve god. Unfortunately, you played right into their hands. New JWs are indoctrinated into expecting persecution from family/friends very soon when they start studying. When family/friends learn of their cult involvement, obviously they'll raise objections - and knowing nothing of cult mind control, they play right into the expectation of persecution. Your objection to your son's joining the cult only reinforced the indoctrination by essentially proving their prediction right. You NEED to make amends for hurting him. Write letters, send emails, call or visit, whatever it takes. You CANNOT attack him or his beliefs, only express concern for his completely withdrawing from his family that loves him.

  From reading your additional posts, I'm going to restate that you absolutely need to read Steven Hassan's books. There's a lot of information there that will help you to fix the root cause of the problem. It sounds like there's a lot that needs to be repaired before you can even begin to undo his indoctrination. This is going to be a long process and will require a ton of work and patience from you.
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  J-DUBBED

  Yeah that's one thing for sure.......In the early stages there was a lot of fighting and arguing. Having nothing to do with JW's then all of a sudden your son is in your face talking all this crap about carrying a card in his wallet to refuse blood transfusions, changing his Religion, lying to him all these years about Easter and Christmas. Just a little too much to swallow. We felt like our son had died and was gone forever. Pretty empty feeling.
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  steve2

  This may seem out of line - and I apologize if I am making unfounded assumptions - but it sounds as though there was a lot of strongly expressed negativity on both sides when your son announced his religious intentions. In this context, he withdrew.

  At some level - and I am being careful how I say this - you do need to accept he has made a decision and, whilst you do not agree with that decision, you need to respect his right as an adult to make it.

  I acknowledge that your wife and you have been terribly upset by his decision - but unless you accept he has made it, all prospects of "opening" his eyes will disappear. No one likes to be told they've made poor decisions so to get any prospect of change, you may need to look at what you said and/or did and recognize that from his point of view, you've offended him (yes, I know, he has also offended you - but if two sides are on a stand-off with both saying the other has to say "Sorry" first, not much is going to happen).

  For example,

  "Son, I acknowledge that when your mother and I first heard about your decision to become a Witness, we may not have reacted in helpful ways. I look back on the arguments we had and wished I had said things differently so you could see how much we love you and want what is best for you. We'd like to meet up with you with an agreement that we try to repair any damage. You are our son. Nothing changes that. We respect you have a right to make your own decisions. Personally, if I have said anything to offend or upset you, I am truly sorry. Love, Dad".
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  J-DUBBED

  For example, "Son, I acknowledge that when your mother and I first heard about your decision to become a Witness, we may not have reacted in helpful ways. I look back on the arguments we had and wished I had said things differently so you could see how much we love you and want what is best for you. We'd like to meet up with you with an agreement that we try to repair any damage. You are our son. Nothing changes that. We respect you have a right to make your own decisions. Personally, if I have said anything to offend or upset you, I am truly sorry. Love, Dad".

  Wow steve2.......You should be a Dr.

  Thanks for the reply.

  We don't know what to do and haven't for four years.
• 

  steve2

  Thanks too J-DUBBED. It sounds like you're really wanting to mend fences with your son but are uncertain about what that would involve if you were to take steps to try to do so.

  I really feel for the situation you and your wife are in - and hope that, over time, there is an easing of the stand-off.

  Among the many trends that occur among those in the organization is a 'cooling off' as time passes and expectations about 'the end' do not occur. This can lead to lots of soul-searching and doubting among even faithful Witnesses. Often it's more powerful for people to come to this sort of opening of the eyes realization themselves because if you try to show them, something about human nature makes them dig in and defend the religion even more.
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  J-DUBBED

  Son, I acknowledge that when your mother and I first heard about your decision to become a Witness, we may not have reacted in helpful ways. I look back on the arguments we had and wished I had said things differently so you could see how much we love you and want what is best for you. We'd like to meet up with you with an agreement that we try to repair any damage. You are our son. Nothing changes that. We respect you have a right to make your own decisions. Personally, if I have said anything to offend or upset you, I am truly sorry. Love, Dad

  Yes I E-Mailed this exact reply to him. He did reply back on a good sounding note but don't know what's next.
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  MissFit

  ((((J dubbed and Mrs. Jdubbed)))your love for your son really shines through.

  I find it so heart warming that you were able to get advice here and be willing to apply it.

  I hope things will improve between you and your son.

  You will find many helpful insights and suggestions here.

  Many here are "born ins " who can give you first hand in-depth knowledge of the way JWs think and how to avoid triggering the "cult personality".

  Miss Fit

  Edit to say: Great job steve. I always appreciate your thoughtful, balanced posts.
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  J-DUBBED

  Many here are "born ins " who can give you first hand in-depth knowledge of the way JWs think and how to avoid triggering the "cult personality".

  Yes all we need to know is how to "Un-trigger" his "Cult Personality"
• 

  J-DUBBED

  Well.....what to do now??

  Our son phoned me this morning asking if we want to come over for a coffee. I didn't know how to respond, it's been four years since any real conversation or visit. I said we would like to see YOU, I'll let you know.

  We don't really want to see or be in the same room as his Darling J-Dub Bride......So I don't want to go to his place. How do you tell him without pissing him off, that he should come to our place alone without his J-Dub Bride.

  Any opinions on how to approach this would be appreciated.

  Thanks.
• 

  ruderedhead

  Umm, no ,J-DUBBED, as much as you resent your jw daughter in law, you cannot tell him you don't want to be in her presence.That will negate the apology in the email,and set off a shit storm from hell, my friend! You will lose him. She has the control here for now. She sleeps with him, she has his ear.

  You can ASK if just the 3 of you can have a chat right now, since it's been a while, and you would like to make things right with him first. Tell him you look forward to getting to know his wife better and would like to take them out to dinner in the next week or two,whenever it's good for them. Name a restaurant if you want, ask where they would like to go. Follow through.

  If he says no, she comes, accept it. Please do the reading on combatting cult mind control that others have recommended here before you meet, or at least as much as you can. That may help you avoid any mis-steps that will send him running again. You have 2 ears & 1 mouth for a reason. The first few times you meet, LISTEN. That will help you know where he's coming from. When you meet with them both, you should be able to see who's in control, and that should help you know how to proceed. Be kind, be accepting, he's an adult who has made an adult decision. With love and patience, you may be able to wakehim up, but you better know what your talking about. jw's are very good at cherry picking scripture and taking control of conversations, and threatening to stop them if "all you want to do is argue" meaning that you are able to show them something that contradicts their beliefs, and you have to know how to handle that.

  I am curious, tho, about the whole Easter Bunny/Santa thing. Did he still believe at 25? Shouldn't he have been over it by then?